BoxRec

Oiky wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 09:20 Can't believe how sh*t Brook looked and the embarassing talk from fewkes after

BigDoofus wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 03:41

Oiky wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 09:20 Can't believe how sh*t Brook looked and the embarassing talk from fewkes after

A bit harsh on Fewkes. He was excited after training his first pro boxer.

Oiky wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 06:24

BigDoofus wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 03:41

Oiky wrote: ↑09 Dec 2018, 09:20 Can't believe how sh*t Brook looked and the embarassing talk from fewkes after

A bit harsh on Fewkes. He was excited after training his first pro boxer.

No I get that and I wish him all the best

But first pro boxer or not it wasn't a spectacular performance... that is a silly comment no matter how many fighters you've trained

Oiky wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:20 Yeah, like I said, All the best to fewkes, but seems a bit of a yes man doesn't he

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:52

Oiky wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 11:20 Yeah, like I said, All the best to fewkes, but seems a bit of a yes man doesn't he

According to Sky Sports.. Hurd vs. Brook all relies on Khan..

stujones wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 19:26 I think that comparing Khan vs Brook and Haye vs Bellew is a bit far fetched. Lets be honest, as poo as Di Mori and the other guy were..... read the posts on here. There was not many saying Haye was shot, he'd still only had 1 Heavyweight defeat at that stage. As bad as they were, Haye, even though he looked overweight, hardly put a foot wrong.... people were even calling him a geniune threat to Joshua.

Bellew also, was in the form of his life as a world champion, Again, nobody thought he was shot. However, nobody gave him a shout and I honestly think people bought the first PPV as much as anything to see how Haye looked against his first live(ish) opponent and to make their first true Haye vs Joshua analysis.

Haye vs Bellew 2 sold mainly again because some thought Haye could still possibly do something but also because of the rivalary between the pair in fight 1.

BOTH Khan and Brook though have had heavy defeats and aren't showing their best form of late..... was Crolla vs Burns a PPV, this is a similar fight IMO. Both Khan and Brook have now had 1 really poor performance in the build up against opposition they should be outclassing.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:36

stujones wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 19:26 I think that comparing Khan vs Brook and Haye vs Bellew is a bit far fetched. Lets be honest, as poo as Di Mori and the other guy were..... read the posts on here. There was not many saying Haye was shot, he'd still only had 1 Heavyweight defeat at that stage. As bad as they were, Haye, even though he looked overweight, hardly put a foot wrong.... people were even calling him a geniune threat to Joshua.

Bellew also, was in the form of his life as a world champion, Again, nobody thought he was shot. However, nobody gave him a shout and I honestly think people bought the first PPV as much as anything to see how Haye looked against his first live(ish) opponent and to make their first true Haye vs Joshua analysis.

Haye vs Bellew 2 sold mainly again because some thought Haye could still possibly do something but also because of the rivalary between the pair in fight 1.

BOTH Khan and Brook though have had heavy defeats and aren't showing their best form of late..... was Crolla vs Burns a PPV, this is a similar fight IMO. Both Khan and Brook have now had 1 really poor performance in the build up against opposition they should be outclassing.

Both Haye and Bellew were well past their best., especially Haye. Bellew was never going to be a contender at heavyweight. Also it was fake beef to make them both cash. And it worked to be fair although both fights were farcical really.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:39

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:36

stujones wrote: ↑10 Dec 2018, 19:26 I think that comparing Khan vs Brook and Haye vs Bellew is a bit far fetched. Lets be honest, as poo as Di Mori and the other guy were..... read the posts on here. There was not many saying Haye was shot, he'd still only had 1 Heavyweight defeat at that stage. As bad as they were, Haye, even though he looked overweight, hardly put a foot wrong.... people were even calling him a geniune threat to Joshua.

Bellew also, was in the form of his life as a world champion, Again, nobody thought he was shot. However, nobody gave him a shout and I honestly think people bought the first PPV as much as anything to see how Haye looked against his first live(ish) opponent and to make their first true Haye vs Joshua analysis.

Haye vs Bellew 2 sold mainly again because some thought Haye could still possibly do something but also because of the rivalary between the pair in fight 1.

BOTH Khan and Brook though have had heavy defeats and aren't showing their best form of late..... was Crolla vs Burns a PPV, this is a similar fight IMO. Both Khan and Brook have now had 1 really poor performance in the build up against opposition they should be outclassing.

Both Haye and Bellew were well past their best., especially Haye. Bellew was never going to be a contender at heavyweight. Also it was fake beef to make them both cash. And it worked to be fair although both fights were farcical really.

Bellew wasn't shot. He'll tell you himself that he was in his best run of form. People forget how much of a struggle making 175 was for him.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:42

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:39

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:36

Both Haye and Bellew were well past their best., especially Haye. Bellew was never going to be a contender at heavyweight. Also it was fake beef to make them both cash. And it worked to be fair although both fights were farcical really.

Bellew wasn't shot. He'll tell you himself that he was in his best run of form. People forget how much of a struggle making 175 was for him.

Bellew was facing hand picked opposition.

If he really felt he was a threat at cruiser he would have entered the wbss.

If he really felt he was a threat at heavy he wouldn't have created a fake beef with Haye who was largely irrelevant by that point. He could have had a fight with Joshua or Wilder easily if he'd wanted to.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:45

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:42

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:39

Bellew wasn't shot. He'll tell you himself that he was in his best run of form. People forget how much of a struggle making 175 was for him.

Bellew was facing hand picked opposition.

If he really felt he was a threat at cruiser he would have entered the wbss.

If he really felt he was a threat at heavy he wouldn't have created a fake beef with Haye who was largely irrelevant by that point. He could have had a fight with Joshua or Wilder easily if he'd wanted to.

The WBSS isn't the point. The point is whether he was in form or 'past it', and he most certainly was not past it and the man himself told me on more than one occasion that he was in the best form he'd ever shown. The performances at cruiser bear that out too. I've watched his entire career as well as many of sparring sessions and the stuff he showed after leaving 175 was more in line with the form he showed when he wasn't stuggling with the weight.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:48 Unless you think the version of Bj flores he fought was top level opposition

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:52 'Well past his best' and 'on the slide' don't gel either. If you are on the slide you are on the slippery slope. If you are well past it you've gone a long way down that road. It doesn't make sense.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:55

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:52 'Well past his best' and 'on the slide' don't gel either. If you are on the slide you are on the slippery slope. If you are well past it you've gone a long way down that road. It doesn't make sense.

Past your best is on the slide.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:48 Unless you think the version of Bj flores he fought was top level opposition

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:58

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:55

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:52 'Well past his best' and 'on the slide' don't gel either. If you are on the slide you are on the slippery slope. If you are well past it you've gone a long way down that road. It doesn't make sense.

Past your best is on the slide.

You said "Well past his best", when he clearly wasn't by any stretch. If he was he wouldn't have won the first two rounds against Usyk. That intial claim was nonsensical and goes against all the evidence on show.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:03

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:58

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:55

Past your best is on the slide.

You said "Well past his best", when he clearly wasn't by any stretch. If he was he wouldn't have won the first two rounds against Usyk. That intial claim was nonsensical and goes against all the evidence on show.

Winning 2 rounds early against Usyk hardly proves someone is still at their best. He was dealt with fairly easily.

Haye was so poor I think it's made you think Bellew was better than he was.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:03

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:58

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:55

Past your best is on the slide.

You said "Well past his best", when he clearly wasn't by any stretch. If he was he wouldn't have won the first two rounds against Usyk. That intial claim was nonsensical and goes against all the evidence on show.

Winning 2 rounds early against Usyk hardly proves someone is still at their best. He was dealt with fairly easily.

Haye was so poor I think it's made you think Bellew was better than he was.

I'm not knocking him for topping up his pension against Haye, it was a smart move. They both conned the public into parting with their dough.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:38

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:03

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 12:58

You said "Well past his best", when he clearly wasn't by any stretch. If he was he wouldn't have won the first two rounds against Usyk. That intial claim was nonsensical and goes against all the evidence on show.

Winning 2 rounds early against Usyk hardly proves someone is still at their best. He was dealt with fairly easily.

Haye was so poor I think it's made you think Bellew was better than he was.

I'm not knocking him for topping up his pension against Haye, it was a smart move. They both conned the public into parting with their dough.

So a 'well past his best" Bellew swerved the WBSS to protect himself, earns two huge purse against Haye then takes on the WBSS winner and does reasonably well? Can you not see how contradictory that is?

Do you really think his form Vs Isaac and Stevenson was better than his cruiserweight form? It wasn't. His best form was at CW as he wasn't just working on his weight in camp, was more two-fisted, and said on, off and above the record he was boxing as well as he ever had.

Just eyeball the fights again and you'll see it quite clearly.

He took Usyk on because he felt physically and mentally stronger at CW, and did from the start.

No one floated the idea going into Usyk. It is a fantasy.

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:48

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:38

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:03

Winning 2 rounds early against Usyk hardly proves someone is still at their best. He was dealt with fairly easily.

Haye was so poor I think it's made you think Bellew was better than he was.

I'm not knocking him for topping up his pension against Haye, it was a smart move. They both conned the public into parting with their dough.

So a 'well past his best" Bellew swerved the WBSS to protect himself, earns two huge purse against Haye then takes on the WBSS winner and does reasonably well? Can you not see how contradictory that is?

Do you really think his form Vs Isaac and Stevenson was better than his cruiserweight form? It wasn't. His best form was at CW as he wasn't just working on his weight in camp, was more two-fisted, and said on, off and above the record he was boxing as well as he ever had.

Just eyeball the fights again and you'll see it quite clearly.

He took Usyk on because he felt physically and mentally stronger at CW, and did from the start.

No one floated the idea going into Usyk. It is a fantasy.

That's exactly what I'm saying.

The (impressive) Makabu win aside, his opposition at Cruiserweight was cherry picked.

They paid Breidis step aside money to face Flores then created fake beef with Haye (Flores' mate) as that was a better cash out fight than defending against Breidis.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 14:21

ewenhay wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:48

MF DOOM wrote: ↑11 Dec 2018, 13:38

So a 'well past his best" Bellew swerved the WBSS to protect himself, earns two huge purse against Haye then takes on the WBSS winner and does reasonably well? Can you not see how contradictory that is?

Do you really think his form Vs Isaac and Stevenson was better than his cruiserweight form? It wasn't. His best form was at CW as he wasn't just working on his weight in camp, was more two-fisted, and said on, off and above the record he was boxing as well as he ever had.

Just eyeball the fights again and you'll see it quite clearly.

He took Usyk on because he felt physically and mentally stronger at CW, and did from the start.

No one floated the idea going into Usyk. It is a fantasy.

That's exactly what I'm saying.

The (impressive) Makabu win aside, his opposition at Cruiserweight was cherry picked.

They paid Breidis step aside money to face Flores then created fake beef with Haye (Flores' mate) as that was a better cash out fight than defending against Breidis.

He didn't cash out, he stayed and fought Usyk.

As I said, was he better Vs Isaac twice and Stevenson? No, he boxed at his best at CW and no one said he was "way over the hill" going into Usyk. It is laughable to suggest otherwise. Coldwell brought the best out of him and he was in the right division, and that was clear for all to see to the naked eye.

I don't know a single person who shares your viewpoint.