Could Hodkinson have lived with Hamed?

thepocketrocket · Post by **thepocketrocket** » 27 Apr 2007, 11:02

Well, could he?

I imagine I will hear the chorus' of NO and ARE YOU MAD? but lets look at the facts...

Come forward fighters like Cesar Soto, Wayne McCullough and Paul Ingle all had Hamed looking very average at one point or another, that must put to bed any idea that hamed would take out any agressive fighter?

And Hodkinsons record was good, Villisana was excellant and he was beating Goyo Vargas until he was sadly stopped, and that was arguably when he was just getting past his best...

I say Hodkinson pushes Hamed all the way,and he beats a post-peak Hamed

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 27 Apr 2007, 11:03

Hoko would have given Naz a run for his money, but I think Naz would stop him late

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 27 Apr 2007, 11:34

Possibly, but a one bed or a two bed flat? Imagine the rows in the morning over who got to use the shower first, and how would Hoko have coped with the constant praying?

Imagine the scene Hamed comes somersaulting out of bed and emerges from the smoky bedroom door, Hoko is doing his entrance down the hallway, golly, there'd have been hell to pay.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 27 Apr 2007, 12:09

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Possibly, but a one bed or a two bed flat? Imagine the rows in the morning over who got to use the shower first, and how would Hoko have coped with the constant praying?

Imagine the scene Hamed comes somersaulting out of bed and emerges from the smoky bedroom door, Hoko is doing his entrance down the hallway, golly, there'd have been hell to pay.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 27 Apr 2007, 12:34

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Possibly, but a one bed or a two bed flat? Imagine the rows in the morning over who got to use the shower first, and how would Hoko have coped with the constant praying?

Imagine the scene Hamed comes somersaulting out of bed and emerges from the smoky bedroom door, Hoko is doing his entrance down the hallway, golly, there'd have been hell to pay.

Exactly my thoughts when I read the title - well the first sentence anyway. ;)

caster · Post by **caster** » 27 Apr 2007, 13:48

Can't stand Hamed and really liked Hoko, but Hamed would have destroyed him! Hoko took too may shots and Hamed had tremendous power.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 27 Apr 2007, 16:25

Cesar Soto was one of the most average champions I have seen. Cast iron chin, but nothing really else. I think it was more a sign of Hamed's regression as opposed to him naturally struggling with aggressive fighters.

He was impressive vs come forward fighters in Steve Robinson and Jose Badillo (Robinson better and Badillo on a par with Soto IMO). When Kelley stopped counter attacking and went for it vs Hamed he got dominated.

McCullough I think was a similar scenerio.... Hamed just didn't seen to be 75% of the fighter when he went to US soil. Whether it was preperation, not adjusting to the climate etc.... but he always struggled there.

As for Ingle... I don't think it was Hamed who "struggled" per se, but Ingle being very good. I think Ingle would have beaten Hokko. I think Ingle would have beaten Hamed had they rematched.

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 28 Apr 2007, 05:52

Hamed, at his peak, would have beaten Hoko though the underrated Scouser would have done OK. A peak Hamed beats a peak Ingle every day of the week and twice on a Sunday.

Evander · Post by **Evander** » 28 Apr 2007, 06:01

Hoko was more the traditional boxer than Hamed ever was.
Paul cut too much.

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 28 Apr 2007, 06:18

I think Hoko would have marked up far too much and ended up being stopped.

It's alright saying McCullough, Soto and Ingle made Hamed look average, but the fact is they all got beat and beat by undisputable margins.

The only one that really made Hamed work hard was Ingle - Ingle was coming on very strong in the couple of rounds before Hamed produced the big punch to finish him off.

Evander · Post by **Evander** » 28 Apr 2007, 06:37

Hamed took advantage of his time.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 28 Apr 2007, 10:11

stujones wrote:Cesar Soto was one of the most average champions I have seen. Cast iron chin, but nothing really else. I think it was more a sign of Hamed's regression as opposed to him naturally struggling with aggressive fighters.

He was impressive vs come forward fighters in Steve Robinson and Jose Badillo (Robinson better and Badillo on a par with Soto IMO). When Kelley stopped counter attacking and went for it vs Hamed he got dominated.

McCullough I think was a similar scenerio.... Hamed just didn't seen to be 75% of the fighter when he went to US soil. Whether it was preperation, not adjusting to the climate etc.... but he always struggled there.

As for Ingle... I don't think it was Hamed who "struggled" per se, but Ingle being very good. I think Ingle would have beaten Hokko. I think Ingle would have beaten Hamed had they rematched.

hamed was actually better against come forward fighters.

it was guys that stood off and boxed at range that gave him problems.

the mccullough performance is a bit under rated from naz in my opinion. watch it again if ya don't believe me.

i've never seen hodkinson fight.

bit before my time was hodkinson.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 28 Apr 2007, 10:13

Twinkle Toes wrote:The only one that really made Hamed work hard was Ingle - Ingle was coming on very strong in the couple of rounds before Hamed produced the big punch to finish him off.

naz got a bloody nose against ingle which effected his stamina i think. definitely think the bleeding nose played a big part in naz's problems that night.

he was boxing great for 7 or 8 rds.

Mensa07 · Post by **Mensa07** » 28 Apr 2007, 10:33

bit of a myth that Hamed struggled or was in any way 'exposed' by guys like Wayne Mc & Ingle. They might have had a couple of moments or even took a round or two but f'ing hell its a fight, its like anyone he didn't quickly KO or make look foolish for 12 rounds he 'struggled' against.

Manuel Medina, that was a tough fight and a real test where in parts he did genuinely struggle. Compare Medina's performance to what Hamed got back from Mccullough & Ingle and you'll see how blown-up those claims are that those two nearly had the better of him, should have beaten him etc etc.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 28 Apr 2007, 10:50

SM2006 wrote:bit of a myth that Hamed struggled or was in any way 'exposed' by guys like Wayne Mc & Ingle. They might have had a couple of moments or even took a round or two but f'ing hell its a fight, its like anyone he didn't quickly KO or make look foolish for 12 rounds he 'struggled' against.

Manuel Medina, that was a tough fight and a real test where in parts he did genuinely struggle. Compare Medina's performance to what Hamed got back from Mccullough & Ingle and you'll see how blown-up those claims are that those two nearly had the better of him, should have beaten him etc etc.

yeah completely agree.

there talking out of here (pointing to his ass) as freddie mercury would say.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 28 Apr 2007, 12:17

Agree, Hamed won both fights pretty well, and it was more of a testament to his class, that fights where he didnt knock an opponent out was considered a 'poor' performance.

The only guy who beat hamed did so by fighting on the retreat, and hitting him with hard counter shots. Nobody ever really came close to beating hamed by surging forward. They survived by taking away his leverage, but nobody ever claimed they deserved a verdict.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 28 Apr 2007, 19:15

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:Hamed, at his peak, would have beaten Hoko though the underrated Scouser would have done OK. A peak Hamed beats a peak Ingle every day of the week and twice on a Sunday.

So I take it you think Hokko would have beaten Ingle?

I do agree with regards to Hamed vs Ingle, but Hamed wasn't at his peak when he fought Paul and Paul two successful title defences showed improvement (IMO) from the Hamed performance. I think Ingle might have caught Hamed at the right time had they rematched. Although, obviously full facts over Paul's dramatic weight gain, partying ways and weight loss were not really known at the time (well not to the general public not from the area)... it was mainly "rumours". Obviously, Paul would have needed to prepare correctly for Naz.

I re-watched Spencer Oliver vs Patrick Mullings the other day. It always makes me quite emotional to watch Oliver in action. I like to think I can spot a talented fighter and I'm not too bad at predicting their level when seeing them early. I don't think I have seen a more talented fighter than Spencer from the UK live in the last 17 years, Lennox Lewis aside. Yep, I include Calzaghe, Hatton, Hamed in that list. Eubank, Benn etc are not included cause they were established as World champions.

Of course, there were still questions to be answered regarding Oliver's chin... but he had passed every test against a decent level up untill that awful evening in the Albert Hall. Some people have used that night and labelled him chinny and saying Hamed, Ingle, Brodie etc wouldn't have had a problem with Spencer. I don't think you can, just as the Ingle vs Botile was clear from the off not the same fighter who beat Junior Jones and Manuel Medina... a spark was missing from Spencer from the off.