So now we know why!!!!!!

SticknMove · Post by **SticknMove** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:08

For fvcks sake, quit with the conspiracy theories.

Next we may hear that Limond was hit with a shot from the grassy gnome

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:14

Very good fight. Good TV so the boxing fans and the sport can be happy.

But, Amir Khan was exposed tonight, he will not make it to world level.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:23

i disagree about the interview. he denied he was ever hurt. said he was always in control. the boy, and i quite like the fella, clearly believes the publicity machine that has put him in this position. he looked poor in many departments of his game tonight, and i didnt like his condition either. i think the options for amir have tightened considerably due to his performance tonight. of course he has talent and he did show heart to win after near destruction, but they have not brought him on well. big holes in his technique have not been plugged. it looks like they have worked to improve his strengths and not bothered about his weaknesses. this is a sign of major complacency in his camp from waaarrren down.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:30

harrygreb wrote:i disagree about the interview. he denied he was ever hurt. said he was always in control. the boy, and i quite like the fella, clearly believes the publicity machine that has put him in this position. he looked poor in many departments of his game tonight, and i didnt like his condition either. i think the options for amir have tightened considerably due to his performance tonight. of course he has talent and he did show heart to win after near destruction, but they have not brought him on well. big holes in his technique have not been plugged. it looks like they have worked to improve his strengths and not bothered about his weaknesses. this is a sign of major complacency in his camp from waaarrren down.

I agree, although he did admit he has alot of improving - question is now is will they actually work on it.

Khan is still a young man and it was the first time someone was actually negative to him, well done Jim Rosenthal BTW, so perhaps he was a bit taken a back.

Remember Joe Calzaghe's interviews when he went through his slump in form.

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:34

There are so many fundamental flaws in Khan's style that you have to wonder about his camp or his own ability to learn.

In fact I would not be surprised to see some fall out from this.

boxingchatter · Post by **boxingchatter** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:37

I don't believe it was a fix. The rematch with the Cuban in Bolton in Amir's last paid fight looked dodgy to me tho.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:39

What is Oliver Harrison teaching him? What are his credentials in boxing really? They need to get him a new trainer IMO he doesn't appear to be developing like a guy with his talent should.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:43

but stu, if asked after your 12th fight if "theres still some improving to do?" what are you going to say? "well actually, jim, i think i'm the finished article and i want a world title shot now" he couldnt have said much else than what he did. i have said it before and i'll say it again, 20 TO LEARN, 20 TO EARN. these greedy buggers, and i include his family as well as his management, have got it round the wrong way.

revporl · Post by **revporl** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:43

boxingchatter wrote:Can someone confirm that Puke McKenzie said "Southpaws gut more easily" at the start of the WBO title fight?

I'm left handed. I wasn't aware that inevitably lends itself to weak skin.

yeah, that comment worried by left handed girlfreind a bit. She said "is that true?"

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:45

duke wasnt good tonight was he

SticknMove · Post by **SticknMove** » 14 Jul 2007, 19:58

nickd wrote:What is Oliver Harrison teaching him? What are his credentials in boxing really? They need to get him a new trainer IMO he doesn't appear to be developing like a guy with his talent should.

I have to say this is the first port of call. I don't know Harrison as a trainer but I doubt there is much he can teach a prodigy of Khan's ability.

That ability is built on his speed of punch and foot with decent power. As a big serving tennis player will learn, take a bit off the speed and get the accuracy and timing right. He seems to be forcing fights leaning over his front foot whilst leaving his chin blowing in the wind. It is obvious now that his whiskers are suspect.

He has a great deal to to learn and offer, but he is not going to fulfil any semblance of potential on the basis of that fight. A trip to the States under the tutelage of a reconised worldclass trainer is what he needs.

The problem is you can not train a chin to take a punch, whether expectedly or unexpectly

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:02

nickd wrote: What are his credentials in boxing really?

Jamie Moore?

Fernzy · Post by **Fernzy** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:04

I've never seen Khan look so nervous before a fight before, he just didn't seem his normal self in there tonight.Obviously it was a proper step up in class from the set of pushovers he had previously faced but he stood off quite a bit and he was not moving as sharply as normal.

At the end of about round 3, I was saying to my dad his defensive skills really were letting him down and that Limmond would probably end up catching him a fair bit and so it proved.His chin was so high up in the air for the first shot that really rattled him and his arms way too low and open, it's been evident in previous fights but it just doesn't seem to be worked upon.His range of attack was also a bit limited for me, far too many times Limmond was wide open for a hook to body but he just persisted with mainly jabs to the head.

A great comeback after he pretty much looked out of it but a lot needs to change if he's going to progress up the ranks.Perhaps he has been made to come on a little early with a fight like this one but I guess he learnt a great deal tonight and still come away with the win.

It will be interesting to see who he's matched up against next, it's a tricky one really because he's come through a tough test here and learnt quite a lot but showed a real vulnerable side.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:22

Absolutely ridiculous to blame Oliver Harrison. He is a very good trainer who has Khan's confidence.

Some of you are missing a very clear point, that is Khan is not that good in the chin department despite his claims on his interview that he is. If he were to fight the very best in the division in Europe he would get beaten. To step up to world level is complete madness.

Just another point, expect Khan to step up a weight.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:33

harrygreb wrote:duke wasnt good tonight was he

Has he been ever. With each year he seems to be getting squeeker and squeeker and more "erractic" with his commentary. When he had to explain to John what abstaining from women meant was one of cringiest moments in Boxing commentary history (a bit of a Dukism there myself).

Tarquin Tarpaulin IV · Post by **Tarquin Tarpaulin IV** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:33

Did you see his sister she was crying, his mum was praying and his dads eyes nearly popped out

Mum, Dad, Mum, Sister, Uncles, Manager, Brother, Cousins.....

What's with the ringside 'invasion' that can only serve to put undue pressure on Amir?

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 14 Jul 2007, 20:49

I can't believe I'm seeing the word "fix" floating around. What an insult to both fighters. This was an absolute bloody war.

No matter what you think about Khan's potential that was a brilliant display to turn things around so quickly. He really looks to have a fine engine and this experience wil only serve him well.

Grilling Machine · Post by **Grilling Machine** » 14 Jul 2007, 21:21

Deserter wrote:Yes, he needs to work on his defence

He does, because he doesn't have any. His defence is dissuading opponents from committing due to his flashing hand speed, but a ballsy fighter - a Katsidis - would walk through him. There's no real guard or lateral evasion. Stuff he can learn of course.

Watching Pryce tonight, I get the feeling Enzo C could help Khan enormously, but would Amir's pride welcome that dressing-down? Hamed and Lewis both lost a lot of spark after hiring yes men.

boxingchatter wrote:I'm left handed. I wasn't aware that inevitably lends itself to weak skin.

Duke said 'in his experience'. There could be some truth in lefties cutting more often, though there's no evidence of skin differences obviously.

Fighting against a leftie, missing with a stationary jab can be more costly as you put yourself in the danger zone for his left (that is, he can parry your jab in front of his face while twisting with a straight left; unless you're a square-on boxer like Tyson).
When fighting a fellow right-hander, if you miss his cheek with the left you still have the right ready, same as him, probably at similar range. So the righty might subconsciously aim higher through fear of being countered, leading to more shots landing around the leftie's right eye.

Disclaimer: this could all be bollocks, in which case it was McKenzie's opinion.

jonp · Post by **jonp** » 14 Jul 2007, 21:49

banjaxd wrote:i thought it looked suspect, also the kd , khan touched down again and could he have been counted out for that ?...

limond however followed up when he hurt khan to deck him so why would he do that if it was a fix ?

I was there when he touched back down the second time it looked like the ref motioned for him to get back up?

leforge · Post by **leforge** » 14 Jul 2007, 21:55

I thought Khan was down fo longer than 10. I think Earl could beat him. Thaxton would destroy him

Grilling Machine · Post by **Grilling Machine** » 14 Jul 2007, 22:11

SticknMove wrote:He seems to be forcing fights leaning over his front foot whilst leaving his chin blowing in the wind.

Good call. Did you see Luevano earlier? As John or Duke mentioned, Steve puts his weight on the back foot, and that really helps him.

Khan has lightning hand speed, which is the perfect ingredient for a counterpuncher. Yet because he's grown used to boxing non-punchers, he's thinking like the aggressor. He needs to throw away the Hagler videos and watch some Leonard.

Fernzy wrote:far too many times Limmond was wide open for a hook to body but he just persisted with mainly jabs to the head.

It's the amateur training; I'm still waiting to see AK land a meaningful left hook. His lack of infighting skills are a massive worry too.

Albert wrote:Just another point, expect Khan to step up a weight.

To an even more dangerous division? He certainly won't want to, so it's a matter of making weight. I can't imagine he'd be crazy enough to voluntarily move up.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 14 Jul 2007, 22:16

Amir will NEVER win a world title under his current setup. Khan is in a total comfort zone. Bottom line is he is only with Harrison because he is close to home. And then I can't imagine he's getting any sort of hard sparring. Iron sharpens iron. He has no one to push him. He is obviously surrounded by a bunch of "yes men".

Khan is Harrisons prize pig. His prize pig happens to live in luxury and pay him decent in money and reputation. Harrison can't seriously get laid into Khan if he's not taking training serious, or he's at some celebrity party. If he tells Khan some hard truths he would risk getting replaced, no doubt with some other "yes man".

A world renowned trainer not only brings real experience but also won't mind getting laid into Khan because he's already got a great rep and can train any number of world class fighters if he chose. Khan leaves? No big loss.

I liked Khan in the amatuers and for a while in the pro's. The whole situation now disgusts me. No hunger and he seems to be in total denial about it all. I could swear his actual punching technique and any snap has regressed from the amatuers.

boxingchatter · Post by **boxingchatter** » 14 Jul 2007, 23:48

Some suggestions for Fwank

* Amir needs to ditch Harrison and, FFS, move out of Bolton for a month or two to get real sparring.

* Needs new trainer. RIGHT NOW before it is too late.

* Needs new matchmaker working on his career. Powell just isn't up to it. It is either retired bums like Bull with no intention of trying or super-featherweights who will fall down after 1st punch. How did that prepare or teach Amir anything? He's had two years of no-one hitting back and - last night - the shock of someone not taking an Italian striker bellyflop to the floor in the 2nd round nearly killed the kid's career.

* The 400 strong family need to be barred from ringside. Dad, yes, 34 half second cousins no. Can only distract the kid with them all screaming and wailing like that.

* I guess it is far too late but tell ITV to LAY OFF THE HYPE. Amir is a very good prospect, yes, but he's not Naz, Hatton, Calzaghe, Benn etc. He may get the world level -personally I think Thaxton will crush and ruin him - but he has to get there at a slower speed than a lot of people will like. Pretty clear he's not got a world class chin nor punch, his defence is a joke and he runs out of ideas after a while.

However, he's got speed, some nice combos, heart and did I mention speed. Let him develop over a longer period of time on the UNDERCARD of PROPER main events!

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 Jul 2007, 23:50

Shirow wrote:I agree with Deserter and i think Khan came across well in the interview, he admitted he was hurt (i was wincing thinking he'd deny it) & said how he proved his worth by coming back from it in the following round. Also how he's still a relative novice so should be expected to learn and improve.

The commentators were more negative than i'm sure ITV were happy with.
So the reality wasn't repackaged for the non-boxing savvy.
If Khan is seen as a work in progress rather than an inevitable future world champ it should make the ride more interesting.

I remember this happening with Wlad Klitschko before he had been mowed down by Corrie. The hype machine had anointed him as heir apparent and it was just a question of how long poor Lennox would last against him once they got it on. Again we need to separate our disdain for the hype from dislike of the boxer.

He came off badly in the interview. He's really gibberish and kept saying "You know wot ah mean" maybe 100 times.

caster · Post by **caster** » 15 Jul 2007, 04:45

It´s not Oliver Harrison´s fault. The fault lies with Khan - he believes the hype and that will always make him vulnerable - I´ve heard his younger brother is the same - he´s very unproven and its not time for him to say he´ll be this and that champion.....