BoxRec

Carbo wrote:

Boxingmad wrote:OK so which do you think was Ricky Hatton's greatest fight? Has there ever been a fight where we've all thought that he truly belongs in boxing's elite, i.e. the pound-for-pound top ten?

:?? :?? :?? :?? :?? :??

Sure -- beating Tszyu, who, at the time of the fight, was in everone's pound for pound top 3 and was considered one of history's great 140lb-ers.

KT was KT on NAME ONLY!

P4P number 3? Nostalgia on the part of Boxing fans, he had no business being in the TOP 10 with all the injuries and activity.

Just like Tyson has no business being ranked Number 1 at heavy when he walked out of jail.

Accept it, Hatton best win is very tainted and the ref may as well have held KT.

Haton had beaten no one of note before KT.........................................or since!

DD

DG. wrote:

Carbo wrote:

Boxingmad wrote:OK so which do you think was Ricky Hatton's greatest fight? Has there ever been a fight where we've all thought that he truly belongs in boxing's elite, i.e. the pound-for-pound top ten?

:?? :?? :?? :?? :?? :??

Sure -- beating Tszyu, who, at the time of the fight, was in everone's pound for pound top 3 and was considered one of history's great 140lb-ers.

KT was KT on NAME ONLY!

P4P number 3? Nostalgia on the part of Boxing fans, he had no business being in the TOP 10 with all the injuries and activity.

Just like Tyson has no business being ranked Number 1 at heavy when he walked out of jail.

Accept it, Hatton best win is very tainted and the ref may as well have held KT.

Haton had beaten no one of note before KT.........................................or since!

DD

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?

On what are you basing this concept that Tszyu was not the 'real' Tszyu? Maybe his devastating two round win over the division number 2, who was favourite going into the fight, Sharmba Mitchell, only seven months before? Surely not, as he looked sensational there.

So what are you basing it on?

Well here's how it goes:

Hatton isn’t world class because he didn’t beat a prime Tszyu;
A peak Tszyu would never have looked bad against Hatton;
Therefore Tszyu couldn’t have been at his peak;
Therefore Hatton’s win doesn’t count for much;
Therefore Hatton isn’t world class, because he didn’t beat prime Tszyu.

But if Hatton did beat a peak, or near-peak Tszyu, we would have to concede that he is world class status, and therefore capable of beating a peak Tszyu, therefore the victory would be of merit, therefore Hatton would be good.

But there’s no way to tell whether Tszyu suddenly grew old, because Tszyu never fought again, and in his previous fight he looked genuinely terrifying against a more than credible opponent.

Yet you, and loads of others state it as fact. I never quite understood this

Hatton was so open, it was like watching Hearns-Duran all over again. It was like he wanted to get coldocked early.

there are 2 people who hatton should be thankful for for his huge wealth...

one is FW for manipulating hattons career with a low risk high income strategy.

the other is anthony farnell whose hoards of fans watched hatton in the early days then climbed aboard the hatton gravy train.

there are 2 people who hatton should blame for his demise...

one is himself for contunaully not living the life of a sportsman and an athlete, his performance in superstars was hideous, and his constant huge weight gain between fights eventually took its toll.

the other is his father, who, allegedly orchestrated the shake ups in the camp, turned the british boxing public (outside manchester) against team hatton, and generally made himself unpopular, there is no disputing that ricky is a decent guy.

rhino222 wrote:there are 2 people who hatton should be thankful for for his huge wealth...

one is allegedly for manipulating hattons career with a low risk high income strategy.

the other is anthony farnell whose hoards of fans watched hatton in the early days then climbed aboard the hatton gravy train.

there are 2 people who hatton should blame for his demise...

one is himself for contunaully not living the life of a sportsman and an athlete, his performance in superstars was hideous, and his constant huge weight gain between fights eventually took its toll.

the other is his father, who, allegedly orchestrated the shake ups in the camp, turned the british boxing public (outside manchester) against team hatton, and generally made himself unpopular, there is no disputing that ricky is a decent guy.

I think that's fair enough, but give Hatton at least some credit for his wealth. After all, he was the one, you know, taking punches, and stuff.

Apart from that, regarding his demise, I think you're spot on, and I think that's why he won't be a success as a promoter/manager.

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?
On what are you basing this concept that Tszyu was not the 'real' Tszyu? Maybe his devastating two round win over the division number 2, who was favourite going into the fight, Sharmba Mitchell, only seven months before? Surely not, as he looked sensational there.

So what are you basing it on?

Well here's how it goes:

Hatton isn’t world class because he didn’t beat a prime Tszyu;
A peak Tszyu would never have looked bad against Hatton;
Therefore Tszyu couldn’t have been at his peak;
Therefore Hatton’s win doesn’t count for much;
Therefore Hatton isn’t world class, because he didn’t beat prime Tszyu.

But if Hatton did beat a peak, or near-peak Tszyu, we would have to concede that he is world class status, and therefore capable of beating a peak Tszyu, therefore the victory would be of merit, therefore Hatton would be good.

But there’s no way to tell whether Tszyu suddenly grew old, because Tszyu never fought again, and in his previous fight he looked genuinely terrifying against a more than credible opponent.

Yet you, and loads of others state it as fact. I never quite understood this

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?


Anyone else stop reading after he wrote that?

DG. wrote:

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?
On what are you basing this concept that Tszyu was not the 'real' Tszyu? Maybe his devastating two round win over the division number 2, who was favourite going into the fight, Sharmba Mitchell, only seven months before? Surely not, as he looked sensational there.

So what are you basing it on?

Well here's how it goes:

Hatton isn’t world class because he didn’t beat a prime Tszyu;
A peak Tszyu would never have looked bad against Hatton;
Therefore Tszyu couldn’t have been at his peak;
Therefore Hatton’s win doesn’t count for much;
Therefore Hatton isn’t world class, because he didn’t beat prime Tszyu.

But if Hatton did beat a peak, or near-peak Tszyu, we would have to concede that he is world class status, and therefore capable of beating a peak Tszyu, therefore the victory would be of merit, therefore Hatton would be good.

But there’s no way to tell whether Tszyu suddenly grew old, because Tszyu never fought again, and in his previous fight he looked genuinely terrifying against a more than credible opponent.

Yet you, and loads of others state it as fact. I never quite understood this

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?


Anyone else stop reading after he wrote that?

Bless your cotton socks.

You'll get to it maybe in year 12 if you manage to break into top set.

Carbo wrote:

DG. wrote:

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?
On what are you basing this concept that Tszyu was not the 'real' Tszyu? Maybe his devastating two round win over the division number 2, who was favourite going into the fight, Sharmba Mitchell, only seven months before? Surely not, as he looked sensational there.

So what are you basing it on?

Well here's how it goes:

Hatton isn’t world class because he didn’t beat a prime Tszyu;
A peak Tszyu would never have looked bad against Hatton;
Therefore Tszyu couldn’t have been at his peak;
Therefore Hatton’s win doesn’t count for much;
Therefore Hatton isn’t world class, because he didn’t beat prime Tszyu.

But if Hatton did beat a peak, or near-peak Tszyu, we would have to concede that he is world class status, and therefore capable of beating a peak Tszyu, therefore the victory would be of merit, therefore Hatton would be good.

But there’s no way to tell whether Tszyu suddenly grew old, because Tszyu never fought again, and in his previous fight he looked genuinely terrifying against a more than credible opponent.

Yet you, and loads of others state it as fact. I never quite understood this

Carbo wrote:

Have you ever heard of something called circular reasoning, DG?


Anyone else stop reading after he wrote that?

Bless your cotton socks.

You'll get to it maybe in year 12 if you manage to break into top set.

If I want to read a novel I will buy one!

Short and sweet, mate, we do not want an A4 page load of drivel.

Do you ever do any work?

If you worked for me I would sack you.

He shouldn't of lost to Pac, he thrives off small fighters and was KO'ed by two ex featherweights. Manny is better than i thought but a counter puncher will give Manny nightmares just like Marquez did twice.

Hatton was world class just not elite like he was made out. Every fighter tries to milk their belt and pretends like their hot shit.

rhino222 wrote:there are 2 people who hatton should be thankful for for his huge wealth...

one is FW for manipulating hattons career with a low risk high income strategy.

the other is anthony farnell whose hoards of fans watched hatton in the early days then climbed aboard the hatton gravy train.

there are 2 people who hatton should blame for his demise...

one is himself for contunaully not living the life of a sportsman and an athlete, his performance in superstars was hideous, and his constant huge weight gain between fights eventually took its toll.

the other is his father, who, allegedly orchestrated the shake ups in the camp, turned the british boxing public (outside manchester) against team hatton, and generally made himself unpopular, there is no disputing that ricky is a decent guy.

Rhino overall the gist of your post maybe right in a lot of peoples eyes and ears!!

However I have stated it on another thread - Ricky Hatton is/was a credit to British Boxing - and yes I am being serious!!

With regards to the disharmony in the camp = I am also being serious when I state I blame one person and only one person and it aint Ray Hatton.

Spud wrote:

rhino222 wrote:there are 2 people who hatton should be thankful for for his huge wealth...

one is FW for manipulating hattons career with a low risk high income strategy.

the other is anthony farnell whose hoards of fans watched hatton in the early days then climbed aboard the hatton gravy train.

there are 2 people who hatton should blame for his demise...

one is himself for contunaully not living the life of a sportsman and an athlete, his performance in superstars was hideous, and his constant huge weight gain between fights eventually took its toll.

the other is his father, who, allegedly orchestrated the shake ups in the camp, turned the british boxing public (outside manchester) against team hatton, and generally made himself unpopular, there is no disputing that ricky is a decent guy.

Rhino overall the gist of your post maybe right in a lot of peoples eyes and ears!!

However I have stated it on another thread - Ricky Hatton is/was a credit to British Boxing - and yes I am being serious!!

With regards to the disharmony in the camp = I am also being serious when I state I blame one person and only one person and it aint Ray Hatton.

WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO SAY WHO THE MAN IS AND STOP MAKING REFERENCE TO HIM?

IS IT THAT WILLIAMS CHAP? THE LAWYER/CEO?


Speak up!

It's a forum!

No chance DG !!!

And before anyone says I know f*ck all - I was part of the camp for Maussa in Sheffield and Urango and Castillo in Vegas!!

Ant Evans knows exactly who I am on about - we both moaned about him enough when we roomed together for the Urango fight.

Spud wrote:

No chance DG !!!

And before anyone says I know f*ck all - I was part of the camp for Maussa in Sheffield and Urango and Castillo in Vegas!!

Ant Evans knows exactly who I am on about - we both moaned about him enough when we roomed together for the Urango fight.

Its the lawyer chap then!

He is a right Tosser!

PM me and I will start a thread about him!

DG. wrote:

Spud wrote:

No chance DG !!!

And before anyone says I know f*ck all - I was part of the camp for Maussa in Sheffield and Urango and Castillo in Vegas!!

Ant Evans knows exactly who I am on about - we both moaned about him enough when we roomed together for the Urango fight.

Its the lawyer chap then!

He is a right Tosser!

PM me and I will start a thread about him!

Nice try DG!!

The lawyer chap you refer to is called Gareth Williams - he has always been alright to me and not once did he ever interfere in what I had to do - not once - in fact he helped me out massively in a personal matter when I needed it and did not charge me either!!!

Spud wrote:

DG. wrote:

Spud wrote:

No chance DG !!!

And before anyone says I know f*ck all - I was part of the camp for Maussa in Sheffield and Urango and Castillo in Vegas!!

Ant Evans knows exactly who I am on about - we both moaned about him enough when we roomed together for the Urango fight.

Its the lawyer chap then!

He is a right Tosser!

PM me and I will start a thread about him!

Nice try DG!!

The lawyer chap you refer to is called Gareth Williams - he has always been alright to me and not once did he ever interfere in what I had to do - not once - in fact he helped me out massively in a personal matter when I needed it and did not charge me either!!!

Ok, then....

Its the dad!

Ray the CarpetMeister!

Greedy git!

Wrong!!!

Spud wrote:Wrong!!!

Its the mum!

Bloody woman!

Its Matthew!

I knew it!

Its Mick Williamson!

I knew it!

F*cking hell - you still havn't got it!!

Spud, are you refering to his agent?

It's that arsewipe Paul Speak!


What a tosser!

MR UNTOUCHABLE wrote:Spud, are you refering to his agent?

Everyone can keep guessing mate!! - sorry even if the person was named I still wouldn't admit to it.

I have got to say overall - I really think this "blame" thing is wrong mainly because everything would have been different on this forum if Hatton had beaten Pacman - how on earth does one fight change things.

The person I refer to in my most humble opinion caused me and a couple of other members of Fight Academy unecessary hassle at times but I am sure he meant well - this person is the one who I heard slagging everyone but himself when the slightest mistake was made.

In addition I was actually present when at times he could have been perhaps a little more diplomatic with the way he dealt with the press - but again that is just my personal opinion thats all.

In the bigger scheme of things Team Hatton have done very well for themselves and good luck to them - not one of us would have refused a position in their team - having spent those 3 fights with Team Hatton and Fight Academy I honestly consider myself one of the luckiest people alive.

I seriously cannot understand why Ricky is taking so much sh*t - he lost to the 2 best P4P fighters in the world - name me another British fighter who has faced the P4P best fighters - yeah okay there is a list - but theres not many people on it.

But back to this blame thing - leave Ricky out of it - I dont believe he deserves it.

Hatton lost because he is not good enough to beat the elite.


Simple as...

DG. wrote:Hatton lost because he is not good enough to beat the elite.

Simple as...

Fair enough comment!!