Joe Bugner shock
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Old bones Ian
- Heavyweight
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- Joined: 13 Jul 2004, 07:33
Joe Bugner shock
Really sad story in the NOTW, shows Bugner nearly crippled by a back problem, if the story is correct , he needs sticks to walk and gets feed by his wife. Can't really get out of bed
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Collins2000
- Heavyweight
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oliverfennell
- Heavyweight
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boxingchat
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 1934
- Joined: 12 Aug 2005, 05:26
everything that has come out of an SN pie hole of recent has been laughable.J wrote:to lewis? laughable.boxingchat wrote:And a bloody close second too!oliverfennell wrote:Last year, at Les Hopoate's debut, he was on Aussie TV talking (maybe tongue in cheek) of coming back to fight Hoppa. Now this...
If true, let's all send our best wishes to Britain's second-best heavyweight
bugners got a bad back, big deal, as collins said he was wandering around at a show recently this is in the NOTW.
Its just wear and tear, slow news day blah blah blah.
He has to have an op to sort his backout, well good luck but its hardly gonna shake the world is it. "Athlete has wear and tear on body shocker."
As for beinga close second to Lewis , its the word close that gets my goat.
UTTER TOSH.
Its just wear and tear, slow news day blah blah blah.
He has to have an op to sort his backout, well good luck but its hardly gonna shake the world is it. "Athlete has wear and tear on body shocker."
As for beinga close second to Lewis , its the word close that gets my goat.
UTTER TOSH.
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E
- Heavyweight
Bugner is not cl;ose to LEwis, but what other Brit heavy comes second?J wrote:bugners got a bad back, big deal, as collins said he was wandering around at a show recently this is in the NOTW.
Its just wear and tear, slow news day blah blah blah.
He has to have an op to sort his backout, well good luck but its hardly gonna shake the world is it. "Athlete has wear and tear on body shocker."
As for beinga close second to Lewis , its the word close that gets my goat.
UTTER TOSH.
Is he or isn't he? Joe Bugner, long-time British heavyweight enigma, made the News of the World last Sunday with a story on his crippling back problem, a story accompanied by harrowing photos of Joe and his glamorous wife Marlene (seen feeding her man).
Yet the couple celebrated their 30th wedding anniversary a week ago in Australia, where they live on the swanky Gold Coast, and were toasted in several local newspapers. On November 2, Bugner was at ringside on the Gold Coast to witness the Australian heavyweight title clash between Bob Mirovic and Colin Wilson. On October 29, Joe visited an Aboriginal community and called on politicians to act on the living conditions he witnessed, which again made a few newspapers Down Under.
"I can't do nothing," he said of his visit. "I can open my mouth as a heavyweight champion...and say look, I've been there, I've actually looked at this."
All pretty remarkable for a man we are told spends 20 hours a day in bed. None of the Aussie newspapers even hinted of a back problem, or a problem with mobility.
But Bugner possessed an ability to 'spin' long before New Labour. The Hungarian-born giant looked the part and talked a great fight but usually did enough to lose, even with the whole world watching. His performance against Muhammad Ali in Malaysia in 1975 is one that festers in the mind: Bugner simply came to survive. He did the same against Frank Bruno a decade later in front of a huge crowd at White Hart Lane. Bugner had been gifted verdicts over the likes of David Bey in Oz and many believed his spectacular pre-fight rhetoric, Pathetically, Bugner was heavier on the night than when he arrived in the country; Bruno, in magnificent shape, toyed with him.
Bugner took a shot but didn't punch his weight and made an early Johnny Nelson look hungry. His best performance was a loss. Joe Frazier marched into him in 1973, hurt him and made him fight for his life. Others couldn't hurt him but wanted it more. Jack Bodell forced Joe into his defensive shell and took three titles. Ron Lyle was so 'shot' he could hardly walk, but he stumbled into Joe and won a 12-round decision in Las Vegas in 1977. (This was just after Bugner's 'big' win over the horribly fragile Richard Dunn, stopped for the 10th time in his career.) Another American, Larry Middleton, floored Bugner and broke his jaw.
At European level, Joe was OK; at world level, he was a well-matched journeyman.
Yet the couple celebrated their 30th wedding anniversary a week ago in Australia, where they live on the swanky Gold Coast, and were toasted in several local newspapers. On November 2, Bugner was at ringside on the Gold Coast to witness the Australian heavyweight title clash between Bob Mirovic and Colin Wilson. On October 29, Joe visited an Aboriginal community and called on politicians to act on the living conditions he witnessed, which again made a few newspapers Down Under.
"I can't do nothing," he said of his visit. "I can open my mouth as a heavyweight champion...and say look, I've been there, I've actually looked at this."
All pretty remarkable for a man we are told spends 20 hours a day in bed. None of the Aussie newspapers even hinted of a back problem, or a problem with mobility.
But Bugner possessed an ability to 'spin' long before New Labour. The Hungarian-born giant looked the part and talked a great fight but usually did enough to lose, even with the whole world watching. His performance against Muhammad Ali in Malaysia in 1975 is one that festers in the mind: Bugner simply came to survive. He did the same against Frank Bruno a decade later in front of a huge crowd at White Hart Lane. Bugner had been gifted verdicts over the likes of David Bey in Oz and many believed his spectacular pre-fight rhetoric, Pathetically, Bugner was heavier on the night than when he arrived in the country; Bruno, in magnificent shape, toyed with him.
Bugner took a shot but didn't punch his weight and made an early Johnny Nelson look hungry. His best performance was a loss. Joe Frazier marched into him in 1973, hurt him and made him fight for his life. Others couldn't hurt him but wanted it more. Jack Bodell forced Joe into his defensive shell and took three titles. Ron Lyle was so 'shot' he could hardly walk, but he stumbled into Joe and won a 12-round decision in Las Vegas in 1977. (This was just after Bugner's 'big' win over the horribly fragile Richard Dunn, stopped for the 10th time in his career.) Another American, Larry Middleton, floored Bugner and broke his jaw.
At European level, Joe was OK; at world level, he was a well-matched journeyman.
Last edited by bennie on 21 Nov 2007, 12:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Old bones Ian
- Heavyweight
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- Joined: 13 Jul 2004, 07:33
They say boxing fans have short memories but few can forget (surely) how disappointing Joe Bugner proved in the ring. Time after time, the big man was booed out. Even in his ill-fated clash with Trinidadian Ulrich Regis at the legendary Shoreditch Town Hall in 1969, Bugner got the bird for excessive caution as he boxed to a passive eight-round decision (Regis collapsed and died a few days later; some say he picked up his brain injury in an earlier fight with Leotis Martin).
Decades before his farce with Bonecrusher Smith on the other side of the planet, Bugner was British boxing's "Who wants him?" Mickey Duff wanted him a while. He had a soft spot for the Hungarian refugee. given Duff was forced to flee Germany as a boy, and kept the faith despite a number of tame Bugner displays, punctuated by the odd flash of fire (and false hope). Bugner's 'win' over Cooper needs little documenting, and his Frazier effort was young and gutsy, but his loss to Jack Bodell defies belief. Joe had all the tools to win but opted to lose without getting hurt.
Sadly, it would become something of a trademark. Frankie Taylor labelled the fighter "Joe Palooka" and Bugner's no-show against Muhammad Ali for the world heavyweight title in 1975 was aggravated by lurid post-fight stories that he slept with five women straight after the fight (Ali, incidentally, had a real soft spot for Joe and probably supplied the women.) A similar loss to Ron Lyle in 1977 essentially forced Joe back on the road and he picked up a few paydays in the States, including one where he was floored and busted up in just two rounds by "The Acorn", before F rank Warren brought him back in an attempt to secure a money-spinning cross-promotional showdown with a young Frank Bruno.
The rivals fought a couple of the same opponents (with Bruno doing a better job) and Bugner looked particularly good destroying faded John "Dino" Dennis in three rounds at the Ally Pally in 1983. True to form, he then stank the joint out against American southpaw Danny Sutton and was back in the States, dropping a painfully dull 10-rounder to little Marvis Frazier in Atlantic City (Bugner thus became one of the few men in boxing history to lose to a father and son combination, which is not something that makes anyone go aaaahh).
He flirted with Denmark for a couple of appearances, then made his way to Oz where he could fight on Jeff Fenech undercards against shopworn, jet-lagged American names and essentially steal verdicts (the decision he got over David Bey was a blatant robbery). He did secure that showdown with Bruno in 1987 but was overweight and typically safety-first in front of 30,000 at White Hart Lane - many of whom complained afterwards they didn't see a thing.
They didn't miss much. Bruno, in fantastic shape as ever, chipped away at 37-year-old Bugner and then opened up swiftly to finish it in the eighth. Best moment of the night came when Bruno marched over to Jim Rosenthal for the post-fight interview and barked, "Where's Arry?"
Bugner continued to pick up joke wins (and joke titles) in Oz. He had durability, boxing ability - and could turn it on when he wanted to. He also knew how to sell a fight better than any white heavyweight of the last 40 years.
But his lack of fire perenially let him down.
Decades before his farce with Bonecrusher Smith on the other side of the planet, Bugner was British boxing's "Who wants him?" Mickey Duff wanted him a while. He had a soft spot for the Hungarian refugee. given Duff was forced to flee Germany as a boy, and kept the faith despite a number of tame Bugner displays, punctuated by the odd flash of fire (and false hope). Bugner's 'win' over Cooper needs little documenting, and his Frazier effort was young and gutsy, but his loss to Jack Bodell defies belief. Joe had all the tools to win but opted to lose without getting hurt.
Sadly, it would become something of a trademark. Frankie Taylor labelled the fighter "Joe Palooka" and Bugner's no-show against Muhammad Ali for the world heavyweight title in 1975 was aggravated by lurid post-fight stories that he slept with five women straight after the fight (Ali, incidentally, had a real soft spot for Joe and probably supplied the women.) A similar loss to Ron Lyle in 1977 essentially forced Joe back on the road and he picked up a few paydays in the States, including one where he was floored and busted up in just two rounds by "The Acorn", before F rank Warren brought him back in an attempt to secure a money-spinning cross-promotional showdown with a young Frank Bruno.
The rivals fought a couple of the same opponents (with Bruno doing a better job) and Bugner looked particularly good destroying faded John "Dino" Dennis in three rounds at the Ally Pally in 1983. True to form, he then stank the joint out against American southpaw Danny Sutton and was back in the States, dropping a painfully dull 10-rounder to little Marvis Frazier in Atlantic City (Bugner thus became one of the few men in boxing history to lose to a father and son combination, which is not something that makes anyone go aaaahh).
He flirted with Denmark for a couple of appearances, then made his way to Oz where he could fight on Jeff Fenech undercards against shopworn, jet-lagged American names and essentially steal verdicts (the decision he got over David Bey was a blatant robbery). He did secure that showdown with Bruno in 1987 but was overweight and typically safety-first in front of 30,000 at White Hart Lane - many of whom complained afterwards they didn't see a thing.
They didn't miss much. Bruno, in fantastic shape as ever, chipped away at 37-year-old Bugner and then opened up swiftly to finish it in the eighth. Best moment of the night came when Bruno marched over to Jim Rosenthal for the post-fight interview and barked, "Where's Arry?"
Bugner continued to pick up joke wins (and joke titles) in Oz. He had durability, boxing ability - and could turn it on when he wanted to. He also knew how to sell a fight better than any white heavyweight of the last 40 years.
But his lack of fire perenially let him down.
Last edited by bennie on 21 Nov 2007, 12:37, edited 1 time in total.
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Old bones Ian
- Heavyweight
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- Joined: 13 Jul 2004, 07:33
I'd like to put a few points across, Joe was a young kid when he came to England, without much of an identity after his family fled from Hungary. Joe only had 16/17 amateur fights, then took the plunge as an inexperienced heavyweight he was only 17, he was KO'd in his first bout.
Coming back from this his won his next 13 fights 12 by KO, he then fought Ulric Regis who died after the fight. I think this would have a big effect on a 19 year old kid , which is what Joe was.
Also he was only 21 when beating Cooper, Joe was then a hated figure in some sections of the press and public, which must have been hard to deal at his age.
I think people forget that he was a young guy when facing people like Bodell , Cooper ,Joe was only 21.
When he met Ali and Frazier he was 23.
Thats alot of pressure to put on a young guy, in 15 round fights, no wonder he sometimes froze.
Coming back from this his won his next 13 fights 12 by KO, he then fought Ulric Regis who died after the fight. I think this would have a big effect on a 19 year old kid , which is what Joe was.
Also he was only 21 when beating Cooper, Joe was then a hated figure in some sections of the press and public, which must have been hard to deal at his age.
I think people forget that he was a young guy when facing people like Bodell , Cooper ,Joe was only 21.
When he met Ali and Frazier he was 23.
Thats alot of pressure to put on a young guy, in 15 round fights, no wonder he sometimes froze.
Can you imagine Bugner being koed by Mccall and Rahman??.... or Lewis going the distance with Ali twice and also Frazier??. Some of you guys are all heart, back pain is probably one of the most painful and debilitating afflictions you can get, it can literally cripple you... I'm sure Joe wouldnt fake how bad he is?.... it must be bad for him to be having an op. I hope it goes well for him.mercman wrote:I agree that Bugner comes quite a long way behind Lewis as Britain's best heavyweight but don't confuse the fat, old 'Aussie Joe' version of Bugner with him at his best. the Bugner that went the distance with Ali first time round - in '73 - was a really good fighter. He gave Ali a proper fight. And this was a pre-Rumble in the Jungle, pre-Manilla Ali.
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Collins2000
- Heavyweight
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overhand_right
- Heavyweight
Christ have you ever seen this fight? Clearly not. Lyle was far from shot and it was a very good fight. Lyle really piled heavy leather into BUgner and you saw just how durable big Joe really must be.bennie wrote: Ron Lyle was so 'shot' he could hardly walk, but he stumbled into Joe and won a 12-round decision in Las Vegas in 1977.
at world level, he was a well-matched journeyman.
Lyle was a huge strong danergous guy that night anbd on that form would walk over guys like Wlad K or Maskaev or Ibragimov.
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overhand_right
- Heavyweight
Collins2000 wrote:Yes, it is an early HBO telecast.Old bones Ian wrote:Didn't the death of Ulric Regis(an early opponent) have a big effect on Joe, have read reports he never quite punched his weight after that.
also is there film of his loss to Ernie Shavers?
Yeah i've got it. Fook me, Shavers was mean that night!!
Shit the bed!!
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classboxer
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 218
- Joined: 25 Oct 2007, 09:34
Was Joes Bugners heart in boxing ?
maybe Joes heart was not "100%" in to boxing,many boxers are like this and under achieve,
Boxers like Joe Bugner walk to the ring and ask themselves why am i doing this ? Nerves creep in and talent goes to waste,nerves eat energy
Boxers like Joe Bugner then lose and retire because the nerves stopped them being as good as they should be
(this happens to most men who step in to the prize ring)
6 months later after retiring these boxers like Joe Bugner are shadow boxing in front of a mirror in their bedroom thinking they can be world champion,this is the story of Joe Bugner
Joe had a love hate relationship with boxing,all the same, boxing is in Joe Bugners blood,boxing is just in his blood,nerves that all
Joe did pretty good for an under achiever
maybe Joes heart was not "100%" in to boxing,many boxers are like this and under achieve,
Boxers like Joe Bugner walk to the ring and ask themselves why am i doing this ? Nerves creep in and talent goes to waste,nerves eat energy
Boxers like Joe Bugner then lose and retire because the nerves stopped them being as good as they should be
(this happens to most men who step in to the prize ring)
6 months later after retiring these boxers like Joe Bugner are shadow boxing in front of a mirror in their bedroom thinking they can be world champion,this is the story of Joe Bugner
Joe had a love hate relationship with boxing,all the same, boxing is in Joe Bugners blood,boxing is just in his blood,nerves that all
Joe did pretty good for an under achiever
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DavidPayne
- Heavyweight
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- Joined: 11 Mar 2004, 11:00
I watched Bugner v Ali in Kuala Lumpar a few years ago, having only ever seen Bugner v Bruno prior and was mightly impressed by how fluid, fast and strong he looked. He appeared more capable of beating ALi than even Bugner belioeved.
Of course, Ali may well have been able to match anything Bugner brought, but he looked ripe for the taking that night. Had Bugner had the self-belief to go for it.
He was quick, tall and had good range of shots.
Bugner, Williams, Bruno, Harrison, Sprott....we've had some complex personalities as leading British heavyweights over the years...
Of course, Ali may well have been able to match anything Bugner brought, but he looked ripe for the taking that night. Had Bugner had the self-belief to go for it.
He was quick, tall and had good range of shots.
Bugner, Williams, Bruno, Harrison, Sprott....we've had some complex personalities as leading British heavyweights over the years...