Ojay Abrahams ..... the final say

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 09 Oct 2007, 15:50

TerribleTerry wrote:
oliverfennell wrote: I loved when they behaved themselves by calling Takaloo a "Paki", and I did indeed love that atmosphere when you felt like you better find a different part of the arena to run to in the event Farnell lost. Same goes for Gomez and Brodie fans. Is there a theme here?

(Note: never actually did see significant crowd trouble involving these fans; just always felt like there an ever-present chance of a kick-off in the air with these guys)
Think you are being a little precious here mate - most boxers with a large support draw their fan base from football crowds and/or their local estates and pubs - alot of fighters have a selection of fans who can be a bit 'moody' and just are their for the beer, the fight itself and to have it off if the opportunity arises. Its sad but true.

You cant blame the fighter themselves. Just look at Rob McCraken for instance. He had a large loyal following and they took part in one of the largest televised riots ever at the NEC. Its what happens when big groups of drunk lads from different towns meet in a hostile atmosphere.

Rob himself is a gent and a lovely fellar - he just drew a lot of support from Brum.

No way is this exclusive to either Arnie Farnell or the manchester fighters.

Sorry if this was interpreted wrong. I did not mean these fans reflected badly on the fighters themselves, far from it. As I've said elsewhere, it's an often-quoted fact Farnell is a very nice guy. Brodie is by all accounts, too.

But even if you absolve the fighters from the fans' actions, I do maintain there's a certain "atmosphere" to Manchester fight fans. Yes, I know they are not BOXING FANS, just lads on a night out. I know they are not representative of either the average boxing fan nor the average Mancunian. But I have been to enough boxing matches in different parts of the UK involving boxers from all over the UK, and for whatever reason it is Mancunian fans who have, on average, been the most aggressive/offensive. I don't know why it is, but I'm only talking from my own experience.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 09 Oct 2007, 16:41

Farnell is a top bloke!!

I will ask you something Oliver - what excuses those men if they said what they said - NOTHING!!!

But Oliver their behaviour if they did indeed say what they said no better or worse than our behaviour on these forums in recent years - but yet you and others all too conveniently purch yourselves on that branch as if you are beyond reproach.

You all too conveniently blame me for my conduct on this and other forums yet you all too conveniently yet again fail to take a good look at yourselves in your pursuit to fit into the Boxing Forum Crowd who find it amusing to ridicule me???

And you are the better men - and of course you are the ones to keep to boxing??

Fennell I would suggest you and others conduct towards me in recent months makes you no better than those people you say called Taks what they did - they had no excuse to do it - nor do you and the merry little band you seem to grovel after.

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 09 Oct 2007, 16:58

Albert wrote:Farnell is a top bloke!!

I will ask you something Oliver - what excuses those men if they said what they said - NOTHING!!!

But Oliver their behaviour if they did indeed say what they said no better or worse than our behaviour on these forums in recent years - but yet you and others all too conveniently purch yourselves on that branch as if you are beyond reproach.

You all too conveniently blame me for my conduct on this and other forums yet you all too conveniently yet again fail to take a good look at yourselves in your pursuit to fit into the Boxing Forum Crowd who find it amusing to ridicule me???

And you are the better men - and of course you are the ones to keep to boxing??

Fennell I would suggest you and others conduct towards me in recent months makes you no better than those people you say called Taks what they did - they had no excuse to do it - nor do you and the merry little band you seem to grovel after.

spud, shut up playing the victim, if you dont like people baiting you then dont come on here at all, let alone under some poorly disguised pseudonym...

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 09 Oct 2007, 17:03

rhino222 wrote:
Albert wrote:Farnell is a top bloke!!

I will ask you something Oliver - what excuses those men if they said what they said - NOTHING!!!

But Oliver their behaviour if they did indeed say what they said no better or worse than our behaviour on these forums in recent years - but yet you and others all too conveniently purch yourselves on that branch as if you are beyond reproach.

You all too conveniently blame me for my conduct on this and other forums yet you all too conveniently yet again fail to take a good look at yourselves in your pursuit to fit into the Boxing Forum Crowd who find it amusing to ridicule me???

And you are the better men - and of course you are the ones to keep to boxing??

Fennell I would suggest you and others conduct towards me in recent months makes you no better than those people you say called Taks what they did - they had no excuse to do it - nor do you and the merry little band you seem to grovel after.
spud, shut up playing the victim, if you dont like people baiting you then dont come on here at all, let alone under some poorly disguised pseudonym...

The expected reaction.

Arnie · Post by **Arnie** » 09 Oct 2007, 17:12

well Spud you must be right because you are the expert. Anyway the past is the past.

Why have you changed your name

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 09 Oct 2007, 17:14

Arnie wrote:well Spud you must be right because you are the expert. Anyway the past is the past.

Why have you changed your name

Its getting changed back when it suits me.

Whilst you are here - how is the gym?

Who have you got coming through?

el_grande_mauro_mina · Post by **el_grande_mauro_mina** » 09 Oct 2007, 17:44

Albert wrote:Farnell is a top bloke!!

I will ask you something Oliver - what excuses those men if they said what they said - NOTHING!!!

But Oliver their behaviour if they did indeed say what they said no better or worse than our behaviour on these forums in recent years - but yet you and others all too conveniently purch yourselves on that branch as if you are beyond reproach.

You all too conveniently blame me for my conduct on this and other forums yet you all too conveniently yet again fail to take a good look at yourselves in your pursuit to fit into the Boxing Forum Crowd who find it amusing to ridicule me???

And you are the better men - and of course you are the ones to keep to boxing??

Fennell I would suggest you and others conduct towards me in recent months makes you no better than those people you say called Taks what they did - they had no excuse to do it - nor do you and the merry little band you seem to grovel after.

Thats a Classic Spud post! You did a good job keeping up a disguise! But your unmasking was hardly Kendo Nagasaki was it? Welcome back potato man!

I sincierly meant what I said by PM, and I hope to see you posting more!

Arnie · Post by **Arnie** » 10 Oct 2007, 03:39

We have moved over the road now into some better premises spudders. Got some really good lads coming through mate. They all have ability to go very very far.

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 10 Oct 2007, 03:55

Arnie wrote:We have moved over the road now into some better premises spudders. Got some really good lads coming through mate. They all have ability to go very very far.

Bloody hell mate - the gym you had was bloody brilliant - are you talking an even bigger place - the last one was big enough!!!

Positive you will cause a stir - I am even considering coming to see you again to give some of my expert advice!!!

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 10 Oct 2007, 04:24

Albert wrote:Farnell is a top bloke!!

I will ask you something Oliver - what excuses those men if they said what they said - NOTHING!!!

But Oliver their behaviour if they did indeed say what they said no better or worse than our behaviour on these forums in recent years - but yet you and others all too conveniently purch yourselves on that branch as if you are beyond reproach.

You all too conveniently blame me for my conduct on this and other forums yet you all too conveniently yet again fail to take a good look at yourselves in your pursuit to fit into the Boxing Forum Crowd who find it amusing to ridicule me???

And you are the better men - and of course you are the ones to keep to boxing??

Fennell I would suggest you and others conduct towards me in recent months makes you no better than those people you say called Taks what they did - they had no excuse to do it - nor do you and the merry little band you seem to grovel after.

Equating me for having a pop at your name-dropping with people shouting racist abuse in a public arena is hardly fair.

But OK, I'll be man enough to admit I have had pops at you on here without you having said anything untowards first.

Unfortunately you and I (as with a great many people, it would seem) have "history". Before the UKBP days, I knew nothing of you. I saw how other people reacted to you at UKBP and heard their warnings but decided to make my own mind up. Because we were involved with the same site, I bent over backwards to be friendly with you, but it was always an uphill battle. I'm sure you won't accept it, but I NEVER did you any wrong (certainly any "ribbing" was nothing I wouldn't do to anyone else, or expect to have done to me), and yet you were always seeing insults that weren't there. It was especially maddening for you to behave like that when it was evidently OK in your book to tell people to F-off left, right and centre and question the professionalism not only of myself but of some very respected people. Things ended on a sour note at UKBP, and I put a significant chunk of blame on you, but even then I was willing to let bygones be bygones and I held the olive branch out to you, even when I had no reason to, in an email - an email which was summarily ignored. So that was that.

Since UKBP folded, I have had no reason not to say exactly what I think about you.

Your arrival here has obviously stirred up some interest and some old ill-feeling, but you know what, with the exception of your "I'm mates with Arnie" post, I have to say you've kept your decorum.

So... I will apologise for the posts made so far which you have objected to. I realise they were uncalled for in the context of what appears to be an attempt at a fresh start for you. If you are just here to respectfully talk boxing, then I've got all the time in the world for you, and we can put everything behind us.

If that sounds good to you, then consider this a public truce. But if you don't accept, or you return to your objectional stance of before, then all bets are off. I'm man enough to apologise and hold my hand out to you and promise to keep the peace from my side.

Are you?

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 10 Oct 2007, 08:36

Having given some more thought to this, my olive branch is proferred with a condition...

Comparing me to racist thugs who call someon a p*ki is really out of order.

On the one hand, I have criticised you for matters of your personality; matters which I am not alone in criticising you for, and matters which you are solely responsible for and are capable of changing. No doubt you will argue changes do not to be made, and so be it, but my point is I have been criticising ONE person who I actually know, and his PERSONALITY.

On the other hand, you have a group of thugs who are slinging HATE towards a person they have never met and are doing so solely because his skin is a different colour.

How you can compare these two scenarios is beyond me and to be honest that's pretty offensive and, to be honest, quite pitiful. One man comparing his own plight with that of an entire race.

Now, what I said in the previous post stands in so far as I will talk boxing with you, if that is all you are here for. But as for the apology - I withdraw it until you apologise to me for labelling me in the same bracket as confirmed racists.

G-man · Post by **G-man** » 10 Oct 2007, 08:48

Terry D wrote:Ojay sent the career of Donovan Smillie off the tracks also. Donovan came in dressed as a gladiator and found that Ojay was not ready to play the role of Christian to his lion.

I was at that fight - Ojay came to the ring dressed as santa if i remember correctly.

It was some left hook anyway.

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 10 Oct 2007, 08:59

Some small hall promoter should give Ojay a winnable 100th fight at Watford Town Hall.

John Price did it for Nigel Rafferty; an 8-rounder topping the bill at Wolverhampton Civic Hall. He even had an unofficial belt made for it. OK, so Raffo lost, but it was an EVENT and a nice way to commemorate his century. Even his opponent, Jason Brewster, came into the dressing room later and gave him a trophy.

Much better to reward services for boxing in this way than tucked down on an undercard as usual at the 100-fight mark. I'm sure plenty would turn out to support Ojay in such an event.

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » 10 Oct 2007, 11:01

Can I just say that I have never met Spud/Albert and do not know him as most on here seem to, but he comes across as a total arse from what I've read on here.

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » 10 Oct 2007, 11:32

PS I don't mean to be rude but this thread quickly turned into a sanctimonious plate of waffle :)

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 10 Oct 2007, 11:38

What do you think of my idea, then?

Would you come down south of they threw Ojay in with Wayne Wheeler for his 100th?

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » 10 Oct 2007, 11:59

Back on track...

Yes, sounds good, but Wayne would put paid to his celebrations with a trusty right uppercut/falling over on him.....

I hope he wears his lucky green and white shorts.

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 10 Oct 2007, 13:33

Captain Hook wrote:Can I just say that I have never met Spud/Albert and do not know him as most on here seem to, but he comes across as a total arse from what I've read on here..........with love and best wishes, mrs woollatt

god that made me crease up laughing !!

twenty six · Post by **twenty six** » 10 Oct 2007, 15:06

Anyway back to boxing .....
Oliver raises an interesting point.
Having been priveleged to follow boxing live for over 30 years, I thought back to whenever there have been "intimidating" atmospheres or seroius trouble.
I am not going to be popular here with some, but my biggest problems personally have always been in Wales.
The two that stand out are Robinson v Hamed and Lockett v Rhodes.
As people know I am an avid follower of Rhodes and in the nineties / early 2000's he was often on bills with the Manchester crew - Hatton, Farnell, Gomez, Jennings etc.
Often there was loads of banter but no trouble.
There is a difference between banter and outright voilence, and the two occasions I have quoted above were aweful.
There is always an atmosphere when you mix Leeds and Manchester connections as well.
It's a football thing.
The only other tricky situation I faced was at Bolton for Khan's debut.
The live transmission on ITV was cut for an alleged bomb scare but informally I was told the alarm was sett off deliberately to disperse the fans. Even the police dogs were let loose that night in the bar in the tent !!

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 10 Oct 2007, 15:17

Oliver you keep to boxing so will I - but I also have a condition - I will write what I wish in my posts and will not be dictated by you or anyone else on these boards.

I regard Arnie and many other people I have met within the sport as friends - and how I express that is up to me - I really do not give a toss what people say behind my back - when I see them people they always seem sincere when I have a beer or meet them at shows.

Respect to you and I have no problems keeping my distance from you and others unless of course there is a disagreement on boxing issues.

I have read your post over and over and actually in a strange sort of way agree with the overall tone of what you are saying - but - I have no problems with people who are coming to watch boxing - they are keeping the sport alive - you and others should realise - the point I was trying to make is their abuse is no better or worse than the abuse I have to face coming on here - that is a simple fact - what I cannot get my head around is this politically correct mad f*cking world we live in - whilst calling some a racist name is WRONG it is and I will repeat no better or worse than the conduct of some people on this and other forums.

But lets have our 9,999th attempt of keeping to boxing issues and debating them - please feel free to join my Hatton/Mayweather thread - despite my cler biaisiness and whatever motivation I have - I make some extremely valid points.

el_grande_mauro_mina · Post by **el_grande_mauro_mina** » 10 Oct 2007, 17:30

I have read your post over and over and actually in a strange sort of way agree with the overall tone of what you are saying - but - I have no problems with people who are coming to watch boxing - they are keeping the sport alive - you and others should realise - the point I was trying to make is their abuse is no better or worse than the abuse I have to face coming on here - that is a simple fact - what I cannot get my head around is this politically correct mad f*cking world we live in - whilst calling some a racist name is WRONG it is and I will repeat no better or worse than the conduct of some people on this and other forums.

You were doing so well up till then spud/albert. If you want to stick to boxing issues then I think you should but I also don't want to read your daily mail/Jon 'Fat turd' Gaunt views on 'Political correctness gone mad' either. As a middle aged white male who was probably front row when nick nick Davidson was at Mount Pleasant you really have no veichle to compare friendly online abuse you have got on here to hundreds of thugs screaming racist abuse at a fighter with their family nearby. it is not the same and you know it isn't either.

You - and you are party to this fact have instigated and involved yourself in online 'rucking' on here and on other sites so please don't compare yourself to Marvin Hagler when he knocked seven bells out of Minter please!

But lets have our 9,999th attempt of keeping to boxing issues and debating them

If you could do that too please and leave your daily mail/talk sport opinions at the RBL I would appreciate that also.

rhino222 · Post by **rhino222** » 10 Oct 2007, 18:14

for the record..spud never ventured as far as the falklands......

that was me, but i did not see jim davidson at mount pleasant, but i did see the searchers in port stanley. and a hefty dose of harry hill in belize in 93.

long live the CSE shows !!!! :P

Albert · Post by **Albert** » 10 Oct 2007, 18:15

rhino222 wrote:for the record..spud never ventured as far as the falklands......

that was me, but i did not see jim davidson at mount pleasant, but i did see the searchers in port stanley. and a hefty dose of harry hill in belize in 93.

long live the CSE shows !!!! :P

For the record went to the Falklands the day after I got married!!! - sometimes you are wrong Rhino

el_grande_mauro_mina · Post by **el_grande_mauro_mina** » 10 Oct 2007, 18:27

rhino222 wrote:for the record..spud never ventured as far as the falklands......

that was me, but i did not see jim davidson at mount pleasant, but i did see the searchers in port stanley. and a hefty dose of harry hill in belize in 93.

long live the CSE shows !!!! :P

The stranglers! They were the only decent CSE act if I remember.. did you ever see them live?

oliverfennell · Post by **oliverfennell** » 11 Oct 2007, 06:21

Albert wrote:Oliver you keep to boxing so will I - but I also have a condition - I will write what I wish in my posts and will not be dictated by you or anyone else on these boards.

I regard Arnie and many other people I have met within the sport as friends - and how I express that is up to me - I really do not give a toss what people say behind my back - when I see them people they always seem sincere when I have a beer or meet them at shows.

Respect to you and I have no problems keeping my distance from you and others unless of course there is a disagreement on boxing issues.

I have read your post over and over and actually in a strange sort of way agree with the overall tone of what you are saying - but - I have no problems with people who are coming to watch boxing - they are keeping the sport alive - you and others should realise - the point I was trying to make is their abuse is no better or worse than the abuse I have to face coming on here - that is a simple fact - what I cannot get my head around is this politically correct mad f*cking world we live in - whilst calling some a racist name is WRONG it is and I will repeat no better or worse than the conduct of some people on this and other forums.

But lets have our 9,999th attempt of keeping to boxing issues and debating them - please feel free to join my Hatton/Mayweather thread - despite my cler biaisiness and whatever motivation I have - I make some extremely valid points.

Carlos said it best with regards your linking of your personal online experiences with that of racist outbursts, but you know what, let's just let it lie.

I am happy enough to discuss boxing with you and leave it at that. Of course you may write what you wish and not be dictated to by others, but clearly you have been doing something wrong all this time, because how else to explain why you have rubbed so many people up the wrong way? There's no plot between people who get together and have a strategy to discredit you! Of all the people you complain about - me, rhino, David Payne, lowersmiths, etc etc etc, the one common ingredient in all these disputes is YOU! Now I'm no statistician, but I can see what the common trend is there. If all these people are such wankers, then why can they all get along fine with each other, but fall out with THE SAME ONE PERSON?

Right, end of that. I have declared I will talk boxing with and be civil about it (to the best of my abilities). If we keep on this level, there should be no problems. What I've said to you here is just to make you think about WHY there are all these people, and then there's you. We are all decent blokes, Spud, and we all get along. You should try it too.