My Top 10 Hispanic fighters:

[Borinken25]

I noticed Borinken's top ten list didn't have Eder Jofre. He was a minature Carlos Monzon. Heavy hands,only lost twice,made a great comeback beating Jose Legra and Vicente Saldivar. Never fought on the East coast or Europe. Probably the most overlooked of the modern fighters. I remember when the Mexicans dominated the bantam division:Olivares,Castillo,Herrera,Martinez,and Pimentel. Jofre would have beaten them all. A very strong fighter.

I agree with you the problem is Jofre is not Hispanic, he is from Latin America, but he is not Hispanic.

[Borinken25]

So why do you get in argument if you don't know what is going on? This elmer fud always knocking down Puerto Rican fighters because he clearly hate us and other post he has become racist against Puerto Ricans. Where were you when this happen? Nowhere to be found but now you want to jump in this argument. Why? The argument with him is why should Chocolate, Perez, and Brown should be ranked ahead of Benitez, Ortiz, and Gomez and still don't hear anything that validates that. I'm still waiting.

BTW This is the reason of why I brand him ignorant,"Guys like Carlos Ortiz, Wilfred Benitez or Wilfredo Gomez by no means should be in the top 10 Latin American fighters." like always at every turn he is trying to knockdown Puerto Rican fighters. He could have made his own list without making a statement like that one that in my opinion just makes him look like an ignorant.

Hermano borinken, I was not aware of any personal feuds that might be going on in this board, nor would I want to be any part of them.

As I said, the reason I got involved in this was because it caught my eye a statement of yours where in my understanding you claimed it was "ignorant" to rank Brown, Chocolate and Pascualito ahead of Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez.

Now that you have explained why you used the word ignorant I have no disagreement with you.

As I said many times before, putting fighters in high esteem because of their nationality is not something that one should do. Nonetheless it happens more than often and I myself am guilty for it (although not as much as you, mind you :P ). However, I also believe that putting them down because of their nationality is an even worse crime.

You'd probably be surprised to find out that after Roberto Duran and Nicolino Locche my personal all time favorite latin fighter is your own Wilfred Benitez. And I'm not talking about who's the greatest, who achieved more or a p4p all time ranking. I'm just taking about my personal boxing idols. I grew up in the seventies watching him and I have never seen anyone since with the same telepathic ability to read punches as El Radar did.


Un abrazo, y que viva borinquen,

B.

No problema hermano.

[elmersalsa]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

[JAHamilton77]

The original thread is top 10 Hispanics or it could be Latin American fighters and Eder Jofre is not from a Latin American country. He is from South America, not Latin America so he should not be included. Second, Please you must be kidding or your ignorance is worst than I thought. Panama Al Brown, Kid Gavilan, Pascual Perez and Kid Chocolate ahead of Gomez, Ortiz, and Benitez. Maybe I should not take you too seriously with a post like that.

Of course Eder Jofre is Latin American. Every Brazilian is Latin American. What on earth are you talking about "He's south american but not Latin American?

Secondly, all of those names (Chocolate, GAvilan, Perez, Panama Al Brown) are GIANTS of LAtin American boxing all with a solid and valid claim to even be the best Latin American fighter ever. So I don't understand the allegation of ignorance there... at all.

Brazillians are Latin Americans, but for the most part (other than those who are actual hispanics) arent considered "Hispanic".

[Broncano]

Brazillians are Latin Americans, but for the most part (other than those who are actual hispanics) arent considered "Hispanic".

That's exactly what I said.

[Collins2000]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

You defend Puerto Ricans in this forum? Against who, FFS?

You need to get back in touch with reality, mate.

[Borinken25]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

You are racist against Puerto Ricans and you know it because I told you before, but that is another subject. How did I forget Salvador Sanchez when he is listed at number 3? Read the original post again. And you still haven’t come up with your reasoning of why Benitez, Ortiz, and Gomez do not belong in the top ten. I wonder why?

[Borinken25]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

You defend Puerto Ricans in this forum? Against who, FFS?

You need to get back in touch with reality, mate.

Thank You Collins2000.

[elmersalsa]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

.

You defend Puerto Ricans in this forum? Against who, FFS?

You need to get back in touch with reality, mate.

Puerto Rican fighters in this forum do not get a lot of credit...example given is Felix "Tito" Trinidad. Not only I defend Puerto Rican fighters, but Latin fighters as well.

[Collins2000]

I do not know why borinquen thinks I am racist against Puerto Ricans? To put Benitez, Ortiz and Gomez in the top 10 latin fighters instead of Gavilan, Perez, Brown and Chocolate is ludicrous...Hey, he forgot Salvador Sanchez with the all time great latin fighters

I defend Puerto Ricans more than anybody in this forum. But to put your countrymen in the top latin 10 greatest is more like a nationalistic thing than anything. You gotta see the records and the videos of those fighters that I am talking about borinken, and do not label me as racist, please.

first, you gotta know the meaning of racist.

.

You defend Puerto Ricans in this forum? Against who, FFS?

You need to get back in touch with reality, mate.

Puerto Rican fighters in this forum do not get a lot of credit...example given is Felix "Tito" Trinidad. Not only I defend Puerto Rican fighters, but Latin fighters as well.

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

[elmersalsa]

.

You defend Puerto Ricans in this forum? Against who, FFS?

You need to get back in touch with reality, mate.

Puerto Rican fighters in this forum do not get a lot of credit...example given is Felix "Tito" Trinidad. Not only I defend Puerto Rican fighters, but Latin fighters as well.

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Bullshit!

[Borinken25]

Puerto Rican fighters in this forum do not get a lot of credit...example given is Felix "Tito" Trinidad. Not only I defend Puerto Rican fighters, but Latin fighters as well.

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Bullshit!

That is the best you can come up.
Perhaps I was wrong maybe you are not a racist after all, you just envy our success in boxing. You still can't come up with any logical argument and all you can say is Bullshit!

Thank You Collins2000 for exposing this hater and his ignorance. Facts are facts that nobody can deny and that is killing him.

[Broncano]

Peruvians rule!

[Borinken25]

Peruvians rule!

I have been Peru twice and I’m going again next year. . Great country and beautiful people. I stay at Carmen de la Legua en el Callao. Shim pun, Callao. In el Callao they love Hector Lavoe and inclusive the have a statue of him and sport boys it’s my favorite team.

[Broncano]

Peruvians rule!

I have been Peru twice and I’m going again next year. . Great country and beautiful people. I stay at Carmen de la Legua en el Callao. Shim pun, Callao. In el Callao they love Hector Lavoe and inclusive the have a statue of him and sport boys it’s my favorite team.

People from Callao have strong ties with Puerto Ricans and the Caribbean in general... It's the salsa capital of South America.

I myself am from Lima so I have to disagree there with Sport Boys. :) My own Universitario consistently beats their behinds

[Collins2000]

Puerto Rican fighters in this forum do not get a lot of credit...example given is Felix "Tito" Trinidad. Not only I defend Puerto Rican fighters, but Latin fighters as well.

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Bullshit!

Mate, now that idiot decagon has been thrown off this forum, it's looks like you are almost ready to step up and take his place.

I knew you were lying when you said you 'defended' Puerto Rican fighters.

It was like when you said Ali was one of your favourite fighters then spent the next month leading the Ali Haters Cheer Squad.

[elmersalsa]

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Bullshit!

Mate, now that idiot decagon has been thrown off this forum, it's looks like you are almost ready to step up and take his place.

I knew you were lying when you said you 'defended' Puerto Rican fighters.

It was like when you said Ali was one of your favourite fighters then spent the next month leading the Ali Haters Cheer Squad.

To label a country for having a lot of great fighters does not mean nothing. There are a lot of countries in this world that do not practice the sport of boxing. That is why I said is BULLSHIT. I cannot see a country better than another just because they have more champions or more quality fighters than the other country. That is IGNORANCE!!!

Ali was one of my favorite fighters. If you do not believe me, then that is your business, not mine.

[elmersalsa]

Puerto Rico for it's population size has almost certainly produced more world class boxers than anywhere else.

That's all that you need to say.

Nothing more, nothing less.

Bullshit!

That is the best you can come up.
Perhaps I was wrong maybe you are not a racist after all, you just envy our success in boxing. You still can't come up with any logical argument and all you can say is Bullshit!

Thank You Collins2000 for exposing this hater and his ignorance. Facts are facts that nobody can deny and that is killing him.

What a self sense of insecurity and dispair this guy got...Me? envy of Puerto Rican boxing success??? Is that the case, I should envy England, Mexico, USA and other countries like Panama and Cuba and maybe Venezuela that have many champions just like Puerto Rico. I am going to envy a country that ONLY has 24 or 25 world champions and of those 24 or 25 ONLY 3 were undisputed world champions? GIMMIE A BREAK!!!

NOW I AM IGNORANT ACCORDING TO THIS PUERTO RICAN

[Borinken25]

Bullshit!

That is the best you can come up.
Perhaps I was wrong maybe you are not a racist after all, you just envy our success in boxing. You still can't come up with any logical argument and all you can say is Bullshit!

Thank You Collins2000 for exposing this hater and his ignorance. Facts are facts that nobody can deny and that is killing him.

What a self sense of insecurity and dispair this guy got...Me? envy of Puerto Rican boxing success??? Is that the case, I should envy England, Mexico, USA and other countries like Panama and Cuba and maybe Venezuela that have many champions just like Puerto Rico. I am going to envy a country that ONLY has 24 or 25 world champions and of those 24 or 25 ONLY 3 were undisputed world champions? GIMMIE A BREAK!!!

NOW I AM IGNORANT ACCORDING TO THIS PUERTO RICAN

You are an IGNORANT and I think you need to do more research. Statements like that not only proof that you are an ignorant but a fool too. Do your research and them comeback to me. And still you haven't answer the original question but don't worry I understand that you can't answer it and that is why you are changing the subject. Collins2000 just expose you as the fraud you are. Como duele!!!

[elmersalsa]

That is the best you can come up.
Perhaps I was wrong maybe you are not a racist after all, you just envy our success in boxing. You still can't come up with any logical argument and all you can say is Bullshit!

Thank You Collins2000 for exposing this hater and his ignorance. Facts are facts that nobody can deny and that is killing him.

What a self sense of insecurity and dispair this guy got...Me? envy of Puerto Rican boxing success??? Is that the case, I should envy England, Mexico, USA and other countries like Panama and Cuba and maybe Venezuela that have many champions just like Puerto Rico. I am going to envy a country that ONLY has 24 or 25 world champions and of those 24 or 25 ONLY 3 were undisputed world champions? GIMMIE A BREAK!!!

NOW I AM IGNORANT ACCORDING TO THIS PUERTO RICAN

You are an IGNORANT and I think you need to do more research. Statements like that not only proof that you are an ignorant but a fool too. Do your research and them comeback to me. And still you haven't answer the original question but don't worry I understand that you can't answer it and that is why you are changing the subject. Collins2000 just expose you as the fraud you are. Como duele!!!

I am not as IGNORANT AND NATIONALISTIC like you are

Dame la gasolina, he he he he he he

[Giancarlo]

5 years on.

[elmersalsa]

This was your original statement and the one I replied to:

The original thread is top 10 Hispanics or it could be Latin American fighters and Eder Jofre is not from a Latin American country. He is from South America, not Latin America so he should not be included.

I appreciate that you are so kind as to explain the definition of Hispanic but It seems to me that you need to revise your understanding of the term "Latin America"

Webster's:

Latin America

One entry found.

Latin America

Main Entry:
Latin America
Function:
geographical name
1 Spanish America & Brazil 2 all of the Americas S of the United States

Wikipedia

Latin America

Latin America (Portuguese and Spanish: América Latina; French: Amérique Latine) is the region of the Americas where Romance languages, those derived from Latin (particularly Spanish and Portuguese), are primarily spoken.

Granted, if you meant to rank only Hispanic fighters, then Jofre should not be there. But again, it seems to me that you have a big confusion on what is "Latin America" and "Hispanic America". They're most definitely not the same.

Re: Chocolate. Where can I start? The Cuban Bon Bon. One of The first latin to dazzle MSG in an era where there was virtually no place for latin fighters. Only man in boxing history to fight for 4 different world titles in less than 12 months and one of the few to fight for 4 titles in a lifetime (and I mean real titles not the current nonsense) ...

Re: Panama Al Brown. Latin America's first world champion. A freakish physical specimen. A bantamweight just under six feet. 11 defenses between 1929-1935 all over the world! Six years world champion at a time that there were only eight...

Re: Pascualito Perez. The biggest little man in the history of boxing Olympic champ in 1948, Flyweight champ for 5 years again in a time that there were only 8 world champs. Maybe you didn't know that only two heavyweight champions have more knockouts than Pascualito? That's astonishing and unheard of in a flyweight.

But I would do little justice to these men. Here at boxrec we have the luxury of hosting a handful of men who can tell you more about these wonderful pugilists. Ask our own Enrique Encinosa, who has written a marvelous book on Cuban Boxing History "Azucar y Chocolate".. Ask our friend Panabox for Panama Al Brown. He has done a woderful job compliling history of other obscure and now forgotten but not less great Panamanian fighters. Ask the legendary Martin Sosa, (the argentinian walking encyclopedia) about Pascualito Perez.

That's how I learned to appreciate these men. By listening to others who had read and researched before me.

The sad part of this is that you would probably listen too if I they were to hold a Puerto Rican birth certificate.

Good post man. I guess borinken does not know anything about latin boxing. Every time hispanic fighters are selected by any writer, they always mention the great Eder Jofre in the mix. Brazil speaks Portuguese and that language is almost similar to Spanish. And lots of Brazilians speak Spanish. And lots of them understand Spanish. I think Spanish and English are Brazil's second languages.

He just want justify his Puerto Rican heroes in boxing. They were good. But to not to include giants like Panama Al Brown, Pascual Perez, Kid Chocolate, Eder Jofre and most of all, the great Kid Gavilan is a spit in the face.