Is DLH-PBF really a genuine superfight?

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 08:08

Is it really? Oscar is at the end of his career and has lost his biggest fights. Although still a very very good fighter is he not now trading on the whole charisma thing (as evidenced by the 24/7 show)?

Mayweather is an undefeated multi-weight champ and worthy of participation in a genuine superfight but I'm not so sure DLH is anymore.

It's an intriguing matchup with lots of variables but I'm not excited about it in the way that I was over DLH-Trinidad, Lewis-Holyfield, Leonard-Hearns 1, those kind of fights between 2 fighters at their apparent peaks.

I think that's the key to a superfight, 2 guys at their probable peaks.

I guess Ali was supposed to be well past his peak when he fought Foreman and that was a superfight but that probably had more to do with the political connatations etc...

The fight is certainly capturing the publics imagination, I just got back from New York and I actually overheard several people discussing the fight and I even chatted to a barman at Grand Central station about our predictions.

But it still feels a bit blown out of proportion to me....

Just the way I feel about it really, I'll be watching of course but I'm not hyped like I would have been for a scrap like Cotto-Hatton even. Does that make me weird?

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 08:12

Yes it is, no question about it in my mind.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 08:14

What, I'm weird or it is a superfight?

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 08:16

Picture I took in Times square

http://img329. .us/my.php?image=1001695bz2.jpg

Can we not post images anymore?

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 08:16

chief · Post by **chief** » 03 May 2007, 08:17

It would be argued that SRL was not at his peak for the Hagler fight yet that still had all the ingredients for a "superfight" - this fight is no different really..

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 08:18

It could be argued that neither was at their peak.

Superfights are as much to do with the personalities involved as the merits of the fights themselves.

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 03 May 2007, 08:19

It's colossal and definitely a superfight. They are both incredible talents with proven track records at a high level. It's simply MASSIVE.

chief · Post by **chief** » 03 May 2007, 08:24

jamesmcdonnell wrote: Superfights are as much to do with the personalities involved as the merits of the fights themselves.

Exactly, and that's why "superfights" generate the money, because they capture the interest of a wider audience..

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 03 May 2007, 08:28

DLH was seen as P4P top3 from the mid 90s until Mosley 2. But hes pretty much the same standard of fighter from then until today. he has dropped a little but is still a modern great. Many fighters rated above him P4P at their respective weights - Barrera, Cotto, Hatton, Castillo would not be given a massive chance against Oscar if they were the same size. They also haven't achieved as much as Oscar.

For all his faults Oscar has 1 of the best resumes of all times in terms of who hes fought.

Yes Oscar isn't prime but neither were Holyfield, Ray Laonard, Hagler etc when they had their superfights.

The title super fight is pretty subjective - why should Trinidad-Hoya be a superfight? Why was it a bigger fight than DLH-Quartey. Funny thing is Quartey whipped Hoya and Hoya whipped Trinidad and each got robbed.

O/T Are the Welterweight titles truly cursed???? Whitaker gets robbed by Hoya, who in turn gets a gift against Quartey and then gets robbed against Trinidad. Mosley dominates Hoya and loses in a huge upset to forrest who in turn loses in a huge upset. Mayorga gets schooled to Spinks who gets ko'd by Judah who in turn has a massive upset to Baldomir. Maybe its a good thing for Mayweather hes fighting at 154 next

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 03 May 2007, 08:31

I was more excited in the build up to De La Hoya-Hopkins, but still, yes, this is a superfight; about as good as it gets in modern boxing.

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 03 May 2007, 08:35

Merchant’s comments in the article linked below confirms my belief that this fight is huge and is creating the kind of buzz amongst non-boxing fans that only a Super Fight can

http://www.maxboxing.com/Kim/Kim043007.asp

I cant wait – it’s the fight/event I have most looked forward to in years in all honesty.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 03 May 2007, 08:44

Goz, I know what you mean - it's a superfight in terms of money and hype - even casual followers of the game have been mentioning it to me this week - but I'm not too hyped about it to be honest, though we have to make do with slim pickins these days.

Doesn't approach the superfights of the 80's really: Leonard/Duran/Hearns/Hagler/Arguello/Pryor/Sanchez/Gomez - even Chavez/Taylor

Those were fights almost impossible to predict what would happen, and all were at their absolute peaks.

Whereas with Oscar/Floyd, you know its either gonna be PBF on points, or Oscar catches him. I guess it's the fact that Oscar is in the twilight of his career, plus you just know that Floyd can't hurt him, that takes a little away from it as a spectacle.

Still, it's one of the few USA fights of recent times that I'm going to make the effort to stay up and watch live.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 08:53

Pretty much what I was trying to say MW but you said it better!

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 09:36

MightyWarrior wrote:Goz, I know what you mean - it's a superfight in terms of money and hype - even casual followers of the game have been mentioning it to me this week - but I'm not too hyped about it to be honest, though we have to make do with slim pickins these days.

Doesn't approach the superfights of the 80's really: Leonard/Duran/Hearns/Hagler/Arguello/Pryor/Sanchez/Gomez - even Chavez/Taylor

Those were fights almost impossible to predict what would happen, and all were at their absolute peaks.

Whereas with Oscar/Floyd, you know its either gonna be PBF on points, or Oscar catches him. I guess it's the fact that Oscar is in the twilight of his career, plus you just know that Floyd can't hurt him, that takes a little away from it as a spectacle.

Still, it's one of the few USA fights of recent times that I'm going to make the effort to stay up and watch live.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it? At the time of Hagler v Leonard, almost everyone was predicting a horrific beating for Leonard, and the fight itself wasn't that exciting except for in patches.

The result made the fight remarkable, had the outcome predicted by most occured, and Hagler mashed Leonard into a pulp, it would have been a massive letdown, as many of these superfight affairs are.

This is one of the reasons I love watching Pacquaio fight, you know that 9 times out of 10, the fight is going to end in a brutal KO, and even if he loses, his opponent is going to take some almighty licks. Every fight is a superfight with Pacquiao.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 03 May 2007, 09:47

jamesmcdonnell wrote: Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it? At the time of Hagler v Leonard, almost everyone was predicting a horrific beating for Leonard, and the fight itself wasn't that exciting except for in patches.

The result made the fight remarkable, had the outcome predicted by most occured, and Hagler mashed Leonard into a pulp, it would have been a massive letdown, as many of these superfight affairs are.

This is one of the reasons I love watching Pacquaio fight, you know that 9 times out of 10, the fight is going to end in a brutal KO, and even if he loses, his opponent is going to take some almighty licks. Every fight is a superfight with Pacquiao.

Yes I didn't give Leonard any chance v Hagler, I was actually refering to Hagler/Hearns, but it was a superfight, given the world attention and money at stake, a bit like PBF/Oscar in fact. The result is what turned it into a classic though.

Pacman v Morales 1 was a recent superfight - two killers at the top of their game, and impossible to predict with much confidence.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 03 May 2007, 10:19

fvck it, I can't get excited about this fight. though i'd tune in to see sergio martinez take on the winner. is something wrong with me? i doubt it

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 10:22

MightyWarrior wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote: Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it? At the time of Hagler v Leonard, almost everyone was predicting a horrific beating for Leonard, and the fight itself wasn't that exciting except for in patches.

The result made the fight remarkable, had the outcome predicted by most occured, and Hagler mashed Leonard into a pulp, it would have been a massive letdown, as many of these superfight affairs are.

This is one of the reasons I love watching Pacquaio fight, you know that 9 times out of 10, the fight is going to end in a brutal KO, and even if he loses, his opponent is going to take some almighty licks. Every fight is a superfight with Pacquiao.
Yes I didn't give Leonard any chance v Hagler, I was actually refering to Hagler/Hearns, but it was a superfight, given the world attention and money at stake, a bit like PBF/Oscar in fact. The result is what turned it into a classic though.

Pacman v Morales 1 was a recent superfight - two killers at the top of their game, and impossible to predict with much confidence.

Seem to recall Pacman was the underdog for the Morales fight wasn't he? Much like he was for the Barrera fight. I think I went for the Pacman win myself though.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 10:29

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it? At the time of Hagler v Leonard, almost everyone was predicting a horrific beating for Leonard, and the fight itself wasn't that exciting except for in patches.

The result made the fight remarkable, had the outcome predicted by most occured, and Hagler mashed Leonard into a pulp, it would have been a massive letdown, as many of these superfight affairs are.

This is one of the reasons I love watching Pacquaio fight, you know that 9 times out of 10, the fight is going to end in a brutal KO, and even if he loses, his opponent is going to take some almighty licks. Every fight is a superfight with Pacquiao.

It's true, although it was most definitely built up as a superfight had SRL been destroyed then yes it might not have actually gone down in the annals as one.

KO magazine used to produce a poster if they judged a fight to be a 'superfight', anyone remember that?

Hagler was BIG news then though, especially after the Hearns fight. Leonard was certainly the golden boy in that match up though.

As a fight though I guess this is only really an intruiging one because of the jump up in weight taken by PBF. If DLH was a Junior-Welter I think 95% would be coming down on the side of Mayweather.

STP · Post by **STP** » 03 May 2007, 10:32

Lewis-Tyson is the one I was excited about most in all honesty, even more so than Hagler-Leonard, Benn-Eubank I and II, Jones-Toney, Tyson-Holyfield, Oscar-Trinidad.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 03 May 2007, 10:36

Really?

Even though Tyson was shot to fornicate?

STP · Post by **STP** » 03 May 2007, 10:40

Goz wrote:Really?

Even though Tyson was shot to eff?

Yeah, we know that now. But at the time, I think you'll remember it was pretty damn anticipated (ESP after what Rahman did).

This fight, I don't think there's anything going to suprise me really, Mayweather will win probably 10 or 11 doing his usual stuff and Oscar will try to get in and use compact punches like Mayorga fight. It'll be quite systematic, and abit of a let down. You see.

STP · Post by **STP** » 03 May 2007, 10:42

I do think Mayweather will try to open more than he did against Baldomir. It'll be kind of a hybrid Gatti/Baldomir, Mayweather's performance.

ArtOfWar · Post by **ArtOfWar** » 03 May 2007, 10:49

Anytime Oscar takes on an elite opponent it's a super fight, because he brings the necessary media attention to make it such. That doesn't mean I think it's a 50/50 fight as Mayweather is the big favourite in my eye's, but it is a super fight.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 03 May 2007, 10:56

STP wrote:
Goz wrote:Really?

Even though Tyson was shot to eff?
Yeah, we know that now. But at the time, I think you'll remember it was pretty damn anticipated (ESP after what Rahman did).

This fight, I don't think there's anything going to suprise me really, Mayweather will win probably 10 or 11 doing his usual stuff and Oscar will try to get in and use compact punches like Mayorga fight. It'll be quite systematic, and abit of a let down. You see.

There was of course a bit of excitement, it was a tyson fight after all, but I had been saying for months prior that Tyson was finished at top level, and Lewis was going to annihilate him. Lewis had already annihilated Rahman in a rematch, and Tyson looked pretty awful against Nielsen despite winning.

It was only anticipated because it had been talked about for so long.