Seems we were right about Scott Harrison all along

[silkov]

Well, I'm not a junkie or anything. Like a huge swathe of the population in this country, I like a bit of nose now and again, have the odd spliff with a bottle of wine, and occasionally (though rarely now) have a E.

Cocaine will bring out the worst in people. If you are an aggressive person already, it will bring out that aggression in you. I personally am not an aggressive person, unless provoked to extremes, and so it's not a problem.

Someone like Harrison however, obviously has an addictive personality trait, and is probably unable to control his habits. Interestingly Cocaine is not at all physically addictive, but is incredibly powerful nontheless, as it acts on an extremely powerful and primitive level with the brain chemistry, making it fantastically psychologically addictive, it acts on dopamine, which is the chemical responsible for us feeling 'pleasure' obviously a very very powerful and very ancient evolutionary chemical pathway.

This is why Cocaine is so dangerous for people with compulsive or addictive personality disorders, it's feeding into a very basic mechanism, and it's a cycle which can be very hard to get out of.

Having said all that, if you can handle it, it's a laugh now and then.

Thank you, the voice of reason. I would suggest Rhino222 get out a bit more.

Mote than 1 million es are consumend every weekend in the UK, and goodness knows how much charlie.

One third of ALL people in the UK (incl OAPS etc ) have taken drugs.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4229470.stm

As to violence - drink is by far the most dangerous, not to mention taking risks...

I mean how many E heads have ever been into a fight when on a pill?

The fact that so many people are taking drugs though doesnt make it right or a good thing, I find it very disturbing to be honest that so many think nothing about taking coke, a spliff or an E... I think its an indictement of the modern day world when so many people feel the need to use drugs in order to be able to relax or feel happy. I've always been very open minded about drugs and grew up reading about the 60s and all that stuff, but over the years I've seen many friends and aquaintances fall victim to them, many of them thought that they could 'handle it' and indeed did so for quite a while, but then when it catches up with you and you can't handle it so easily anymore then its often too late... personally I find all drugs a sad and tawdry buisness now, full of people deluding themselves that there having a great time and that theyre in control, but your not in control with drugs... after all thats the whole point of taking them in the first place isnt it??...

[revporl]

I used to go out with someone who was well into going out clubbing, taking E's etc. I had a brief fling with her again a few years later and her personality had changed quite dramatically, suffering from massive mood swings and aggression, even when she wasn't on anything.
Coke makes nice people tedious and borish, booze can turn gentlemen into animals but we tolerate it cos its legal and part of our culture. I reserve judgement about weed, you hear lots of awful tales about youngsters going mental on it these days (and you never used to), but in my experience it seems quite benign as drugs go.

[silkov]

I've smoked weed for a decade or more (I'm from Manchester so it is de rigeur) and it has not been a gateway of any sort. I've never tried sniff and never smoked cigs. I say to each his own. What do you want to do Silkov? Ban everything? Start with booze first, there is nothing quite as low as a really bad piss-pot.

You can control yourself with certain drugs. People who deny this may be fearful of their own capacity to relax and unwinding (preferably with a big spill).

E's I'm not sure about. Years ago I house-shared and my two housemates took E's whilst sitting around watching boxing and would go into double-figures some nights. One night they decided to put on Scottish ginger wigs and ran around the estate shouting. I say to each his own but after that night cut down the supply-line

As for Harrison if the daily grind of being paid to do the sport you should love cannot make him happy nothing will. He can drink when he retires, there are plenty of boxing dinner-shows around the country. Work then live.

People should be looking at why they need drugs so much, I'm not into banning people from living but I've seen first hand the damage done by drugs. A lot of the drugs laws are hypocritical, the government softened on weed despite evidence that it can cause mental illness, but they have a nice number in on the spot fines for users and people who use it as a pain reliever are still being treated like crinimals. Weed has its uses, especially for people with certain illnesses, but the more you use it the more likely you are to suffer mental illness such as depression, I know several people who had their mental illness set off just by short term use of dope and theres nothing sadder than seeing someone who was once bright and intelligent become a shambling wreck hardly able to hold a conversation!...

[Lenny]

To be honest the worst thing imo about drugs aren't the effects they have on the people who use them but the effects they have on the countries that grow them.

The fact that Scott Harrison has decided to take drugs that make him even more of a c#nt doesn't really bother me

[Chesney_Chambers]

course he needs help.......but why should our taxes be used to help the pudendum. drug users are the scum of the earth...

they assault, they steal...etc etc

Get a grip of yourself Rhino

Alcohol is a drug, nicotine is a drug, Caffeine is a drug....are these users 'scum of the earth'?

You cant accurately describe all drug users as 'scum of the earth', alot of smackheads and crackheads are, but somebody who takes a few pills and dances the Saturday night away or somebody who smokes a few spliffs on his settee on a night can't be described as scum of the earth, well no more so than anyone who enjoys a pint

[silkov]

course he needs help.......but why should our taxes be used to help the pudendum. drug users are the scum of the earth...

they assault, they steal...etc etc

Alcohol is a drug, nicotine is a drug, Caffeine is a drug....are these users 'scum of the earth'?

You cant accurately describe all drug users as 'scum of the earth', alot of smackheads and crackheads are, but somebody who takes a few pills and dances the Saturday night away or somebody who smokes a few spliffs on his settee on a night can't be described as scum of the earth, well no more so than anyone who enjoys a pint

A lot of the drinkers alone behave like scum, you only need to go around town most nights to see that the whole thing (use of drugs/alcohol) is out of control... I've never seen anyone beat someone up because theyve had 5 cups of tea though!...

[Chesney_Chambers]

course he needs help.......but why should our taxes be used to help the pudendum. drug users are the scum of the earth...

they assault, they steal...etc etc

Alcohol is a drug, nicotine is a drug, Caffeine is a drug....are these users 'scum of the earth'?

You cant accurately describe all drug users as 'scum of the earth', alot of smackheads and crackheads are, but somebody who takes a few pills and dances the Saturday night away or somebody who smokes a few spliffs on his settee on a night can't be described as scum of the earth, well no more so than anyone who enjoys a pint

A lot of the drinkers alone behave like scum, you only need to go around town most nights to see that the whole thing (use of drugs/alcohol) is out of control... I've never seen anyone beat someone up because theyve had 5 cups of tea though!...

I've never seen anyone beat someone up because they've had a handful of pills and I've never seen anybody beat someone up because they're stoned.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Well, I'm not a junkie or anything. Like a huge swathe of the population in this country, I like a bit of nose now and again, have the odd spliff with a bottle of wine, and occasionally (though rarely now) have a E.

Cocaine will bring out the worst in people. If you are an aggressive person already, it will bring out that aggression in you. I personally am not an aggressive person, unless provoked to extremes, and so it's not a problem.

Someone like Harrison however, obviously has an addictive personality trait, and is probably unable to control his habits. Interestingly Cocaine is not at all physically addictive, but is incredibly powerful nontheless, as it acts on an extremely powerful and primitive level with the brain chemistry, making it fantastically psychologically addictive, it acts on dopamine, which is the chemical responsible for us feeling 'pleasure' obviously a very very powerful and very ancient evolutionary chemical pathway.

This is why Cocaine is so dangerous for people with compulsive or addictive personality disorders, it's feeding into a very basic mechanism, and it's a cycle which can be very hard to get out of.

Having said all that, if you can handle it, it's a laugh now and then.

Thank you, the voice of reason. I would suggest Rhino222 get out a bit more.

Mote than 1 million es are consumend every weekend in the UK, and goodness knows how much charlie.

One third of ALL people in the UK (incl OAPS etc ) have taken drugs.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4229470.stm

As to violence - drink is by far the most dangerous, not to mention taking risks...

I mean how many E heads have ever been into a fight when on a pill?

The fact that so many people are taking drugs though doesnt make it right or a good thing, I find it very disturbing to be honest that so many think nothing about taking coke, a spliff or an E... I think its an indictement of the modern day world when so many people feel the need to use drugs in order to be able to relax or feel happy. I've always been very open minded about drugs and grew up reading about the 60s and all that stuff, but over the years I've seen many friends and aquaintances fall victim to them, many of them thought that they could 'handle it' and indeed did so for quite a while, but then when it catches up with you and you can't handle it so easily anymore then its often too late... personally I find all drugs a sad and tawdry buisness now, full of people deluding themselves that there having a great time and that theyre in control, but your not in control with drugs... after all thats the whole point of taking them in the first place isnt it??...

I'm afraid Silkov, you're talking cobblers here.

Different strokes for different folks. Some drugs are about losing control, whilst others enable you to concentrate. Cocaine and Amphetamines (I don't do the latter) are fantastic for your memory and concentration, they are performance enhances in many ways in the short term, which is why they are banned substances in sports.

LSD however, is a drug you most certainly are NOT in control on, and in fact trying to be in control is likely to be a bad experience.

As for drug use, it's been going on for thousands of years, the only difference now is that they are cheap and widespread, as opposed to being something only taken by rich people at posh parties. Cocaine use was absolutely rife in the 1930's, as was Laudanum since the 1800's.

People have ALWAYS used drugs to unwind, celebrate and engage in cultural rituals, beer has been around for an estimate 8000 years in one form or another, and every continent has it's own indiginous form of fermented drink which contains alcohol. During the time of the Pharoah's the pyramid workers were often paid in beer, and at the end of each days construction would gather together with their masters to get smashed (contrary to popular belief they were not all slaves at all, many were skilled craftsmen drawn from the empire).

Of course, abusing drugs heavily is not advisable, who wants to have a heart attack in their late 30's and be wheezing like an accordian in their 40's? however, drugs are here to stay, and it's a matter of personal choice. There are those who are extremely vulnerable to the effects of drugs, and are predisposed to getting addicted and getting out of control, and for those people, we have to have support services to try and get them back on their feet.

I however, am not one of those. I do coke when I feel like getting fucked up, smoke a joint once or twice a week, and like a drink. I also cycle 12 miles a day, eat good food, and generally try and look after myself. That's my choice, and for a 35 year old, I'm certainly not doing badly at all.

However, one thing I do find, is that people who take their drug of choice, seem to be a hell of a lot more open minded than people who are abstainers, who seem to feel it is their place to cast judgement on drug use, despite often having no experience of it themselves.

As Oscar Wilde said, "never trust anyone with no vices," I tend to agree, some of the most perverted people are those with no outlets, you know the type, pillar of the community, devout christian, model citizen....turns out he's been buggering little boys for 35 years in his home town, shitsville ohio.

[overhand_right]

Agree binge drinking is real bad. Look at any city centre in the UK on a saturday night, we must be the shame of Europe. As for the weed, coke, tablets et al, if you want to spend your money on that stuff, fine, your body & your life. Over a period of time the effects on mental and physical health are serious and life shortening.

I'll stick to my water, healthy eating and fitness thanks!

[jamesmcdonnell]

I used to go out with someone who was well into going out clubbing, taking E's etc. I had a brief fling with her again a few years later and her personality had changed quite dramatically, suffering from massive mood swings and aggression, even when she wasn't on anything.
Coke makes nice people tedious and borish, booze can turn gentlemen into animals but we tolerate it cos its legal and part of our culture. I reserve judgement about weed, you hear lots of awful tales about youngsters going mental on it these days (and you never used to), but in my experience it seems quite benign as drugs go.

Maybe she was on the rag the second time

Coke seems to be a drinkers drug, they go like smoking and coffee.

Sadly true, Booze and Cocaine go together like two love-struck teenagers. The times I do coke, tend to be when I've had a bit of a shirtfull and fancy a lift. Booze is much more the catalyst as I never do coke unless I've had a drink, unless I'm planning a big night in advance.

[Chesney_Chambers]

People should be looking at why they need drugs so much, I'm not into banning people from living but I've seen first hand the damage done by drugs. A lot of the drugs laws are hypocritical, the government softened on weed despite evidence that it can cause mental illness, but they have a nice number in on the spot fines for users and people who use it as a pain reliever are still being treated like crinimals. Weed has its uses, especially for people with certain illnesses, but the more you use it the more likely you are to suffer mental illness such as depression, I know several people who had their mental illness set off just by short term use of dope and theres nothing sadder than seeing someone who was once bright and intelligent become a shambling wreck hardly able to hold a conversation!...

Do you ever drink alcohol Silkov?

[KOJOE90]

As for the weed, coke, tablets et al, if you want to spend your money on that stuff, fine, your body & your life.

But where do some of these people get their money from for there drugs? Crime that's the problem then everyone suffers.

People can put in their body what they want as long as they pay for it out of there own pocket and not other peoples.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I buy me own drugs with my wages.

I'm sorry, but most people who take coke and pills buy them it's recreational, a load of my mates work in the city, and they spend a bloody fortune on coke, they don't go around nicking shit to buy it, cos they don't need too, and none of them are hopeless cocaine addicts either.

It's usually hard core crackheads and heroin addicts who are out selling their nan's/neighbours fridge/dog for the next hit.

[Chesney_Chambers]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

[JC]

I can only speak form personal experience I've never tried smack or crack but have tried pretty much all the "recreational drugs" and still take coke and pills sometimes. As far as mood swings and personality changes go, in my experience if your happy and your life is in order you're fine if you're already depressed or over-stressed they can make it worse, but exactly the same is true of alcohol.

The mistake the anti-drug campaigns is emphasising the worst possible outcome rather than giving people the actual facts and trusting them make a rational choice.

For example when they want to warn kids of pills they wheel out the parents of someone who died on them to tell everyone "it can happen to you on the first time!" which is true but the risk is tiny, it's like telling people not to smoke incase they catch on fire. Any TV show which covers the subject seems to show someone trying a line of coke one week and then selling themselves on the street the next. Just removes all credibility amongst the people it's aimed at and whips up hysteria amongst everyone else.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Pharmaceutical grade heroin (which is actually used as a palliative medicine in terminal cases alongside morphine, it's derivative), is also significantly cheaper than mopping up the mess caused by junkies trying to scrape together enough money to buy a 20 quid hit that lasts them an afternoon.

If you accept that people are going to do drugs, and it is virtually impossible to stop drugs entering the country (which it is), and equally as difficult to stop people buying them and doing them, then the argument for state control is very persuasive.

If the state allowed the sale of drugs over the counter (not heroin and crack as they are too powerfully addictive), as used to be the case until the early 20th century, then the duty imposed on it would benefit the exchequer, rather than the same money going to the black market, and to people who also deal in arms, human trafikking and prostitution.

The black market in drugs would be effectively wiped out, as the state legalised supply, would be significantly cheaper than the hugely inflated prices for drugs, which have a mark up placed on them at every stage of transit all the way to the small time dealer at the end making his 10 quid on a gramme of coke.

A pound of cocaine costs as much as a pound of sugar to produce at source, but is worth in excess of £10,000 when it arrives on our shores. That's some markup, and the money is going to the people who smuggle it into the country who are major players in crime syndicates who thrive on drug money and counterfeiting.

Far better we pay the people who produce it a fair whack, and treat it like any other commodity, and that the money generated on taxation can be used to treat the problems drug use brings, than bury our head in the sands and pretend that the 'war on drugs' is one which can be won in any shape form or fashion.

[overhand_right]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, ????

Feck that, i pay enough tax for societys shit without paying out for heroin for god damn bums as well. Lock them up & let them go cold turkey for all i care.

May sound extreme but im not some softy left wing tree hugger and i struggle to get by on my money as it is.

[jamesmcdonnell]

You're paying far more to have them locked up, do you know how much it costs per prisoner in this country per year, something like 50,000 a year!

Cheaper and more sensible to give them access to what they want on the state and try and wean them off it at the same time don't you think?

There's nothing bleeding heart liberal about this, it's pure pragmatism.

[Neri]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

The problem with this idea and I'm sure the goverment have raised this, is that whose to say the heroin addict doesn't go and claim his free heroin fix supplied by the NHS and then still goes out robbing people to feed for more drug money?

[Chesney_Chambers]

I buy me own drugs with my wages.

I'm sorry, but most people who take coke and pills buy them it's recreational, a load of my mates work in the city, and they spend a bloody fortune on coke, they don't go around nicking shit to buy it, cos they don't need too, and none of them are hopeless cocaine addicts either.

It's usually hard core crackheads and heroin addicts who are out selling their nan's/neighbours fridge/dog for the next hit.

I reckon 99.9% of soft drug users (pot, pills, coke, speed etc) don't need to rob to feed their addiction in the same way that 99.9% of the population don't need to rob to pay for a pint at the local boozer.

Drugs are not soley for the use of the idle and the unemployed, they surface in EVERY walk of life and its about time the government modernised the laws instead of pretending that it's not happening.

We've had a war on drugs for the last 20 years or so, but the prices of drugs have come down 10 fold in alot of cases and they're becoming more widespreadly used than ever. Drugs are a part of every day life, a massive majority of people in the UK have admitted taking them, but the government still insist that they're bad because of the 'high-profile minority' of drug users who do thieve to get their drugs.

Gambling laws are being relaxed despite the fact that the number 'high-profile minority' gambling addicts who thieve to feed their addiction will increase.

[Chesney_Chambers]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

The problem with this idea and I'm sure the goverment have raised this, is that whose to say the heroin addict doesn't go and claim his free heroin fix supplied by the NHS and then still goes out robbing people to feed for more drug money?

If they're supplied with enough in the first place they wouldn't need to go and rob as well.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

The problem with this idea and I'm sure the goverment have raised this, is that whose to say the heroin addict doesn't go and claim his free heroin fix supplied by the NHS and then still goes out robbing people to feed for more drug money?

Why would they need to? Heroin is a physically addictive drug, if you've sated yourself, you won't need more. Heroin isn't like Coke or Pills, if you do too much Smack, you'll end up killing yourself, and lying in a semi-cataleptic state doesn't really lend itself to going out nicking stuff. It's when someone is absolutely busting for a fix due to physical withdrawal that they will do almost anything to get their hit.

I was robbed of 400 quid by my mate's junkie sister once, had she been given some by the local GP, my money would have still been in my wallet.

[Neri]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

The problem with this idea and I'm sure the goverment have raised this, is that whose to say the heroin addict doesn't go and claim his free heroin fix supplied by the NHS and then still goes out robbing people to feed for more drug money?

If they're supplied with enough in the first place they wouldn't need to go and rob as well.

What is enough heroin? I have no idea. I'm sure the NHS would not have an unlimited heroin supply for every single crackhead. There would have to be maximum amounts allowable, this is where the drug dealer comes back into the picture.

[jamesmcdonnell]

It would absolutely destroy the black market trade in Heroin if the state were buying in supplies direct from phamaceutical companies, belive me.

[Neri]

Heroine addicts should be given their drugs for free on the NHS, it makes alot more sense in the long run than 'forcing' the smackhead to rob and mug people to get the money for his drugs. I believe Switzerland, Germany and Portugal use similar schemes

Some people might think that its going easy on the addicts, but heroine addicts are going to get their drugs one way or another, they may as well be government registered and let the NHS (or whoever) dish out the drugs rather than them get their money by mugging my Nan or by robbing my £300 stereo and selling it for £20. Councilling and assistance to get off the drug could also be supplied at the hospital for any that want to getthemselves off it

The way the government is approaching the problem (i.e. by doing fcuk all) is more damaging to the general public and society as a whole than it is for the addict.

I wonder what perecentage of our vastly over-populated prisons are populated by people robbing by necessity to feed their addictions????

The problem with this idea and I'm sure the goverment have raised this, is that whose to say the heroin addict doesn't go and claim his free heroin fix supplied by the NHS and then still goes out robbing people to feed for more drug money?

Why would they need to? Heroin is a physically addictive drug, if you've sated yourself, you won't need more. Heroin isn't like Coke or Pills, if you do too much Smack, you'll end up killing yourself, and lying in a semi-cataleptic state doesn't really lend itself to going out nicking stuff. It's when someone is absolutely busting for a fix due to physical withdrawal that they will do almost anything to get their hit.

I was robbed of 400 quid by my mate's junkie sister once, had she been given some by the local GP, my money would have still been in my wallet.

I always assumed Heroin was addictive, where the addict wants more and more that's why I assumed after the NHS fix has been handed out for the day they would need to get another fix from elsewhere ?