Ellis 1968 vs. Patterson 1958

bill.lockhart · Post by **bill.lockhart** » 22 Jun 2007, 13:32

I thought Floyd beat him in 68. How would the 58 version have made out?
Ellis was better than Harris, who he stopped in 12 in a one sided fight that year. I think Floyd would have had more stamina than in 68, & was quicker to boot. It would still have been close. Ellis was good, but I think Floyd wins.

Robinson · Post by **Robinson** » 24 Jul 2007, 21:42

I think that Patterson was robbed with the decision against Ellis as well.

The 1968 Patterson was obviously less protective and seemed to have a better understanding of his capabilities and weaknesses. I think the speed and combinations of Patterson as a young man in 1958 would most likely earn a late round stoppage over Ellis.

When I watch Patterson especially in his mid 60s fights up until his Ali rematch I get frustrated as I wish he would let the trigger go just that bit more. He had the speed, the dynamism and the power. Yet he would be passive at times. I suppose his fragile chin was in part to do with this.

Kym

Minotauro · Post by **Minotauro** » 25 Jul 2007, 09:37

I think Patterson should have got the decision when they fought, a younger Patterson with even quicker hands would win most likely via stoppage Floyd had good power especially in his left.

I Feel Fine · Post by **I Feel Fine** » 26 Jul 2007, 06:15

I haven't seen the fight but its said to be one of the biggest robberies in boxing history. So, if an old Patterson could beat Ellis, imagine what a prime Patterson would do to him.

Patterson also beat Chuvalo, Machen and Bonavena after his title reign, many people have argued that his best wins came after he was champion.

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 26 Jul 2007, 09:22

The extremely biased announcing clouds people's judgements.

Patterson had the biggest moments and flashier flurries.

But judging round by round, Ellis won the fight. Patterson was way too lethargic for 2 min of most of the rounds.

Woller · Post by **Woller** » 27 Jul 2007, 01:34

1958 Floyd Patterson would be too fast for Ellis and win on points or late stoppage.

In the Ellis v Patterson fight, Ellis did not win - Petterson Lost. Floyd sleapwalked through th fight, and in several rounds he hardly threw a punch.

The Floyd Patterson that beat Bonavena and Chuvalo, would have torn Ellis to pieces.

Woller

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 27 Jul 2007, 09:19

Woller wrote:1958 Floyd Patterson would be too fast for Ellis and win on points or late stoppage.

In the Ellis v Patterson fight, Ellis did not win - Petterson Lost. Floyd sleapwalked through th fight, and in several rounds he hardly threw a punch.

The Floyd Patterson that beat Bonavena and Chuvalo, would have torn Ellis to pieces.

Woller

Patterson beat Chuvalo in 65 and Oscar in 72 . . .neither was the 1958 Floyd.

I'm don't have a definitive pick on this one, but I do think Ellis always gives Floyd problems with his style. Chuvalo and Oscar were both straight ahead come forward brawlers, while Ellis, like Floyd, was a small HW with fast hands, good lateral movement, and very good power for his size. Ellis with his jab and movement always gives Floyd issues.

Woller · Post by **Woller** » 27 Jul 2007, 14:48

Yes you are perfectly right. I don´t know what happened that night in Sweden. Any other time Floyd should have beaten Ellis

Woller

Robinson · Post by **Robinson** » 12 Sep 2007, 19:07

Having no judges and just the Reef score the fight is old fashioned and silly, which had an influence on the controversy.

Kym