Who are British Boxings biggest underachievers??

Scrap · Post by **Scrap** » 05 Jul 2007, 04:38

Bones I never knew he had hand problems thanks for the info. I never thought that was the problem, him not being a puncher.

jimb0d · Post by **jimb0d** » 05 Jul 2007, 04:45

Bobby Vanzie could bang and had an awkward style that might have taken him further. He never got over the controversial decisions he had against him though.

But its gotta be audley.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 05 Jul 2007, 05:08

Pat Cowdell, despite being a fine boxer, was unlucky not to win a title. He had to face Sanchez and Nelson in his 2 tilts at the title! McGuigan-Cowdell is a fight that got away that few mention. I'd love to ask Barry about that one and get his take on it.

One guy I thought would achieve more back in the 80s was Chris Pyatt. I was a big fan and thought he had the ability to do more than he did (although he did have a successful career).

Who has been our biigest over achiever? Andries?

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 05 Jul 2007, 05:17

Thought of some more while reading this thread:

Michael Carruth - Gold medal winner at the 92 olympics, but had an early loss then came unstuck in WBO challenge.

Paul Griffin - Good fighter with very good amateur pedigree.

Haider Ali - Commonwelath gold medalist, still at it as far as I know.

Jamie Arthur - Fought Haider and lost, had one more fight then retired.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 05 Jul 2007, 06:35

Twinkle Toes wrote:Thought of some more while reading this thread:

Michael Carruth - Gold medal winner at the 92 olympics, but had an early loss then came unstuck in WBO challenge.

Paul Griffin - Good fighter with very good amateur pedigree.

Haider Ali - Commonwelath gold medalist, still at it as far as I know.

Jamie Arthur - Fought Haider and lost, had one more fight then retired.

Carruth - Never thought much of him to be honest. Thought he was lucky in the final of the Olympics... always thought the judges might have been swayed (even in the computer scoring) cause of McCullough not getting the gold.

Paul Griffin - Good Call.

Haider Ali - Very good call so far.

Jamie Arthur - Never was going to make it in the pro's. As an amateur he relied on Fitness and heart as opposed to Skill and power.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 05 Jul 2007, 06:39

Ezzard wrote:Pat Cowdell, despite being a fine boxer, was unlucky not to win a title. He had to face Sanchez and Nelson in his 2 tilts at the title! McGuigan-Cowdell is a fight that got away that few mention. I'd love to ask Barry about that one and get his take on it.

One guy I thought would achieve more back in the 80s was Chris Pyatt. I was a big fan and thought he had the ability to do more than he did (although he did have a successful career).

Who has been our biigest over achiever? Andries?

Pyatt was a right monster, but he was a bit mechanical I seem to recall.

Pat Cowdell was a fantastic fighter who was unfortunate to come up against two such formidable opponents. A few fighters I've spoken with from that time reckon that Cowdell would have done McGuigan.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 05 Jul 2007, 08:29

Nigel Wenton , i though he could have gone a bit further than he did, although he did challenge for the WBO title in his last fight.

Looking at his record his first loss is an odd one, how did he end up in a 6 rounder in Venezuela? On a 3 fight card with no other British boxers on it.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=007424

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 05 Jul 2007, 09:18

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
Ezzard wrote:Pat Cowdell, despite being a fine boxer, was unlucky not to win a title. He had to face Sanchez and Nelson in his 2 tilts at the title! McGuigan-Cowdell is a fight that got away that few mention. I'd love to ask Barry about that one and get his take on it.

One guy I thought would achieve more back in the 80s was Chris Pyatt. I was a big fan and thought he had the ability to do more than he did (although he did have a successful career).

Who has been our biigest over achiever? Andries?
Pyatt was a right monster, but he was a bit mechanical I seem to recall.

Pat Cowdell was a fantastic fighter who was unfortunate to come up against two such formidable opponents. A few fighters I've spoken with from that time reckon that Cowdell would have done McGuigan.

It would have been a great style match up. Both were top fighters with bags of stmaina and commitment. It's a shame as it would have been a real 50-50 fight IMO.

What about McGuigan? Did he underachieve? He really rallied against Cruz and had he not unravelled in the 15th he would have nicked on my card. He really dragged it up from within himself during those final championship rounds. From 126-130 there were so many fights for him Nelson, Cowdell, Gomez, Villasana, Fenech, Mitchell, Lockridge, Chavez... Barry was a big enough draw to have made all of these fights.

1southpaw · Post by **1southpaw** » 05 Jul 2007, 16:18

stujones wrote:In recent years:

Danny Williams, David Starie, Adrian Dodson, Crawford Ashley,Ryan Rhodes, James Hare, David Barnes, Steve Murray, Anthony Maynard, Patrck Mullings, Ian Napa.

mark delaney

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 05 Jul 2007, 16:45

Never thought much of Mark Delaney actually. Couldn't understand why he was favourite vs Joe Calzaghe.

Now his brother was a bit of an under achiever, IMO. He looked devasting early on.

What about Bernard Paul - he could punch abit.

Billy Schwer - another for me, I thought he was going to be a world champion. Heart break vs Stevie Johnsyon.

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 05 Jul 2007, 16:52

1southpaw wrote: mark delaney

Are you crazy? He over achieved hugely due to safe matchmaking and his ticket selling ability.

Against Calzaghe he looked like he was punching underwater, the difference in hand speed was that glaring.

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 05 Jul 2007, 17:03

I remember Brian Hughes speaking of Craig Dermody years ago in glowing terms.

He said of the wayward talent that "he could box on a handkerchief".

He didnt need to use movement to get out of the way of punches, so innate was his ability to slip and time shots - he is one who got away..

Someone mentioned Mario Culpepper - that is another one I remember from back inthe day. I never saw Mario box but if I remember rightly from old BN reports, he was more of a stylist than a banger. I think he driftfed into a drugs life too.

Wales · Post by **Wales** » 06 Jul 2007, 07:20

How about the Booth brothers?

Cap · Post by **Cap** » 06 Jul 2007, 08:55

One oldtimer who had most of the physical tools to be a champ was Bombardier Billy Wells. Maybe if he had moved to New York, Los Angeles or Chicago and worked with the right sort of trainers and sparring partners he might have had more luck with his career, even wrangled a title shot. Two guys he definitely should have beaten though were Al Palzer and Georges Carpentier.

Cap

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 06 Jul 2007, 09:40

I think Michael Carruth is a good call based on the fact he was an olympic gold medal winner yet made nothing like an impact in the pro game. Of course Carruth was only at the olympics because of the Eamonn Magee fall out.

As for someone mentioning Takaloo...i'm not so sure he is an underachiever i think he has done okay with the tools he has. He's no world beater remember.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 06 Jul 2007, 10:35

Well thats all Tak has achieved is two WBU baubbles. At one stage he was crude, but seemed to have a very decent punch, good stamina and a good chin. That can often take you further than where he went too.... remember Ricardo Mayorga.

John Dillinger · Post by **John Dillinger** » 06 Jul 2007, 11:01

Old bones Ian wrote:Nigel Wenton , i though he could have gone a bit further than he did, although he did challenge for the WBO title in his last fight.

Looking at his record his first loss is an odd one, how did he end up in a 6 rounder in Venezuela? On a 3 fight card with no other British boxers on it.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=007424

Wasn't Wenton managed by Barney Eastwood? He had links with Venezuelan fighters like Espana. I remember Wenton losing to a decision to Sharmba Mitchell in the US early on in his career. That's some tough matchmaking. Like Jacobs going to the US to fight McGirt. Doubt you'll see Amir Khan following that path.