Boxing program to be cancelled at Northern Michigan

emile · Post by **emile** » 01 Aug 2007, 10:57

They decided it was too expensive.

http://miningjournal.net/stories/articl ... leID=18233

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 01 Aug 2007, 11:42

That would be a shame as it is the only school that has a boxing program with some scholarships for the athletes. I would hate to see it go as I was hoping that more programs would be developed throughout the country in places like Brownsville, TX among others.

JohnDoe · Post by **JohnDoe** » 01 Aug 2007, 13:52

This is a good cut. I don't understand why they would put a boxing program in Northern Michigan anyways. It's like having a swim program in the Sahara desert. I mean, who were they sparring with up there? The trees?

They should take the amount of money they do have available for a college boxing program and made scholarships for qualified boxers going to ANY college and a small stipend for their own trainers.

And I hope this means no more Junior Olympics in Marquette. Put it in a place that is cheap to get to in a big city with lots of potential spectators. You can't get good publicity and popularity for boxing if you hide the boxers in the woods.

squarering · Post by **squarering** » 01 Aug 2007, 17:28

Some good points Jon Doe. But I am afraid that it may not be a case of redistriuting the money in a better way, just eliminating the program.

JohnDoe · Post by **JohnDoe** » 02 Aug 2007, 02:45

No, they said it was too expensive and not on par with other sports' expenses. There just ain't no fool bright enough at USA Boxing to come up with such a plan so they are going for the straight decapitation.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 02 Aug 2007, 11:30

The program was too expensive for NMU to continue supporting. The reason is that USAB has not been funding the program like some of the other sports do. It is just another example of amateur boxing not having enough money. That is why USAB was so willing to give Michael King and A2P anything they wanted until they got worried that the USOC could shut down USAB and then they would lose their own jobs. USAB was hoping for $$$$$ to help fund the program.

USAB needs to get back to work trying to gain sponsorships, joint ventures/partnerships with other sports or companies to gain publicity for our sport and to gain funding. Other sports can do it and as you can see by pro boxing, MMA and Wrestling there is a demand for fighting sports. It is all about marketing and getting people to spend money on our sport.

Doe - you are right that we need to have people see our sport. You would be surprised at how many people have told me that they saw me coaching on TV at the National Golden Gloves this year. That was on a cable/satellite channel that not everyone gets, but a lot of people watched it. If we could get TV - even more obscure channels to show the National Junior Olympics, U.S. Championships, National Silver Gloves, National PAL, Ringside, Nat'l GG, etc. our sport would flourish. We also need to put more butts in the seats locally. Again it is marketing. Our local GG puts 2,000+ in the audience for each night of our tournament. I think we could do even better. I'm hoping that we can demonstrate that by having a lot of people show for the Nat'l GG next year.

Any thoughts Hal?

squarering · Post by **squarering** » 02 Aug 2007, 13:24

Oh don't get me started. People have to understand that although marketing is an expense, it is also a investment in the future of a bussiness or sport. I know first hand that in bussiness when things get tight, that is not the time to cut back on advertising and promotion. Yet, most people think if we don't have extra money don't advertise. WRONG. Thats is a fast track to bankruptcy, It is true you can't spend money you don't have, but if you plan on being around a while then your FIRST priority is to beg, borrow, or do whatever to get it. Hey just cause I taught bussiness at Harvard for 30 years donsn't make me an expert.LOL

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 02 Aug 2007, 15:05

This is a good cut. I don't understand why they would put a boxing program in Northern Michigan anyways.

Why specifically do you think it's a good cut? And do you know anything about the NMU program? Doesn't sound like it.

It's like having a swim program in the Sahara desert. I mean, who were they sparring with up there? The trees?

Teammates in their own weights; competitions with adjoining states and Canada.

They should take the amount of money they do have available for a college boxing program and made scholarships for qualified boxers going to ANY college and a small stipend for their own trainers.

USAB doesn't have any money available for a college boxing program. The NMU program has been subsidized by the USOC for years - giving boxers the chance at a free credential or college degree while being able to box. USAB couldn't begin to give scholarships of that magnitude to qualified boxers - there isn't enough money in the world for that. And why would you give a stipend to a personal coach who's boxer is in college? That doesn't make sense. NMU is the ONLY college that has a boxing program for open boxers. No other college does.

And I hope this means no more Junior Olympics in Marquette. Put it in a place that is cheap to get to in a big city with lots of potential spectators. You can't get good publicity and popularity for boxing if you hide the boxers in the woods.

You are obviously not aware that USAB puts its national tournaments out to bid and takes the best offer it gets. NMU has always been the lowest in cost for food and housing. I personally like it, but not everyone does. The tournament has been held in other cities in years past with the same low-to-no spectator response. Marquette does, however, support the tournament - there is great local publicity and reporting.

Frankly, amateur boxing is not a very popular sport no matter where it's showcased. The Los Angeles Times, for instance, didn't even report the Pan Am Games results until Karl Dargan won a gold and then they did a very small blurb because it's his last amateur event. We had a contract with ESPN some years ago and they showed the Championships at 2 in the morning.

Hopefully Millman will be able to turn things around. I'm not holding my breath.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 02 Aug 2007, 17:56

Mel - I agree with you that the JO tourney hasn't had great fan support whereever it has been held. Same thing for the US Championships. That needs to change. There are some boxing shows that draw 10-20 fans and others that draw 2,500-5,000 or more. Shows can make money with as few as 50 fans with the right sponsorships. There was a JO or Silver Gloves Tourney in Michigan where the host made money before one ticket was sold. The host had sold advertising and sponsorships which included some free tickets (many of which were not even used). The facility was provided by a sponsor as were the trophies/medals and other costs. That is the way to do it. It was probably a lot of work I'm sure, but his club raised money.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 02 Aug 2007, 17:59

Mel - I too hope Millman or people he hires (or outsources to another company) really start to market amateur boxing properly. I would love to see people clamoring for tickets to local shows.

JohnDoe · Post by **JohnDoe** » 02 Aug 2007, 19:07

Yes, I know about the NMU program and don't think it has drawn the best boxers in the country and it's not that great of an academic school anyways. It draws decent boxers who want a free education.

A better program:

20 or 30 partial scholarships to athletes around the country who get accepted at their local 4-year universities with in-state tuition. They live at home, train with their coaches who know them and get some money for school. Plus, most boxers are minorities and lower income so they should get financial aid anyways from any school if they have the grades. If the USOC has been funding this program at NMU, they must have some money for a better program. Their personal coaches should get a stipend as well because most of the time they are the prime source of a boxer's success and struggle like hell to keep their gym's going (i.e. Lennox Lewis' story). This would also start making coaches push education more if they would reap the benefits.

As far as Marquette, there were about 20 spectators at the last J.O.s and flights (the most expensive thing) were about $700r/t from the coasts. I'm not sure how they do the bidding process but it's not working and they need to be more aggressive about marketing and building a spectator base in major cities that carries from year to year.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 02 Aug 2007, 19:36

Yes on the marketing. Regarding your other comments, it's always nice to dream but reality is another story. Yes, some of our top boxers have gone there - Brian Viloria, Samson Guillermo, Davarryl Williamson, Anthony Stewart, and others. The purpose has always been to educate the kids while giving them a chance to also box. It also saved a few lives. It was never intended to be an "elite" operation.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 03 Aug 2007, 23:40

I don't want to see it go away. NMU is a good school. It is way up in the U.P. which is definitely NOT FOR EVERYONE. Winter on Lake Superior!!! I don't know how all the Hawaiian boxers have handled it.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 04 Aug 2007, 15:16

Considering none of the Hawaiian boxers graduated.........

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 04 Aug 2007, 16:52

I though Viloria graduated. Several of them have been up there for several years which would be a real shock coming from a tropical paradise and going to a winter wonderland.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 04 Aug 2007, 17:12

None of them graduated - and, yes, they didn't do the cold too well.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 04 Aug 2007, 20:21

I was born in Michigan, but Marquette might be a little too cold and remote for me. The remote nature of the school can be a big benefit for students since all there is to do is study - LOL.

Kolya · Post by **Kolya** » 04 Aug 2007, 20:24

My Uncle went to Marquette...I think he lasted about a semester.

(that, and my grandfather is from Barraga, in the UP).

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 04 Aug 2007, 20:31

That's funny Kolya.

rickyraytaylor · Post by **rickyraytaylor** » 07 Aug 2007, 00:34

- and word is though that there was a strong undercurrent that swept the program out to sea in the form of LETTERS written by some of the programs athletes.
Basically, the IDEA seemed well enough (combining SCHOOL & TRAINING) yet the overall system was flawed in regards to being too one sided.

'nuff said.

Kolya · Post by **Kolya** » 07 Aug 2007, 00:37

rickyraytaylor wrote:- and word is though that there was a strong undercurrent that swept the program out to sea in the form of LETTERS written by some of the programs athletes.
Basically, the IDEA seemed well enough (combining SCHOOL & TRAINING) yet the overall system was flawed in regards to being too one sided.

'nuff said.

Completely off topic; but were you down at Ringside? I think I saw you.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 07 Aug 2007, 10:18

rickyraytaylor wrote:- and word is though that there was a strong undercurrent that swept the program out to sea in the form of LETTERS written by some of the programs athletes.
Basically, the IDEA seemed well enough (combining SCHOOL & TRAINING) yet the overall system was flawed in regards to being too one sided.

'nuff said.

Did the athletes think that the program was too focused on the boxing? Most college sports (at least at the D1 level) are very focused on the sport and make huge demands on the athletes. However, if they are getting their education paid for they shouldn't complain too much. Try getting a job and working enough hours to pay for the housing, meals, tuition, books and fees and see how much free time they have. Scholarship athletes are given a huge opportunity that most students would relish.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 07 Aug 2007, 13:51

Is there anything being done by USAB to try to prevent the program from ending? Isn't there something that we can all do to drum up support for the program? We can't afford to lose the one and only college boxing program designed to give open-class boxers an education.

What about sponsorships from corporations? There has to be someone with the necessary financial means who is willing to support the program. It could be Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Bob Arum. Golden Boy Promotions. Don King? It doesn't have to be someone directly involved in boxing. It could be someone who just loves the sport.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 07 Aug 2007, 14:02

USAB doesn't have anything to do with the NMU program. And I doubt seriously that any of the pro people, promoters and boxers, will step in. They don't help in any other area. I'll see what I can find out about the program....

rickyraytaylor · Post by **rickyraytaylor** » 07 Aug 2007, 16:57

Kolya wrote:
rickyraytaylor wrote:- and word is though that there was a strong undercurrent that swept the program out to sea in the form of LETTERS written by some of the programs athletes.
Basically, the IDEA seemed well enough (combining SCHOOL & TRAINING) yet the overall system was flawed in regards to being too one sided.

'nuff said.
Completely off topic; but were you down at Ringside? I think I saw you.

Yep, i was there. i was one of the unfortuanate souls who smacked his opponent around (*in between getting picked up and BODYSLAMMED) for 3 minute and a half rounds - then lost due to the horrific judging.
What to do?
So much for a GLORIOUS combeback after almost 2 decades!

Boxing program to be cancelled at Northern Michigan

Boxing program to be cancelled at Northern Michigan

I graduated from the NMU/OEC program -

Re: I graduated from the NMU/OEC program -

Re: I graduated from the NMU/OEC program -

Re: I graduated from the NMU/OEC program -