U.S. Olympic Team - ages

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 28 Aug 2007, 12:35

Ok, the U.S. typicaly has a young team and it won't be any different for the '08 Olympics in Beijing. The tourney will be in August 2008. If all the boxers qualify for the Olympics, our team will consist of 4 teenagers, 6 guys in their early 20's, and our oldest Olympic boxer ever at 34.

Luis Yanez will still be a teenager, but he will be 20 within 2 months after the Olympics
Rau'shee Warren will be 21 and boxing in his second Olympics. Maybe he will want to win 2 gold medals and he will stick around for the 2012 Olympics. Yea right!
Gary Russell will be 20
Raynell Williams will only be 19
Sadam Ali will still be 19, but will turn 20 the month after the Olympics.
Javier Molina will be the youngest member of the team at 18
Demetrius Andrade will only be 20, but he seems like he has been around forever.
Shawn Estrada will be the second oldest guy on the team at only 23 years of age.
Christopher Downs will be the elder statesman at 34 years of age. It is reported that he will be the oldest U.S. boxer to compete in an Olympic Games.
Deontay Wilder will be the third oldest boxer on the team at 22, but he will turn 23 within 2 months of the Olympics. He will also be the team member with the fewest number of bouts and will have just under 3 years of experience.
Michael Hunter will have just turned 20 before the olympics which is very young for a super-heavy boxer in the Olympics.

Now the discussion begins - do you think the team is too young? Remember the guy who is most likely to win a gold medal will only be 21 and will be competing in his second Olympics.

At 106 - Ceron would have been almost 26
At 112 - Alafa would have been 25
At 119 - Jessy Cruz and Alexis Ramos both would have been 25
At 125 - Rosey Summerville would have been 28 I believe
At 132 - James Villa would have been 27
At 141 - Brad Solomon would have been 25
At 152 - Mahlon Kerwick would have been 27 and Boyd Melson would have been 26 almost 27
At 165 - The oldest guy from the Trials - Shawn Estrada at age 23 won
At 178 - Downs was clearly the oldest guy in the 178# division at the trials. Let's see if his maturity can help him win a medal
At 201 - Zimmerman would have been 30 almost 31
At 201+ - William Moore would have been 34 just like Downs. Shepherd would have been at least 26. Nate James would have been almost 27.

Would we have done better with any of the older guys on the team?

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 28 Aug 2007, 12:59

Keep in mind that sticking around for another Olympics, there is no guarantee of success. Three of the 2004 Olympic runners-up competed in the Olympic Trials for the 2008 Olympics. All 3 again came up a little short in their quest to make it to the Olympics. The 3 boxers were 106# Diego Hurtado, 112# Aaron Alafa and 201+# Mike Wilson.

There were others who competed in the '04 Olympic Trials and didn't make it and stuck around and tried again. Each one of them fell short again this time.

The Military athletes are typically much older and yet only one of the 12 who competed in the Olympic Trials made the Olympic team. The only one to make it was Chris Downs.

emile · Post by **emile** » 28 Aug 2007, 14:18

As I've mentioned before, I don't think age has much to do with anything. If you had the older fighters, the team would do worse because they are simply not as good. I think your examples are pretty strong proof that being older doesn't mean much, if anything.

The older Cubans and Russians are great because they are simply great amateur boxers. The only way having older boxers is going to help the US is if the older boxers are the best in the country who have stuck around for more than one Olympics.

Roberts J · Post by **Roberts J** » 28 Aug 2007, 19:51

Every one is so young compared to the Europeanas. In Europe alot of them would still be boxing in U-19 Championships waiting there turn. Interesting.

sweetscience · Post by **sweetscience** » 29 Aug 2007, 08:49

with it not being about power as much i dont think its makes a great deal of difference with age

i think only khan scored the only KO in the last olympics (and he was the 2nd youngest entrant i believe)

hurricanemitch14 · Post by **hurricanemitch14** » 29 Aug 2007, 12:36

the only boxers that are at a real disadvantage is micheal hunter and deontay wilder and not just b/c of age but b/c there hardly no experience.....i mean wilder's record is what like 20 - 1 and i'm not sure what micheal hunter's is but it can't be far off from wilder's.......by the way if anyone knows his record please tell me but anyways the guys from europe have a hundred of fight and international experience....thats the kicker here

ringsidemike · Post by **ringsidemike** » 29 Aug 2007, 13:45

Wilder hasnt lost an open division bout yet, is 21-0 now after the trials.

Kolya · Post by **Kolya** » 29 Aug 2007, 14:22

sweetscience wrote:with it not being about power as much i dont think its makes a great deal of difference with age

i think only khan scored the only KO in the last olympics (and he was the 2nd youngest entrant i believe)

Do you mean KO as in actually knocked out; or just RSC'd? Because I know Povetkin RSC'd Sergei Ruzhnov in his first fight in Athens.

sweetscience · Post by **sweetscience** » 29 Aug 2007, 15:11

i think khans win against the korean? was scored as the only KO

im sure there were a few rsc etc

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 30 Aug 2007, 19:39

ringsidemike wrote:Wilder hasnt lost an open division bout yet, is 21-0 now after the trials.

Deontay lost before or are you just not counting his novice bouts. I know that he did not win the Southeastern Regional GG last year. I know that he has done phenomenally well in such a short period of time, but I'm pretty sure he has lost at least 1 bout.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:03

i'm not sure what micheal hunter's is but it can't be far off from wilder's.......by the way if anyone knows his record please tell me

As I posted elsewhere, I don't know his exact record but he had his 31st bout in the finals of the Trials.

Thanks for the clarification on Wilder, Dennis. There isn't any amateur who has a zero loss record.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:06

No Mel, that isn't true. I have a boxer who is 2-0! LOL. There are very few elite level amateurs who only have one or two losses. Once they get to national and international tournaments they usually lose once in awhile. Andre Ward was pretty impressive in that he hadn't lost in at least several years prior to the Olympics. What a way to end your amateur career. Several years of top level competition without a loss.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:28

No Mel, that isn't true. I have a boxer who is 2-0! LOL.

Groan.

There are very few elite level amateurs who only have one or two losses.

Yep - I can't think of any with less than 5 losses (Oscar only had 5 in his amatuer days, 4 as a JO and 1 as an open).

Andre Ward was pretty impressive in that he hadn't lost in at least several years prior to the Olympics.

He hadn't lost in, I believe, 7 years before competing in the Olympics. Last loss was to Jesus Gonzales as a JO at the Blue & Gold in 1997, or 1998 (can't remember). He also did not go on many international trips that he was asked to participate in. And still got a gold!

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:33

He was trying to protect his winning streak and going overseas is risky for that streak.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:37

He was trying to protect his winning streak and going overseas is risky for that streak.

That's not what his coach told me. Virgil didn't want him training and being coached by anyone other than him. It worked.

holeymoley99 · Post by **holeymoley99** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:39

Mark was 110-1 in his amateur career and topped it off by winning a Gold Medal. Possibly the best amateur we ever had.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 31 Aug 2007, 15:43

boxmel wrote:
He was trying to protect his winning streak and going overseas is risky for that streak.
That's not what his coach told me. Virgil didn't want him training and being coached by anyone other than him. It worked.

It worked! So there we have it. A personal coach was the reason for our only gold medal in '04. I know that Leon "Bumper" Lawson was also very active in Andre Dirrell's training and he won the only other medal for the U.S. in boxing in '04. I still say we shouldn't alienate the personal coaches. Let them continue to be involved and use Colo Springs as a supplement.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 31 Aug 2007, 18:38

Yes, Dennis, it worked in Andre's case. However, it did keep him from getting international experience. As I have already stated, Dan is planning to involve the personal coaches at the OTC.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 31 Aug 2007, 19:58

I'm glad that Dan is involving the personal coaches. Smart move on his part. They can help him with learning what makes each guy tick. Dan would figure it out anyway, but it helps to get additional info from people close to the boxers.

mich3102 · Post by **mich3102** » 03 Sep 2007, 11:55

deontay has lost twice. He lost in the finals of the Alabama GGs but went on to the regionals bc the guy who beat him retired after the bout.
He then won one and out in the southern gg's.

JohnDoe · Post by **JohnDoe** » 03 Sep 2007, 12:42

boxmel wrote:
He was trying to protect his winning streak and going overseas is risky for that streak.
That's not what his coach told me. Virgil didn't want him training and being coached by anyone other than him. It worked.

Hmmmm.....I guess at least one other person understands why a boxer's longtime personal coach is better than a whole super hi-tech residential
training camp.

It's like taking Luke Skywalker from Yoda and sending him to the Intergalactic Pilot Camp.

boxmel · Post by **boxmel** » 03 Sep 2007, 22:38

Understanding is one thing. Reality is another. Again, let's just wait and see if the new strategy pays off.

Dennis · Post by **Dennis** » 04 Sep 2007, 00:11

mich3102 wrote:deontay has lost twice. He lost in the finals of the Alabama GGs but went on to the regionals bc the guy who beat him retired after the bout.
He then won one and out in the southern gg's.

I knew that he had lost at least once.

U.S. Olympic Team - ages

U.S. Olympic Team - ages

Mark Breland