Norman Mailer

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » 10 Nov 2007, 11:41

RIP Norman Mailer, who did so much for boxing.

Great writer, great spirit...

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 10 Nov 2007, 11:46

RIP. I've got his book "The Fight", about The Rumble In The Jungle. Great read.

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 10 Nov 2007, 13:08

RIP Norman

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 10 Nov 2007, 15:10

RIP Norman - he had a good innings.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 10 Nov 2007, 15:18

Was a bit of a surprise hearing Mailer was dead, he was 84 but always had that air of immortality. His recent works based around Hitler's early years was controversial and that was the way Mailer wanted it, a maverick and a great Boxing fan.

R.I.P. Norman Mailer

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 10 Nov 2007, 15:21

I have got to be honest I had presumed he was already dead! so when I heard the report on the radio I was more shocked than most..

RIP - a great writer

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 10 Nov 2007, 15:35

Great loss, his book The Fight is the best book I've ever read on boxing. Just a masterpiece.

Carbo · Post by **Carbo** » 10 Nov 2007, 16:04

Wow, I'm speechless. I loved Mailer. Agree or disagree, he was hard to ignore. At 82, he probably lived more than most would in 802 years.

On an obituary somewhere it was said that Mailer was a 'man incapable of writing a dull sentence,' and that his passing reminded the writer of 'what Pound said of Yeats: "magnificent... very slightly ridiculous, but ... unquestionably the real thing."'

Anecdote: Apparently, after Sonny Liston flattened Patterson, Mailer had stayed up partying most of the night. He returned to his room early in the morning; but, instead of getting some rest, or at least a shower, had spent the remaining time before the post-fight press conference drinking some more while trying to chat up the chamber maid cleaning his room. He made Liston's victorious post fight conference but preceded to barge onto the stage and attempt to explain to Liston that he could existentially prove that Liston hadn't won, and that he, Norman Mailer, was the only man who could promote the rematch into a million dollar event.

Liston, apparently, stared in impassive, silent, disbelief as Mailer was carried out of the room on his chair.

RIP, Norman Mailer.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 10 Nov 2007, 16:11

Yeah I remember that, though I'm pretty sure Liston laughed and called Norm a drunken bum.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 10 Nov 2007, 17:21

oh, norman. never thought you'd ever leave us. what pound said of yeats i agree with but perhaps you were more than slightly ridiculous at times. certainly the real thing, though. terryD uses understatement to call you "a good writer" - i think you were a great writer, certainly a writer of great magnitude and presence. from the naked/dead through marilyn and maidstone to ali and gary gilmour. a life of brutal, magical, living, murderous sentences. norman, i raise my glass to you.

gore vidal once said normans flaws didnt detract they only served to enrich his persona further. he's gone and we'll miss this one...RIP

punchers chance · Post by **punchers chance** » 10 Nov 2007, 20:08

harrygreb wrote:oh, norman. never thought you'd ever leave us. what pound said of yeats i agree with but perhaps you were more than slightly ridiculous at times. certainly the real thing, though. terryD uses understatement to call you "a good writer" - i think you were a great writer, certainly a writer of great magnitude and presence. from the naked/dead through marilyn and maidstone to ali and gary gilmour. a life of brutal, magical, living, murderous sentences. norman, i raise my glass to you.

gore vidal once said normans flaws didnt detract they only served to enrich his persona further. he's gone and we'll miss this one...RIP

well said. Without doubt he was a man with several flaws but he possessed one of those personalities that could never be ignored.

fatton · Post by **fatton** » 10 Nov 2007, 21:57

I take it I'm the only one who thought "The Fight" was dull and too wordy then?

It reminded me of Michael Murray's autobiography, far too concerned with sounding clever than being a decent read. I accept most people will see the above line as a terrible slur on Mailer but sorry "The Fight" just didn't do it for me although I accept I could quite possibly be in a minority of 1.

RIP Norman though, I did enjoy some of his other stuff and clearly he was a great character.

KO Artist · Post by **KO Artist** » 11 Nov 2007, 05:20

MightyWarrior wrote:Yeah I remember that, though I'm pretty sure Liston laughed and called Norm a drunken bum.

Which was about the size of it.

E · Post by E » 11 Nov 2007, 05:57

Terry D wrote:Sad news, good writer on a variety of topics.

We all have to go some day....at 84 at least the old boy lived 9 years more than the average age of the British male....

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 11 Nov 2007, 06:58

RIP Norman. He's superb in When We Were Kings. The kind of guy you wanted as your Grandad!

His quote about Ali at the end of the documentary is superb. A great journalist/writer.

chris s · Post by **chris s** » 11 Nov 2007, 16:12

Great writer, but a vicious man so no accolades here

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 11 Nov 2007, 16:22

fatton wrote:I take it I'm the only one who thought "The Fight" was dull and too wordy then?

It reminded me of Michael Murray's autobiography, far too concerned with sounding clever than being a decent read. I accept most people will see the above line as a terrible slur on Mailer but sorry "The Fight" just didn't do it for me although I accept I could quite possibly be in a minority of 1.

RIP Norman though, I did enjoy some of his other stuff and clearly he was a great character.

to tell the truth, I bought it but I can't be bothered to read anything else on Ali. Never ready any of his novels even though I'm an avid reader. All I can say about Mailer is that he seems to be in just about every Ali or Tyson documentary around.

KO Artist · Post by **KO Artist** » 11 Nov 2007, 20:15

Autobarn wrote:
fatton wrote:I take it I'm the only one who thought "The Fight" was dull and too wordy then?

It reminded me of Michael Murray's autobiography, far too concerned with sounding clever than being a decent read. I accept most people will see the above line as a terrible slur on Mailer but sorry "The Fight" just didn't do it for me although I accept I could quite possibly be in a minority of 1.

RIP Norman though, I did enjoy some of his other stuff and clearly he was a great character.
to tell the truth, I bought it but I can't be bothered to read anything else on Ali. Never ready any of his novels even though I'm an avid reader. All I can say about Mailer is that he seems to be in just about every Ali or Tyson documentary around.

Like Tom Hauser Ali shrills all the way thats all they write and talk about.

What Tom Hauser knows a bout boxing or being a boxer you could write on the back of a wasps ass.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 12 Nov 2007, 05:13

A great writer and character, always enjoyable to read, even if you didn't agree with some of his political stances.
He was married 6 times, which takes some doing.

E · Post by E » 12 Nov 2007, 13:43

chris s wrote:Great writer, but a vicious man so no accolades here

What do you mean? I don't know too much about his background........

chris s · Post by **chris s** » 12 Nov 2007, 13:50

Almost killed his 2nd wife

E · Post by E » 12 Nov 2007, 13:56

chris s wrote:Almost killed his 2nd wife

More details please...

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 12 Nov 2007, 16:08

E wrote:
chris s wrote:Almost killed his 2nd wife
More details please...

According to his obituary in The Times : "... it took a bizarre act of violence to fix his place in the public’s imagination once and for all. His stormy relationship with Morales (his second wife), fuelled by alcohol and drugs, reached a climax in 1960 when he attacked her with a knife, leaving her seriously injured. The incident took place at the end of a chaotic party at which he had planned to launch a campaign to run for Mayor of New York. Mailer was temporarily committed to Bellevue psychiatric hospital, and was given a suspended sentence after pleading guilty to thirddegree assault. Far from being contrite, he preferred to play to the gallery, even publishing a one-sentence poem, Rainy Afternoon with the Wife: “So long as you use a knife, there’s some love left.”

E · Post by E » 12 Nov 2007, 16:34

chesh wrote:
E wrote:
chris s wrote:Almost killed his 2nd wife
More details please...
According to his obituary in The Times : "... it took a bizarre act of violence to fix his place in the public’s imagination once and for all. His stormy relationship with Morales (his second wife), fuelled by alcohol and drugs, reached a climax in 1960 when he attacked her with a knife, leaving her seriously injured. The incident took place at the end of a chaotic party at which he had planned to launch a campaign to run for Mayor of New York. Mailer was temporarily committed to Bellevue psychiatric hospital, and was given a suspended sentence after pleading guilty to thirddegree assault. Far from being contrite, he preferred to play to the gallery, even publishing a one-sentence poem, Rainy Afternoon with the Wife: “So long as you use a knife, there’s some love left.”

Interesting......I guess noone's perfect.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 12 Nov 2007, 16:45

Didn't Hugh McIlvanney once punch his lights out? Or was it Ernest Hemmingway.

Mailer was a very interesting character. I've not really read a great deal of his stuff, but admired his persistence and his dogged determination to rail against the establishment.

Boxing was only one of a number of topics he covered.

I found 'the fight' a bit of a chore to be honest, it was more a metaphysical treatise than anything much to do with what was actually going on in many places, but nevertheless, Mailer was a very talented writer, with a great, if in places rather obtuse use of the English language.
Worth looking at this list.