The Black Foursome of the Teens: Jack Johnson, Joe Jennette, Sam McVey and Sam Langsford
02.04.07 - By Sam Gregory: At the turn of the 20th century four of the greatest boxers to ever set foot in the ring came to be known as “The Black Foursome of the Teens.” Those four fighters will forever be remembered at the height of pugilistic history. The four fighters are heavyweights Joe Jennette, Jack Johnson, Sam McVey and possibly greatest of the four, Sam Langford.
Sam Langford is considered one of the greatest fighters to ever set foot in the ring from any era. He fought successfully against fighters in every weight class from lightweight to heavyweight. Like so many other great black fighters that happened to be born at that time, very few were given the chance to fight for a title; Langford was no exception. Langford was born on March 4, 1883 in Nova Scotia. Standing only five feet seven inches tall, in his 21 year boxing career Langford fluctuated in weight between 139 and 204 pounds.
Known as the “Boston Bonecrusher” in his more than 290 pro bouts he would fight anyone at any weight, sometimes being outweighed by as much as 50 pounds or more.
Within 18 months of his first professional fight, Langford beat lightweight world champion Joe Gans. Two weeks later Langford fought welterweight champion Jack Blackburn at a “catch weight” of 142 pounds. The catch-weight was so that even if Langford won the fight there would be no chance of him winning Blackburn’s title.
On December 25, 1905 Langford fought the first of thirteen fights against heavyweight Joe Jennette. Losing the first bout by an 8th round TKO, the two men went on to fight to several draws until finally in December of 1913; Langford beat Jennette in a 20 round decision.
Langford also fought heavyweight champion Jack Johnson in 1906. It took Johnson 15 rounds to beat his much smaller adversary. After the fight Johnson told the media it would be the last time he would fight Langford; Johnson said, “It was too hard and took to long to get this title to take a chance of losing it to Langford.”
Jack Johnson fought for fourteen years before he was given a chance to fight for the heavyweight title. Having pursued the current heavyweight champion at the time Tommy Burns literally around the world, Johnson finally got his chance to fight Burns on December 26, 1908. Johnson finally caught up with Burns in Australia in 1908. The heavyweight championship fight was held at Rushcutter’s Bay in Sydney, Australia.
Had it not been for the fact that the Canadian born Burns was guaranteed $30,000 to take the fight it in most probability never would have happened.
Johnson went on to give Burns a beating for fourteen rounds until the police stepped in to stop the fight. It was that day in Australia, December 26, 1908 that the first black heavyweight champion of the world was crowned. The title belonged to Johnson and every promoter in the U.S. was looking for “The Great White Hope” to get the title back in the hands of a white man. Johnson earned his title fighting many of the all time greats to get it. Among those he fought were, Sam Langford, Joe Jennette, he kayoed the great Bob Fitzsimmons in 2 rounds. When he won the title from Burns he defended it against Philadelphia Jack O’ Brien, Stanley Ketchel and the great James J. Jefferies who came out of a six year retirement and lost over 100 pounds to get in shape to fight Johnson for the title. None of the above was successful at taking the title from Johnson.
Finally in April of 1915, after 26 rounds in the brutal heat of Havana, Cuba, Jess Willard knocked Jack Johnson out to win the heavyweight title.
Supposedly Johnson was knocked unconscious in the 26th round. Rumor has it that Johnson threw the fight; the last picture of the fight was of Johnson flat on his back…shielding his eyes from the sun, hardly the act of a man who was knocked unconscious.
As I mentioned before, if you were born black in the era these fighters fought the chances of getting a title fight were slim to none. Many of these fighters fought each other repeatedly just to get a fight in order to make enough money to support their families. This was the situation for the third member of “The Black Foursome of the Teens” Joe Jennette. Just like the fighter he most admired, Sam Langford, Jennette was allowed to fight title holders but usually written into their contract was a clause barring them from winning a title. Jennette was a typical example of one of the many great black fighters having to fight one another. He fought Sam Langford fifteen times, Sam McVey, (another one of the great foursome) five times. He also had several fights with ring greats, Morris Harris (4), Black Bill (10), Battling Jim Johnson (9), and Hall-of-Fame fighter Harry Wills 3 times.
Many of these fighters went to Europe to fight where they had a much better chance of being treated fair financially. Of the five fights Joe Jennette fought Sam McVey; they fought two of the fights in Paris. In February of 1909.they met for the second time according to most records. In that fight the two gave what came to be called a lackluster performance as the fans let their opinion known after the fight by throwing programs and other garbage in the ring. Both fighters decided to give the fans another bout two months later. The two fighters agreed to fight a ring battle with no round limits. The resulting fight turned out to be one of the greatest boxing marathons in pugilistic history. McVey scored a total of 27 knockdowns in the fight. Jennette made a miraculous comeback in the 19th round and seized control of the fight. As the fight reached the 40 round mark, Jennette clearly controlled the fight but still wasn’t able to finish off McVey.
Finally, after 49 grueling rounds, McVey couldn’t continue and Jennette won the fight.
The fourth member of “The Black Foursome” was Sam McVey. As a heavyweight fighter, McVey was a strong, durable fighter who possessed considerable brute strength.
McVey fought mostly “Name” black fighters during his 19 year career. McVey did win what was called the “Colored Heavyweight Championship of the World.” He won the title by beating Jack Johnson in 1903 before Johnson won the legitimate heavyweight title from Tommy Burns in 1908.
McVey was born on 1884 in Waelder, Texas. He stood just shy of six feet tall and weighed right around 205-215 pounds. McVey not unlike other black fighters of his era was limited to fighting only other black athletes.
McVey like the other three repetitiously fought the same men over and over. Having fought the best of the group Sam Langford no less than 15 times, he also fought in marathon fights, some up to 50 rounds.
As I conclude this story of four of the greatest boxers in the history of the sport, one can only imagine how far such great athletes might have gone in their sport if they had been born in a different era. These were four of the greatest boxers in any era of the sport.
There's an error about McVey beating Jack Johnson in 1903 for the color heavyweight title is not true because McVey never beat Johnson in all of their 3 meetings before Johnson won the world heavyweight title from Tommy Burns. McVey actually won the color heavyweight title from Joe Jeannette after Johnson won the world heavyweight title.
The Black Foursome of the Teens error
<B>Is this a parody,
Or did you post it seriously?</b>
The Black Foursome of the Teens: Jack Johnson, Joe Jennette, Sam McVey and Sam Langsford
02.04.07 - By Sam Gregory:
"Langford fought welterweight champion Jack Blackburn at a “catch weight” of 142 pounds. The catch-weight was so that even if Langford won the fight there would be no chance of him winning Blackburn’s title."
Blackburn never held the welterweight title.
Langford also fought heavyweight champion Jack Johnson in 1906. It took Johnson 15 rounds to beat his much smaller adversary. After the fight Johnson told the media it would be the last time he would fight Langford; Johnson said, “It was too hard and took to long to get this title to take a chance of losing it to Langford.”
Johnson WAS NOT heavyweight champion when he fought Langford.
And our modern day boxing "expert" even manufactures a false "quote" from Johnson.
”Jack Johnson fought for fourteen years before he was given a chance to fight for the heavyweight title.”
<B>Sam Langford fought for TWENTY THREE years, HIS ENTIRE CAREER, without getting a chance at the heavyweight title because Jack Johnson refused to defend his title against Langford, despite the fact that Langford was by far the most dangerous challenger for his title.</b>
”As I mentioned before, if you were born black in the era these fighters fought the chances of getting a title fight were slim to none. “
<B>Just ask Sam Langford.</b>
"Joe Jennette"
Learn to spell his name right ---JEANNETTE
"Langford . . . Known as the “Boston Bonecrusher” "
Langford's knickname was the Boston Tarbaby.
Modern day boxing “expertise” in all its glory on display here.
Or did you post it seriously?</b>
The Black Foursome of the Teens: Jack Johnson, Joe Jennette, Sam McVey and Sam Langsford
02.04.07 - By Sam Gregory:
"Langford fought welterweight champion Jack Blackburn at a “catch weight” of 142 pounds. The catch-weight was so that even if Langford won the fight there would be no chance of him winning Blackburn’s title."
Blackburn never held the welterweight title.
Langford also fought heavyweight champion Jack Johnson in 1906. It took Johnson 15 rounds to beat his much smaller adversary. After the fight Johnson told the media it would be the last time he would fight Langford; Johnson said, “It was too hard and took to long to get this title to take a chance of losing it to Langford.”
Johnson WAS NOT heavyweight champion when he fought Langford.
And our modern day boxing "expert" even manufactures a false "quote" from Johnson.
”Jack Johnson fought for fourteen years before he was given a chance to fight for the heavyweight title.”
<B>Sam Langford fought for TWENTY THREE years, HIS ENTIRE CAREER, without getting a chance at the heavyweight title because Jack Johnson refused to defend his title against Langford, despite the fact that Langford was by far the most dangerous challenger for his title.</b>
”As I mentioned before, if you were born black in the era these fighters fought the chances of getting a title fight were slim to none. “
<B>Just ask Sam Langford.</b>
"Joe Jennette"
Learn to spell his name right ---JEANNETTE
"Langford . . . Known as the “Boston Bonecrusher” "
Langford's knickname was the Boston Tarbaby.
Modern day boxing “expertise” in all its glory on display here.
re
Johnson beat the hell out of Langford and damn near stopped him. Though Johnson obviously avoided Langford later on it is highly unlikely that Langford could have ever beaten Johnson as Johnson was too gifted skill-wise as well as physically. Langford is one of my three favorites fighters of all-time and he was truly a great, but any fight between Langford and Johnson would greatly be in favor of Johnson.
Also, if you are going to condemn Johnson for not fighting Langford then you need to condemn Marvin Hart, Tommy Burns, Jess Willard and Jack Dempsey as they never fought Langford either!
Fact is...Johnson could make a hell of a lot more money fighting "Great White Hopes" than he could fighting the top colored fighters of the day with a lot less risk. If Johnson could have made more money fighting Langford as he did fighting the likes of popular white heavyweights then he would likely have fought Langford, but the risk of that fight simply did not pay enough...or so they say. Actually, I think a fight between the two would have been a huge event in California, New York, Philadelphia or especially in England, Paris, or Australia.
Also, if you are going to condemn Johnson for not fighting Langford then you need to condemn Marvin Hart, Tommy Burns, Jess Willard and Jack Dempsey as they never fought Langford either!
Fact is...Johnson could make a hell of a lot more money fighting "Great White Hopes" than he could fighting the top colored fighters of the day with a lot less risk. If Johnson could have made more money fighting Langford as he did fighting the likes of popular white heavyweights then he would likely have fought Langford, but the risk of that fight simply did not pay enough...or so they say. Actually, I think a fight between the two would have been a huge event in California, New York, Philadelphia or especially in England, Paris, or Australia.
re
Burns fought fair opposition while defending the heavyweight title, but it was certainly nothing to brag about. His best opponents/fights were with "Philadelphia" Jack O'Brien, "Fireman" Jim Flynn, Bill Lang and his first bout against Bill Squires, well those bouts were all pretty solid defense. Gunner Moir was one of the top British fighters of the time as was Jem Roche tops in Ireland. Of course there is the Johnson bout, which Burns showed his true toughness and ability to take punishment as he certainly took a very solid beating in the bout.
A bout between Burns and Langford would have been a tremendous fight as those two were very, very evenly matched in skill, toughness and pretty much they were evenly matched in most other area's.
During Burns' reign the fighters that I would have preferred to have seen him facing would be Langford, Joe Jeannette and Sam McVey...all three of which I think would have beaten Burns. But there were also
Burns won the title on February 23, 1906 and lost it December 26, 1908…almost three years during which he put the title on the line 12 times in all, which would average out around four defenses a year…pretty good numbers for any champion. For his size though Burns was one of the best and at middleweight I rate him very high.
Now instead of seeing Burns fight the likes of Jem Roche, or Jewey Smith I would much rather have seen him fighting McVey, Langford, Jeannette, or white hope heavies like Al Kaufmann, or Mike Schreck, but that did not happen, so we have what we have to research on Burns and his record is very impressive due to his greatly smaller size for a heavyweight.
I don’t like, nor do I agree with a lot of the claims that have been made about Johnson…such as the one claim which it is said that Johnson was running from Langford because he was scared of Sam, which that just simply is not correct. Johnson beat Langford with relative ease and he very likely would win a rematch eight out of ten times
As far as faulting the fighters who failed to fight Langford with a title on the line, well...I don't fault them. It was certainly unfair that Langford never got any title fights at any weight, but that has been the case with many fighters.
A bout between Burns and Langford would have been a tremendous fight as those two were very, very evenly matched in skill, toughness and pretty much they were evenly matched in most other area's.
During Burns' reign the fighters that I would have preferred to have seen him facing would be Langford, Joe Jeannette and Sam McVey...all three of which I think would have beaten Burns. But there were also
Burns won the title on February 23, 1906 and lost it December 26, 1908…almost three years during which he put the title on the line 12 times in all, which would average out around four defenses a year…pretty good numbers for any champion. For his size though Burns was one of the best and at middleweight I rate him very high.
Now instead of seeing Burns fight the likes of Jem Roche, or Jewey Smith I would much rather have seen him fighting McVey, Langford, Jeannette, or white hope heavies like Al Kaufmann, or Mike Schreck, but that did not happen, so we have what we have to research on Burns and his record is very impressive due to his greatly smaller size for a heavyweight.
I don’t like, nor do I agree with a lot of the claims that have been made about Johnson…such as the one claim which it is said that Johnson was running from Langford because he was scared of Sam, which that just simply is not correct. Johnson beat Langford with relative ease and he very likely would win a rematch eight out of ten times
As far as faulting the fighters who failed to fight Langford with a title on the line, well...I don't fault them. It was certainly unfair that Langford never got any title fights at any weight, but that has been the case with many fighters.
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dempseyfire
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 5534
- Joined: 29 Oct 2003, 22:56
Re: re
I would definetely not go near putting Burns in Langford's league in terms of skill or anything else really. He was a tough little man with solid skills and a punch, but Langford proved over and over he was one of the PFP all time greats. Burns proved he was a solid champion. But his resume doesn't come close.barry wrote:Burns fought fair opposition while defending the heavyweight title, but it was certainly nothing to brag about. His best opponents/fights were with "Philadelphia" Jack O'Brien, "Fireman" Jim Flynn, Bill Lang and his first bout against Bill Squires, well those bouts were all pretty solid defense. Gunner Moir was one of the top British fighters of the time as was Jem Roche tops in Ireland. Of course there is the Johnson bout, which Burns showed his true toughness and ability to take punishment as he certainly took a very solid beating in the bout.
A bout between Burns and Langford would have been a tremendous fight as those two were very, very evenly matched in skill, toughness and pretty much they were evenly matched in most other area's.
During Burns' reign the fighters that I would have preferred to have seen him facing would be Langford, Joe Jeannette and Sam McVey...all three of which I think would have beaten Burns. But there were also
Burns won the title on February 23, 1906 and lost it December 26, 1908…almost three years during which he put the title on the line 12 times in all, which would average out around four defenses a year…pretty good numbers for any champion. For his size though Burns was one of the best and at middleweight I rate him very high.
Now instead of seeing Burns fight the likes of Jem Roche, or Jewey Smith I would much rather have seen him fighting McVey, Langford, Jeannette, or white hope heavies like Al Kaufmann, or Mike Schreck, but that did not happen, so we have what we have to research on Burns and his record is very impressive due to his greatly smaller size for a heavyweight.
I don’t like, nor do I agree with a lot of the claims that have been made about Johnson…such as the one claim which it is said that Johnson was running from Langford because he was scared of Sam, which that just simply is not correct. Johnson beat Langford with relative ease and he very likely would win a rematch eight out of ten times
As far as faulting the fighters who failed to fight Langford with a title on the line, well...I don't fault them. It was certainly unfair that Langford never got any title fights at any weight, but that has been the case with many fighters.
What Burns did, and this was good in a historical sense, was help make the HW title a truly "global" title, fighting the champs of Ireland, Australia, England etc. and beating them. And these guys had good records going into their title fights. But when one looks at their post-Burns records, one can see that the likes of Lang, Squires, Roche etc. were not top world class fighters but on the same level as some of the less-remarkable White Hopes (who they mostly lost to if they ever even fought them)
Even Flynn, while a recognizable name, was really only a solid gatekeeper/Monte Barrett level HW in the teens. Burn's best win in my book was over O'Brian, who was a super middleweight.
Re: re
Your PR pitch for Johnson and your spitting at Langford is worthy of a fifth rate PR man working for Johnson.barry wrote:Johnson beat the hell out of Langford and damn near stopped him. Though Johnson obviously avoided Langford later on it is highly unlikely that Langford could have ever beaten Johnson as Johnson was too gifted skill-wise as well as physically. Langford is one of my three favorites fighters of all-time and he was truly a great, but any fight between Langford and Johnson would greatly be in favor of Johnson.
Also, if you are going to condemn Johnson for not fighting Langford then you need to condemn Marvin Hart, Tommy Burns, Jess Willard and Jack Dempsey as they never fought Langford either!
Fact is...Johnson could make a hell of a lot more money fighting "Great White Hopes" than he could fighting the top colored fighters of the day with a lot less risk. If Johnson could have made more money fighting Langford as he did fighting the likes of popular white heavyweights then he would likely have fought Langford, but the risk of that fight simply did not pay enough...or so they say. Actually, I think a fight between the two would have been a huge event in California, New York, Philadelphia or especially in England, Paris, or Australia.
When you are finished with your tantrum,
THE FACT REMAINS that the story of Johnson's championship reign was
his refusal to fight by far the most dangerous challenger to his title--
SAM LANGFORD.
Not an pretty picture.
Johnson disgraced himself by refusing to fight Langford.