If its not Hatton next, then this has got to happen.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 15 Jul 2007, 06:57

Whilst at the moment its far from the biggest Welterweight fight in the world. I think we might have discovered a new star in Paul Williams. If it not Hatton next for Floyd, then what a fight it would be between him and Williams.

Talk about reliving 1981 and Hearns vs Leonard 1. The styles of the two are remarkably similar.

Williams I think will improve now he is a champion, I'm so glad the judges got it right... I'm not sure what planet the HBO team were one... terrible job there. Margarito would have a good round, and the HBO team would talk about it for a few rounds time and I am sure didn't look at the cuurent round.

I think 8-4 Williams was being fair to Margarito... who dissapointed me. Still a good opponent for Cotto, but I'm glad its not going to be hyped as Champion vs Champion and Antonio got exposed before... cause Cotto would/is going to anhilate him.

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 15 Jul 2007, 13:16

I scored Williams-Margarito a draw. Rounds 1-5 for Williams, 6-11 Margarito and 12 Williams. Williams threw a lot more and the punches were fast, but many were blocked by Margarito's gloves. Margarito was more economical, but his punches more effective. I'm not complaining about the result, as it was a close fight. Disappointed with Margarito for clearly losing the final round. Had he won that, he would have kept his title with a majority draw on the judges' cards and a Cotto-Margarito clash would have been mouthwatering.

Styles make fights and I think Williams presents a stylistic nightmare for just about anyone. I like your comparison of a potential Williams-Mayweather matchup to the Hearns-Leonard fight, but can't see Floyd being willing to accept the challenge. I certainly could not imagine him digging deep and turning the fight around like Leonard did in round 14. Floyd would somehow turn this into a stinker. I'd still rather see the modern-day Leonard-Duran, i.e. Mayweather-Hatton. Floyd wouldn't get the chance to stink the joint out in that one.

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 15 Jul 2007, 13:21

Mayweather won't go near Williams because Williams is the 1 guy that I'd make a favourate to beat Floyd 147 and below. Then again Cotto, Mosley, Hatton will all avoid Williams like the plague. Interestingly enough I'd give the lesser regarded Cintron the best shot against Williams.

Williams won convincingly for me, either 8-4 or 9-3.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 13:48

Margarito would beat the shit out of Hatton and Mayweather. Stop saying that Margarito was "exposed" just because he lost narrowly to a freakishly tall young southpaw.

And Williams would be too big for Hatton.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 13:51

And I pray for Margarito vs Cotto. Margarito is a different fighter against shorter opponents. Cotto is going to be the one "exposed". Cotto has always been hit by uppercuts and thats Margarito's favourite punch. This fight MUST happen.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 13:55

Margarito to beat Mayweather? No Way. His hands are not nearly fast enough. Williams would do better but he'd still be beaten at his own game.

Cotto is the only possible threat out there for Floyd.

Deserter · Post by **Deserter** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:07

Phenomenal-Nutrition wrote:Mayweather won't go near Williams because Williams is the 1 guy that I'd make a favourate to beat Floyd 147 and below. Then again Cotto, Mosley, Hatton will all avoid Williams like the plague. Interestingly enough I'd give the lesser regarded Cintron the best shot against Williams.

Williams won convincingly for me, either 8-4 or 9-3.

Good post. That's all spot on in my opinion. Williams' sheer size could give Floyd fits, but based on Cintron's performance last night and his own size he could hold his own with Williams.

Carbo · Post by **Carbo** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:16

I actually think that Floyd would beat Williams. If we've seen one thing in Floyd's career, it's that he has the beating of tall, lean sharp-shooters.

We've seen it against Sosa, Coralles, and N'Dou, and while Williams' hits harder and has far faster hands, I think Mayweather has the same feel for these guys as Tszyu had for southpaw slicksters and Hearns had for squat, come-forward brawlers.

If Mayweather wants to take the toughest task available, he should take on Mosley. I don't know why people aren't screaming for this fight.

Failing that, Hatton would provide the kind of clash of styles that would please the eye. It would also answer alot of questions hanging over both men's heads.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:17

Kilburn wrote:Margarito to beat Mayweather? No Way. His hands are not nearly fast enough. Williams would do better but he'd still be beaten at his own game.

Cotto is the only possible threat out there for Floyd.

Was Castillo's hands too slow? No, and HE beat Mayweather. Floyd is incredibly beatable. The guy has been feasting on hand picked opponents. The last guy he fought that you could say was the best available in his division was Castillo.

You also bring up Cotto who is only marginally faster than Tony, if he even is at all.

Mayweather doesn't have a damn thing to keep Margarito off him. Tony would MAUL Mayweather. He's got the PERFECT style for beating Floyd. Brawlers have a history of beating slick boxers.

Floyd Mayweather is one of the most overrated boxers ive ever seen. He's got this legion of nuthuggers that just think he's this untouchable boxing god.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:19

Don't you think Mayweather just does everything that bit better than Mosley at this stage?

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:20

Lefthookhappy19 wrote:
Kilburn wrote:Margarito to beat Mayweather? No Way. His hands are not nearly fast enough. Williams would do better but he'd still be beaten at his own game.

Cotto is the only possible threat out there for Floyd.
Was Castillo's hands too slow? No, and HE beat Mayweather. Floyd is incredibly beatable. The guy has been feasting on hand picked opponents. The last guy he fought that you could say was the best available in his division was Castillo.

You also bring up Cotto who is only marginally faster than Tony, if he even is at all.

Mayweather doesn't have a damn thing to keep Margarito off him. Tony would MAUL Mayweather. He's got the PERFECT style for beating Floyd. Brawlers have a history of beating slick boxers.

Floyd Mayweather is one of the most overrated boxers ive ever seen. He's got this legion of nuthuggers that just think he's this untouchable boxing god.

I would take this one up but I don't even believe you're being serious.

Carbo · Post by **Carbo** » 15 Jul 2007, 15:35

Kilburn wrote:Don't you think Mayweather just does everything that bit better than Mosley at this stage?

Perhaps, but certainly not power. Mosley can still work for a whole fight -- something Oscar can not -- and he has the speed and knowhow to catch Floyd; and, obviously, when he does, the power to hurt him. I guess we said the same about Dela Hoya, but Mosley has looked sharp as a tack and he has that extra fluidity, stamina and speed of punch and combination that Oscar doesn't at the very highest level anymore.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:06

Kilburn wrote:
Lefthookhappy19 wrote:
Kilburn wrote:Margarito to beat Mayweather? No Way. His hands are not nearly fast enough. Williams would do better but he'd still be beaten at his own game.

Cotto is the only possible threat out there for Floyd.
Was Castillo's hands too slow? No, and HE beat Mayweather. Floyd is incredibly beatable. The guy has been feasting on hand picked opponents. The last guy he fought that you could say was the best available in his division was Castillo.

You also bring up Cotto who is only marginally faster than Tony, if he even is at all.

Mayweather doesn't have a damn thing to keep Margarito off him. Tony would MAUL Mayweather. He's got the PERFECT style for beating Floyd. Brawlers have a history of beating slick boxers.

Floyd Mayweather is one of the most overrated boxers ive ever seen. He's got this legion of nuthuggers that just think he's this untouchable boxing god.
I would take this one up but I don't even believe you're being serious.

Ok, i'm not, im joking. Sure, Floyd Mayweather is an untouchable boxing god who will smite all who oppose him. Boxing gods go on runs fighting the incredible opposition of Henry Bruseles, Corley, Arturo Gatti, Mitchell, 37 year old Baldomir, N'Dou, ancient Oscar and the incredibly dedicated and consistent Zab Judah. I just came in my trousers. That opposition is soooooo great and TOTALLY NOT hand picked.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:08

So regarding Margarito, what went wrong against the phenomenal Daniel Santos?

manchester-mexican · Post by **manchester-mexican** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:10

IMO PBF is the best out there,always does enuff 2 win,and held titles at 5 weights i think, v williams = PBF wins on pts,williams gets caught 2 much
v mosely = PBF on pts this close but think he'll do a DLH
v hatton = tko late on 4 PBF
v cotto = this a 50-50 PBF needs 2 keep clear win on pts

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:15

Kilburn wrote:So regarding Margarito, what went wrong against the phenomenal Daniel Santos?

Cuts from headclashes, twice no less. And imo Margarito was on his way to stopping Santos when it got stopped, in Santos hometown btw. That fight was fought at lightmiddle and Santos is hardly a bum.

Im not claiming that Margarito is the best fighter in the world, just that he would give Floyd the beating of his life.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:18

No way on earth was Margarito about to beat Santos. He was getting outboxed.

I really don't know what you think Margarito has that Mayweather couldn't deal with.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:30

The Santos fight was a horrible style clash if you remember, and with many headclashes kept busting up Margarito every time an exchange happened. And I remember Margarito really getting into Santos when it was stopped, imo he was on his way to victory. Btw, Santos can hit, Floyd can not. It makes a difference.

What do I see in Tony? Question. Did you watch the Baldomir and Castillo fights? They tell you everything you need to know. Shit, even the Oscar fight. Thats not even Oscars style yet even he at his age was able to bully Floyd.

You've got a big, rugged and hardhitting welterweight who can fight 3 minutes of every round. Thats all he needs. Its all the ingredients that Floyd has avoided as he moved up in weight.

You people need to stop believing the hype and go look at Floyds record and see it for the trash it really is.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:38

Williams is not some kind of demigod. Antonio owned him over the 2nd half. Those southpaw slaps and pitty pats don't all count. I don't count windmill punching among the my scoring criteria.

That said, Williams is too big for most welters and far too big for anyone below welter. How can Hatton be ducking Paul Williams LOL.

When Williams goes over welter and light middle he's a dead duck. He won't be the same against fighters near his own size / more powerful than him.

I keep thinking of Munyai bashing up good bantam/fly fighters and then doing horribly against a guy from a bigger weight...bet Williams will be like that.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:48

Lefthookhappy19 wrote:The Santos fight was a horrible style clash if you remember, and with many headclashes kept busting up Margarito every time an exchange happened. And I remember Margarito really getting into Santos when it was stopped, imo he was on his way to victory. Btw, Santos can hit, Floyd can not. It makes a difference.

What do I see in Tony? Question. Did you watch the Baldomir and Castillo fights? They tell you everything you need to know. Shit, even the Oscar fight. Thats not even Oscars style yet even he at his age was able to bully Floyd.

You've got a big, rugged and hardhitting welterweight who can fight 3 minutes of every round. Thats all he needs. Its all the ingredients that Floyd has avoided as he moved up in weight.

You people need to stop believing the hype and go look at Floyds record and see it for the trash it really is.

De La Hoya is 33 for gods sake. Hardly on his last legs. Are you trying to imply that Margarito would succeed where De La Hoya failed? Rugged aggression is not enough to beat Mayweather on it's own. He's reacts far too quickly. You need speed and Margarito doesn't have it, not in Mayweather's world.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 16:59

Kilburn wrote:
Lefthookhappy19 wrote:The Santos fight was a horrible style clash if you remember, and with many headclashes kept busting up Margarito every time an exchange happened. And I remember Margarito really getting into Santos when it was stopped, imo he was on his way to victory. Btw, Santos can hit, Floyd can not. It makes a difference.

What do I see in Tony? Question. Did you watch the Baldomir and Castillo fights? They tell you everything you need to know. Shit, even the Oscar fight. Thats not even Oscars style yet even he at his age was able to bully Floyd.

You've got a big, rugged and hardhitting welterweight who can fight 3 minutes of every round. Thats all he needs. Its all the ingredients that Floyd has avoided as he moved up in weight.

You people need to stop believing the hype and go look at Floyds record and see it for the trash it really is.
De La Hoya is 33 for gods sake. Hardly on his last legs. Are you trying to imply that Margarito would succeed where De La Hoya failed? Rugged aggression is not enough to beat Mayweather on it's own. He's reacts far too quickly. You need speed and Margarito doesn't have it, not in Mayweather's world.

Oscar is a part time fighter these days. Oscar coming into the Mayweather fight had lost 3 of his last 4 fights. Im including the Sturm fight as a loss because that was a stone cold 116-112 robbery. Oscar is naturally smaller than Tony also.

This is a style match up im talking about also. You're not going to beat Mayweather by boxing with him. You've got to fight him and thats not Oscars style. You'll notice the rounds that Oscar actually won was when he pushed Floyd back and tried to rough him up. Thats a totally natural thing for Margarito. Floyd loses rounds against Tony simply because he would be on the defensive too much. Floyd only occasionily fights back when he gets backed up. Its how Castillo beat him.

Carbo · Post by **Carbo** » 15 Jul 2007, 17:08

That's one thing that people forget. Some criticise Hatton's opposition, but it's been a huge amount better than Mayweather's over their respective last six.

Judah was acceptable, but not much more given his huge inconsistencies. Oscar was a good choice, but he's well past his best, and the fight was more about the size difference than anything. What was astonishing was that is was the first time Mayweather had faced an opponent with a realistic chance of beating him for 5 years.

Sosa, Brussles, Mitchell -- all of them might have been acceptable as a one off, as would Gatti, as a crowd pleasing, money making affair. But in combination they're abysmal for a man of Floyd's exceptional ability.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 17:17

Carbo wrote:That's one thing that people forget. Some criticise Hatton's opposition, but it's been a huge amount better than Mayweather's over their respective last six.

Judah was acceptable, but not much more given his huge inconsistencies. Oscar was a good choice, but he's well past his best, and the fight was more about the size difference than anything. What was astonishing was that is was the first time Mayweather had faced an opponent with a realistic chance of beating him for 5 years.

Sosa, Brussles, Mitchell -- all of them might have been acceptable as a one off, as would Gatti, as a crowd pleasing, money making affair. But in combination they're abysmal for a man of Floyd's exceptional ability.

Its the truth. Its shocking that for a guy who is supposed to be as good he and his fans will tell you that he really hasn't fought anyone in years. Certainly not a young hungry fighter of which their was many at welter. Yet Mayweather chose Mitchell, Gatti ect. Carlos Baldomir was also tailor made to lose to Floyd. Old with no punch and can only fight in spurts. Ol'Floyd jumped at that fight alright.

Hatton's record doesn't stack up bad at all with his.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 15 Jul 2007, 17:17

You say it like all fighters are able and willing to face Mayweather, all of the time. I don't believe there is a fighter out there that Mayweather doesn't believe he can beat clearly. I can't imagine he has many sleepless nights thinking about that crude style of Margarito.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 15 Jul 2007, 17:23

Slick polished skills aren't everything. Boxing is a fight after all. Brawlers are and always have been the answer to fancy dans like Mayweather. What? Are you suggesting that another polished boxer is the style to beat Mayweather? No. He must be fought and mauled and thats Margarito's natural style.