Calzaghe-Kessler, The Biggest Ever HBO Prime-time Flop

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 06 Dec 2007, 19:11

Joe did do the two fights that got him respect. He was great in both fights, well surpassing my expectations of him. But come on, look at all the bilge that preceeded these fights. The only reputation he build up in the 2 years before Lacy was of a man who didn't want to fight anyone. OK, he's cleaned up super middleweight (or, at least, finally settled the #1 spot), he's done his thing for history and we're all very proud, but the stalls in his career have happened when he should have built up for a wider audience.

Of course, if Calzaghe and Kessler had been in seperate fights v Americans it would have done more for their commercial appeal. The Kessler fight had to happen, but he's only a star on this side of the pond.

Hatton arrived on the world scene (belatedly, I admit, after a very stale patch of hs own) by beating a future hall of famer and indisputedly the #1 at his weight, Tszyu...He tested the waters in America, got used to fighting there and guess what? He's in 1 of the most highly publicised fights of the year.

Does it mean Hatton is better than Calzaghe? Not necessarily. The debate isn't settled. But Hatton has built an image to endear him to an audience that goes beyond his rabid home following.

SandySadler · Post by **SandySadler** » 06 Dec 2007, 20:47

Max Molyneux wrote:http://secondsout.com/features/index.cf ... 3&cs=23364

Ah well, It was higher than Klitschko's.

American's like Hopkins think they deserve the bigger share and think everything has to happen In America anyway though.

Their public will probably prefer washed up recycled stars like Tito and Jones like they did with Vargas and Mayorga.

Hopkins does deserve the bigger share

He's Bernard Hopkins..a much more accomplished and proven fighter..

SandySadler · Post by **SandySadler** » 06 Dec 2007, 20:48

McCannW14 wrote:
johnswan1 wrote:Not good for British boxing when you read something like this. No doubt Hopkins will be jumping to use this to his advantage IF they go into talks. Surprising and disappointing, I can't imagine they'll be too quick to screen anything else from Europe unless there's a well known fighter from the States involved.

"In his most recent contribution on Secondsout.com, Thomas Hauser reported that the ratings for the Joe Calzaghe-Mikkel Kessler, which came with a $3,000,000 license fee from HBO, garnered a rating of 2.8, the lowest ever for a prime-time 'World Championship Boxing' telecast on the network".
Shame cause it was a terrific fight.

Just goes to show what taste in quality boxing the US viewers have.

That's not it dumbo

That's what happens when you fight in Whales behind a WBO crap-strap for a decade..

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 06 Dec 2007, 20:52

Autobarn wrote:Joe did do the two fights that got him respect. He was great in both fights, well surpassing my expectations of him. But come on, look at all the bilge that preceeded these fights. The only reputation he build up in the 2 years before Lacy was of a man who didn't want to fight anyone. OK, he's cleaned up super middleweight (or, at least, finally settled the #1 spot), he's done his thing for history and we're all very proud, but the stalls in his career have happened when he should have built up for a wider audience.

Of course, if Calzaghe and Kessler had been in seperate fights v Americans it would have done more for their commercial appeal. The Kessler fight had to happen, but he's only a star on this side of the pond.

Hatton arrived on the world scene (belatedly, I admit, after a very stale patch of hs own) by beating a future hall of famer and indisputedly the #1 at his weight, Tszyu...He tested the waters in America, got used to fighting there and guess what? He's in 1 of the most highly publicised fights of the year.

Does it mean Hatton is better than Calzaghe? Not necessarily. The debate isn't settled. But Hatton has built an image to endear him to an audience that goes beyond his rabid home following.

Absolutly and then he would have been in with a shot at sports personality of the year rather than going on about how he deserves it in such a tiersome manner. Lennox won it cos he went out and risked his arse in big fights over seas Hatton will probably get it for the same reson.

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 07 Dec 2007, 04:12

i'd like to see how the calzaghe figures compare with something like the recent Chavez jnr v Sanchez PPV. The chavez ppv must have been one of the worst shows ever that you'd have to say for imo.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Dec 2007, 05:17

verballistic wrote:
Autobarn wrote:Joe did do the two fights that got him respect. He was great in both fights, well surpassing my expectations of him. But come on, look at all the bilge that preceeded these fights. The only reputation he build up in the 2 years before Lacy was of a man who didn't want to fight anyone. OK, he's cleaned up super middleweight (or, at least, finally settled the #1 spot), he's done his thing for history and we're all very proud, but the stalls in his career have happened when he should have built up for a wider audience.

Of course, if Calzaghe and Kessler had been in seperate fights v Americans it would have done more for their commercial appeal. The Kessler fight had to happen, but he's only a star on this side of the pond.

Hatton arrived on the world scene (belatedly, I admit, after a very stale patch of hs own) by beating a future hall of famer and indisputedly the #1 at his weight, Tszyu...He tested the waters in America, got used to fighting there and guess what? He's in 1 of the most highly publicised fights of the year.

Does it mean Hatton is better than Calzaghe? Not necessarily. The debate isn't settled. But Hatton has built an image to endear him to an audience that goes beyond his rabid home following.
you nailed it...hatton has invested time & energy in "cracking america", which was his stated intention over 2 years ago and he made good on that intention!!

facing librado andrade, peter manfredo or even jeff lacy in an overseas venue on american TV doesnt allow a fighter to gain the name-recognition hatton has gained by working at it OVER HERE!!

yeah, all of a sudden he can't expect to be a big star in America. The Manfredo fight probably put a lot of ppl off, because it was absolute rubbish, an insulting evening's boxing.

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 07 Dec 2007, 05:33

Calzaghe needed less Veit and more Echols, less Manfredo and more Pemberton (who I know Manfredo beat) but some high energy knockout brawls with the likes of Echols would have been more compelling telly for the yanks than shit that was interspersed between the good fights he's had.

He could have had non-title fights in America at 175 and fought Telesco, Hall, Harmon and those types of second tier guys and had the yanks yearning for Jones, Johnson, Hopkins fights.

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 07 Dec 2007, 05:53

Old bones Ian wrote:i'd like to see how the calzaghe figures compare with something like the recent Chavez jnr v Sanchez PPV. The chavez ppv must have been one of the worst shows ever that you'd have to say for imo.

Well you simply wouldn't compare them because the Calzaghe fight was not a PPV in the States. It was on regular HBO.

glahn · Post by **glahn** » 07 Dec 2007, 06:14

The sad truth is that most Americans don't care about anything happening beyond their own borders, so I'm not at all surprised that it didn't pull in huge viewing figures. It doesn't matter that it was a great fight between two of the best boxers in the world in front of a huge local crowd. The fact that it wasn't in America, and featured no Americans, means that it was never going to do that well over there anyway.

Khaosai-Galaxy · Post by **Khaosai-Galaxy** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:23

fist wrote:
Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:I agree that it was a pretty dreary fight

I have no desire to see it again
Lol. It was one of the most exciting fights Ive seen in ages.

That is seriously one of the most exciting fights you have seen in ages?

blimey....

Khaosai-Galaxy · Post by **Khaosai-Galaxy** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:24

johnswan1 wrote:
josh fg wrote:
Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:I agree that it was a pretty dreary fight

I have no desire to see it again
Plenty will tune into see two Latin American fighters including the white fans because they think it'll be an exciting fight. I believe Naz vs Barrera got a high PPV too. Its down to weather the fighters are seen as big or exciting in America. I don't think Joe's attachment to Wales has done that for him.
What's alarming is that Calzaghe-Kessler wasn't even a PPV but still had such a low rating.

2.8 isnt such a low rating for HBO.

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:28

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:
johnswan1 wrote:
josh fg wrote: Plenty will tune into see two Latin American fighters including the white fans because they think it'll be an exciting fight. I believe Naz vs Barrera got a high PPV too. Its down to weather the fighters are seen as big or exciting in America. I don't think Joe's attachment to Wales has done that for him.
What's alarming is that Calzaghe-Kessler wasn't even a PPV but still had such a low rating.

2.8 isnt such a low rating for HBO.

It was the "lowest ever for a prime-time World Championship Boxing telecast on the network" you dunce.

Khaosai-Galaxy · Post by **Khaosai-Galaxy** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:44

johnswan1 wrote:
Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:
johnswan1 wrote: What's alarming is that Calzaghe-Kessler wasn't even a PPV but still had such a low rating.

2.8 isnt such a low rating for HBO.
It was the "lowest ever for a prime-time World Championship Boxing telecast on the network" you dunce.

Yes, but a 2.8 on HBO is a good rating for that network

the phrase "lowest ever for a prime-time World Championship Boxing telecast on the network" is somewhat misleading, HBO always predicted this would be the case considering it was 2 European fighters

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:49

As I have pointed out thogh people didn't not watch Naz cos he was european or Lennox Lewis, so what were they doing right that Joe isn't, I suggest fighting in the states and trying to build a following

Khaosai-Galaxy · Post by **Khaosai-Galaxy** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:53

Its a bit late for that

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 07 Dec 2007, 09:56

one could put together a 3 fight plan to make a big american PPV pay day. Something like Winkey over there Hopkins over there and then a unification with Dawson then retierment. However more seriously I think british fighters should learn some lessons from that and not be so intent on being home town hero's I don't think Hatton would be getting a shot vs Mayweather had he been content to stay at the MEN arena.

adamiw · Post by **adamiw** » 07 Dec 2007, 10:11

I doubt even HBO's hopes would have been that high......it is hard to know whether it was worthwhile for them without knowing how much they put in and by what means they were getting a return....internationally, the fight was pretty big....maybe they had a slice of that pie too

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Dec 2007, 10:11

josh fg wrote:one could put together a 3 fight plan to make a big american PPV pay day. Something like Winkey over there Hopkins over there and then a unification with Dawson then retierment. However more seriously I think british fighters should learn some lessons from that and not be so intent on being home town hero's I don't think Hatton would be getting a shot vs Mayweather had he been content to stay at the MEN arena.

I think that's why we should be thankful for fighters like John Murray

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 07 Dec 2007, 10:12

adamiw wrote:I doubt even HBO's hopes would have been that high......it is hard to know whether it was worthwhile for them without knowing how much they put in and by what means they were getting a return....internationally, the fight was pretty big....maybe they had a slice of that pie too

They paid $3m for the rights to show it.

adamiw · Post by **adamiw** » 07 Dec 2007, 10:18

johnswan1 wrote:
adamiw wrote:I doubt even HBO's hopes would have been that high......it is hard to know whether it was worthwhile for them without knowing how much they put in and by what means they were getting a return....internationally, the fight was pretty big....maybe they had a slice of that pie too
They paid $3m for the rights to show it.

ok well in relative terms, that isn't an awful lot so it wasn't such a gamble.....it was a big trade fight if nothing else in the US and would have boosted Calzaghe's reputation which will build interest towards a big Stateside fight next year

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 07 Dec 2007, 10:28

johnswan1 wrote:Not good for British boxing when you read something like this. No doubt Hopkins will be jumping to use this to his advantage IF they go into talks. Surprising and disappointing, I can't imagine they'll be too quick to screen anything else from Europe unless there's a well known fighter from the States involved.

"In his most recent contribution on Secondsout.com, Thomas Hauser reported that the ratings for the Joe Calzaghe-Mikkel Kessler, which came with a $3,000,000 license fee from HBO, garnered a rating of 2.8, the lowest ever for a prime-time 'World Championship Boxing' telecast on the network".

This tells you about the level of boxing competence in this country. It's a dying sport in the US.

Calzaghe should slug it out with the best on the European/Aussie market -- Dawson aside, all the most worthy opponents are there anyway.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Dec 2007, 14:17

I think British boxing will be just fine. Definitely fine by itself if Calzaghe can draw that many customers. As for cooperation between countries, who knows?

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 07 Dec 2007, 15:05

Autobarn wrote:I think British boxing will be just fine. Definitely fine by itself if Calzaghe can draw that many customers. As for cooperation between countries, who knows?

well he could make millions from US PPV or hundreds of thousands from the Millenum stadium

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Dec 2007, 16:18

josh fg wrote:
Autobarn wrote:I think British boxing will be just fine. Definitely fine by itself if Calzaghe can draw that many customers. As for cooperation between countries, who knows?
well he could make millions from US PPV or hundreds of thousands from the Millenum stadium

I think he'd need Hopkins for that nice PPV. Pavlik's not yet a superstar, Dawson's not well known despite his qualities, Taylor never really caught fire and Winky's done well for himself but will never be the attraction.

I think it boils down to this. If you want to catch on in America, fight de la Hoya, or fight someone who fought (and poss beat, and hopefully is promoted by...) de la Hoya. Comes down to Hopkins. And that only guarantees 1 payday.

Can see Calzaghe doing ok on HBO's WCB program but PPV? Not convinced. Of course, if you can draw 40,000 or near enough to an arena, you're not exactly a man with problems though...

Looks like you can't have it both ways. Calzaghe's an attraction at home but I don't think he has that crossover appeal, which is no reflection of his fighting ability of course.

Calzaghe-Kessler, The Biggest Ever HBO Prime-time Flop

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Re: Calzaghe-Kessler, The Biggest Ever HBO Prime-time Flop