BoxRec

banjo wrote:

“I don’t think Manny Pacquiao is a good fighter,” he said.

What about Roach?

“Do I think Freddie Roach is a good trainer? No,” he told 8countnews.com.

Further proof that this man is a complete idiot.

I'll 2nd that!! What an arsehole he is!! No wonder his own family don't even wanna know the prat!!

DG. wrote:I am not giving Beard flack, the Hatton(s) are at fault if anyone is to blame.

F*ck me - we agree on something!!!

but wasnt beard just assistant??

i dont think it matterd who hatton had in the corner that night,he got peed off with snr but never had the confidence in beard prior.for hatton to think he was gonna become a better fighter @ this stage,shows his change in trainers was in desperation,showing damaged confidence.

didnt oscar hire about 3 diffrent coaches,that nacho & dundee b4 the pacquio fight.

NULL:

For what reasons are the Hatton getting blamed... for ditching Graham/Kayes? or because they lost to Pacquiao... or a combination of both?

Not sure I get the point of the arguement... Ray's job was to get Ricky the best fights, the approriate training time, and the right money. Ricky isn't complaining on any of these factors.

Its the TRAINERS job to get Hatton in the best physical shape, not the managers.... and thats Mayweather/Beard.

For me Graham didn't do himself any favours with his sympathisers by announcing his retirment just after Ricky claimed he was going stale cause Graham was too ill to train a top level fighter. Graham ISN'T in the best of health, he's admitted that - but that's kind of being forgotton by the critics.

Whether was Ricky was becoming shot, or whatever - fact is... last two fights under Graham were not vintage Hatton. Billy Graham lost it just prior to and in the ring against Mayweather.... his little chat to Cortez backfired. Performances indicated that he needed a change - now the change backfired for this fight, maybe the honeymoon period ended early.... but not sure why team Hatton are getting blamed. Its not the management staff that need blamining but the coaching staff, the boxer himself and OFF COURSE - Team Pacquiao for being just too good.

Dioufy wrote:

dookus wrote:Lazcano should have taught Ricky that he's not got the chin anymore to repeat what he did in the Tszyu fight.

On the basis on what exactly? Hatton got caught coming in against Lazcano - he got buzzed, hardly a premonition of what Pacquiao was about to serve up. It really riles to when people say, admittedly, mostly American or Hatton haters, things like Hatton was one punch away from being stopped and that he was rocked to his boots. I disagree, Hatton was buzzed twice in that fight and came back strong as hell when he was. He wasn't hurt at all I don't think.. And for further proof on thatlook at the times Hatton has really been hurt, Magee, Collazo, Mayweather and Pacquiao - there's a massive difference in the way Hatton reacts. Against Lazcano, he went straight back to work, whereas against those other three, he looked as if he was in massive trouble, which he was.

I agree that Hatton tried to fight the same way as he did with Tszyu, but Kostya and Pacquiao are completely different. Surely Hatton and his team would've realised that Hatton would've caught two or three shots everytime he tried to attack.

Sorry mate, but youve got that so incredibly wrong!

Graham was in Hatton's corner for the Lazcano fight and recently gave the following quotes to BB.net about the fight:

“Even though he won clearly against Lazcano he nearly got done... Lazcano hurt him a few times, honestly, the break caused by Ricky's laces coming undone [in round ten] helped, his eyes were in orbit after taking a left hook, the ref separated them and Ricky nearly fell into the ropes."

Its alright laying the blame on trainers , but Hatton and or no other boxer gets trained to fight on the night , the training is done in the months years before the fight .

Now its obvious that Mayweathers training style was either going too suit Hatton or it was'nt. Was Hatton to old to learn new tricks , I don't know but they would off, and they kept him on so therefore you have too assume it was going alright in the gym , for a while at least .

But at the end off the day Hatton went out there and fought the wrong fight from the begining.

Now i know this much , my old trainer never reached the same levels has this guy and neither did I , but i know what he used to drum into me and i always drummed into anyone i trained and that is , NEVER BE MECHANICAL ALWAYS BE THINKING . . now has he use to say and I followed suit , you never know till your in there , , it don't matter what you plan if the other guy does'nt do what you expect him to do, YOU BETTER BE READY TO CHANGE MID ROUND, AND YOU HAVE TO DO IT YOURSELF, COS I WON'T BE IN THERE TOO HELP YOU. , now this fella's is'nt rocket science its called having a boxing brain .

And i'm afraid Ricky Hatton has never had one , he has never been a smart fighter just a very strong boxer who had the right fights , Mayweather was always the wrong choice because he excells training fighters with a boxing brain, thinkers who can change mid stream , guys like his son.

Facts are Pacman was too good . he is a smart fighter , and will always be too smart for a Hatton type fighter .

from the word go Ricky Hatton has been taught and conditioned to use his good points to win fights , strenght , conditioning , determination . It used to make me laugh hearing about the famous belly bag , i had been using a similar thing for years and so have others, only difference is when we used it, if my fighter came in with his head down, throwing nothing but hooks to the body, i would belt him ,if he was open.
Like i said Hatton mastered cetain points off the game and never bothered with others , maybee if he had gone with a Freddie Roach ten years ago he would now be laying claim to being the best boxer ever but he did'nt, and he done well with the attributes he pocessed

BUT HE HAS NEVER BEEN TAUGHT TO THINK IN THE RING , AND HE WILL NEVER LEARN NOW.

And that dear chaps is why Hatton will never ever beat the Pacmans and Mayweathers , . But lets give him his due he facking got right up there with them on limited skills,

coneye wrote:Its alright laying the blame on trainers , but Hatton and or no other boxer gets trained to fight on the night , the training is done in the months years before the fight .

Now its obvious that Mayweathers training style was either going too suit Hatton or it was'nt. Was Hatton to old to learn new tricks , I don't know but they would off, and they kept him on so therefore you have too assume it was going alright in the gym , for a while at least .

But at the end off the day Hatton went out there and fought the wrong fight from the begining.

Now i know this much , my old trainer never reached the same levels has this guy and neither did I , but i know what he used to drum into me and i always drummed into anyone i trained and that is , NEVER BE MECHANICAL ALWAYS BE THINKING . . now has he use to say and I followed suit , you never know till your in there , , it don't matter what you plan if the other guy does'nt do what you expect him to do, YOU BETTER BE READY TO CHANGE MID ROUND, AND YOU HAVE TO DO IT YOURSELF, COS I WON'T BE IN THERE TOO HELP YOU. , now this fella's is'nt rocket science its called having a boxing brain .

And i'm afraid Ricky Hatton has never had one , he has never been a smart fighter just a very strong boxer who had the right fights , Mayweather was always the wrong choice because he excells training fighters with a boxing brain, thinkers who can change mid stream , guys like his son.

Facts are Pacman was too good . he is a smart fighter , and will always be too smart for a Hatton type fighter .

from the word go Ricky Hatton has been taught and conditioned to use his good points to win fights , strenght , conditioning , determination . It used to make me laugh hearing about the famous belly bag , i had been using a similar thing for years and so have others, only difference is when we used it, if my fighter came in with his head down, throwing nothing but hooks to the body, i would belt him ,if he was open.
Like i said Hatton mastered cetain points off the game and never bothered with others , maybee if he had gone with a Freddie Roach ten years ago he would now be laying claim to being the best boxer ever but he did'nt, and he done well with the attributes he pocessed

BUT HE HAS NEVER BEEN TAUGHT TO THINK IN THE RING , AND HE WILL NEVER LEARN NOW.

And that dear chaps is why Hatton will never ever beat the Pacmans and Mayweathers , . But lets give him his due he facking got right up there with them on limited skills,

I agree with this really, I still think though his best night also became his worst night at the same time. He WAS a thinking fighter, had nice head movement and he changed tactics against Tackie and Magee (mid fight vs Magee) nicely. However, they worked a strategy against Tszyu that worked.... but Hatton fought like that for most of his fights since - it became his "natural" instinct, when it wasn't early on.

Have to say, whilst I think Mayweather Snr's pad work is almost pointless - I think Ricky has adapted to that very quickly. I remember when Sky showed an early training camp for the Malignaggi fight - and Ricky looked terrible, almost learning everything from scratched... he picked it up very quickly and was very good against a light hitting boxer. It showed to me he is a quick learner at least, but he would need more than a few months to iron out this "natural" instinct that he has, when the pressure is on, to fight with no movement. Recklessly walking through the fighter.

I've be purplexed about how DLH raves about Mayweather. Yes, he has his naturally gifted son, but lets not forget - under Mayweather Snr he almost blew it against Castillo (albeit with one hand).... Roger Mayweather has made Pretty boy far more better box office and just far far better.

DLH had some of his best wins under Mayweather..... but he also took more painful shots at the same time. Hurt against Vargas, hurt against Mosley, KO'd against Hopkins, struggle against Sturm, hurt against Mayorga, sloppy against Forbes. Might be because DLH was coming to the end, but might also be cause Mayweather Snr isn't that good a communicator. For me, Oscar's best display in recent years was against Floyd Jnr - without Mayweather Snr in the corner.

Only times I have been impressed with Mayweather Snr was with Guzman and for Hatton vs Malignaggi... but seeing a guy shafted against Malignaggi (Ngougdjio) lose a fight against a former Hatton victim, kind of puts Malignaggi in some sort of perspective.

stujones wrote:For me Graham didn't do himself any favours with his sympathisers by announcing his retirment just after Ricky claimed he was going stale cause Graham was too ill to train a top level fighter. Graham ISN'T in the best of health, he's admitted that - but that's kind of being forgotton by the critics.

WRONG!!!!!!

Telling you right now regardless of what is said in articles etc etc - Billy Graham would be in Hatton's corner right now if it were not for Hatton sacking him - FACT.

WOW, The Mayweathers and Pac Man have really put the Hatton huggers into mental turmoil.

I'm lovin it.

Spud wrote:

stujones wrote:For me Graham didn't do himself any favours with his sympathisers by announcing his retirment just after Ricky claimed he was going stale cause Graham was too ill to train a top level fighter. Graham ISN'T in the best of health, he's admitted that - but that's kind of being forgotton by the critics.

WRONG!!!!!!

Telling you right now regardless of what is said in articles etc etc - Billy Graham would be in Hatton's corner right now if it were not for Hatton sacking him - FACT.

All i want to know from SPUD "The Fly On The Wall" Woodrat" is Ricky Hatton really as fookin stupid as he makes out or is he very smart and he knows his fans are a bunch of morons...........because by his logic David Diaz would have been P4P number 1 if he beat Pac.

YoungBlood. wrote:

Spud wrote:

stujones wrote:For me Graham didn't do himself any favours with his sympathisers by announcing his retirment just after Ricky claimed he was going stale cause Graham was too ill to train a top level fighter. Graham ISN'T in the best of health, he's admitted that - but that's kind of being forgotton by the critics.

WRONG!!!!!!

Telling you right now regardless of what is said in articles etc etc - Billy Graham would be in Hatton's corner right now if it were not for Hatton sacking him - FACT.

All i want to know from SPUD "The Fly On The Wall" Woodrat" is Ricky Hatton really as fookin stupid as he makes out or is he very smart and he knows his fans are a bunch of morons...........because by his logic David Diaz would have been P4P number 1 if he beat Pac.

The pound for pound sh*te was disgusting from Hatton in the build up to this fight. I know a few people on american boxing boards were pissing themselves laughing at Hattons claims and personally it made it all the better to see him KO'd on the canvas. We already get enough of him talking about how he beat Tszyu etc (who was 36, coming off a very bad injury and had 3 rounds in 2 years), we would never have heard the end of, "Well I said that Ricky Hatton would be the pound for pound number one and I am" sh*te.

THANKS PACMAN!!

Spud wrote:

Flav1 wrote:Has Beard always been in Ricky's training camp?

he looks like he should be training scouts.

Lee Beard is a good bloke - yep he has struck lucky in that he has been in the corner of one of the world's best known boxers - but for f*ck sake I do not think the bloke deserves a slating in anyway whatsoever - from what I saw of him both in Manchester and Vegas a couple of years ago, he knew what he was doing.

Give the bloke a break.

Hmmm....Of course Lee Beard has done well for himself and shouldn't be criticised for advancing his career. The question is whether Hatton did the right thing by having Beard as in effect his joint head trainer going into the biggest fight in the world this year.

Beard will learn from the experience and good luck to him but he was well out of his depth and that is painfully obvious.

stujones wrote:

coneye wrote:Its alright laying the blame on trainers , but Hatton and or no other boxer gets trained to fight on the night , the training is done in the months years before the fight .

Now its obvious that Mayweathers training style was either going too suit Hatton or it was'nt. Was Hatton to old to learn new tricks , I don't know but they would off, and they kept him on so therefore you have too assume it was going alright in the gym , for a while at least .

But at the end off the day Hatton went out there and fought the wrong fight from the begining.

Now i know this much , my old trainer never reached the same levels has this guy and neither did I , but i know what he used to drum into me and i always drummed into anyone i trained and that is , NEVER BE MECHANICAL ALWAYS BE THINKING . . now has he use to say and I followed suit , you never know till your in there , , it don't matter what you plan if the other guy does'nt do what you expect him to do, YOU BETTER BE READY TO CHANGE MID ROUND, AND YOU HAVE TO DO IT YOURSELF, COS I WON'T BE IN THERE TOO HELP YOU. , now this fella's is'nt rocket science its called having a boxing brain .

And i'm afraid Ricky Hatton has never had one , he has never been a smart fighter just a very strong boxer who had the right fights , Mayweather was always the wrong choice because he excells training fighters with a boxing brain, thinkers who can change mid stream , guys like his son.

Facts are Pacman was too good . he is a smart fighter , and will always be too smart for a Hatton type fighter .

from the word go Ricky Hatton has been taught and conditioned to use his good points to win fights , strenght , conditioning , determination . It used to make me laugh hearing about the famous belly bag , i had been using a similar thing for years and so have others, only difference is when we used it, if my fighter came in with his head down, throwing nothing but hooks to the body, i would belt him ,if he was open.
Like i said Hatton mastered cetain points off the game and never bothered with others , maybee if he had gone with a Freddie Roach ten years ago he would now be laying claim to being the best boxer ever but he did'nt, and he done well with the attributes he pocessed

BUT HE HAS NEVER BEEN TAUGHT TO THINK IN THE RING , AND HE WILL NEVER LEARN NOW.

And that dear chaps is why Hatton will never ever beat the Pacmans and Mayweathers , . But lets give him his due he facking got right up there with them on limited skills,

I agree with this really, I still think though his best night also became his worst night at the same time. He WAS a thinking fighter, had nice head movement and he changed tactics against Tackie and Magee (mid fight vs Magee) nicely. However, they worked a strategy against Tszyu that worked.... but Hatton fought like that for most of his fights since - it became his "natural" instinct, when it wasn't early on.

Have to say, whilst I think Mayweather Snr's pad work is almost pointless - I think Ricky has adapted to that very quickly. I remember when Sky showed an early training camp for the Malignaggi fight - and Ricky looked terrible, almost learning everything from scratched... he picked it up very quickly and was very good against a light hitting boxer. It showed to me he is a quick learner at least, but he would need more than a few months to iron out this "natural" instinct that he has, when the pressure is on, to fight with no movement. Recklessly walking through the fighter.

I've be purplexed about how DLH raves about Mayweather. Yes, he has his naturally gifted son, but lets not forget - under Mayweather Snr he almost blew it against Castillo (albeit with one hand).... Roger Mayweather has made Pretty boy far more better box office and just far far better.

DLH had some of his best wins under Mayweather..... but he also took more painful shots at the same time. Hurt against Vargas, hurt against Mosley, KO'd against Hopkins, struggle against Sturm, hurt against Mayorga, sloppy against Forbes. Might be because DLH was coming to the end, but might also be cause Mayweather Snr isn't that good a communicator. For me, Oscar's best display in recent years was against Floyd Jnr - without Mayweather Snr in the corner.

Only times I have been impressed with Mayweather Snr was with Guzman and for Hatton vs Malignaggi... but seeing a guy shafted against Malignaggi (Ngougdjio) lose a fight against a former Hatton victim, kind of puts Malignaggi in some sort of perspective.

Great post Stu. I agree, I have never seen the attraction to Mayweather Sr. He seems to work fine with slick fighters, Dawson, Guzman, etc. But the shoulder rolling always looked a little forced with ODH, and evidently Hatton didn't show us enough to judge whether he learnt anything.

I said in the build up to the Pacqiou fight that Hattons victory over Paulie was more of red herring than Manny's over Oscar. And it is looking more the case now.

Hatton became obsessed with his 'strength' and betting on the fact that bigger equalled better. I genuinely believe he bought into his own hype.
Perhaps he wanted it too much, for the fans for the vindication of the Mayweather loss, and he lost his head, and discarded what he had been taught.

DG. wrote:

Punchy Joe wrote:Maybe Mayweather sr got pushed to the side because he kept turning up late............

Doubt it,

Ricky was working Southpaw ads with Lee beard in the UK and by the sounds of it Beard was also training Hatton after Mayweathers sessions.

Allegedly, the only day Floyd Snr was on time was press day.

He also couldn't/wouldn't do southpaw pads.

G-man wrote:

DG. wrote:

Punchy Joe wrote:Maybe Mayweather sr got pushed to the side because he kept turning up late............

Doubt it,

Ricky was working Southpaw ads with Lee beard in the UK and by the sounds of it Beard was also training Hatton after Mayweathers sessions.

Allegedly, the only day Floyd Snr was on time was press day.

He also couldn't/wouldn't do southpaw pads.

Floyd is an unreliable nutter in love with himself - but that was already plastered all over his cv at the point that Beard brought him into the camp. The surprise is that he lasted as long as he did.

Just a catastrophic hiring.

Floyd is a million times the trainer that Graham was. Nobody had a problem with him after the malignaggi fight... i seem to remember this forum buzzing about him after that one.

True......and you have to ask yourself how much of a learning curve the fight will have been for Beard because it didn't last long did it?

What will he learn from that? Sadly not enough time for him to gain vital experience...

DG. wrote:I agree McCracken is a very good trainer, but a Roach who knows the inside track on B-HoP would be a great asset, its Frochs career and Hattons so they need to give themselves the best chance possible.

For every fighter bar Hopkins I think Mccracken would do the job on his own.

Beard? Not good enough when you are fighting Pacman, imo.

If Beard had PBF in his corner then he would be ok, but he has Hatton, Hatton needed all the help he could get to deal with Pacman, but having said that, Hatton was getting stopped regardless.

I can't see Roach going on board with Froch and McCracken. But I take your point, however, McCracken has faced BHOP when training Eastman, and I am sure he learnt a lot from that experience.

Spud wrote:

stujones wrote:For me Graham didn't do himself any favours with his sympathisers by announcing his retirment just after Ricky claimed he was going stale cause Graham was too ill to train a top level fighter. Graham ISN'T in the best of health, he's admitted that - but that's kind of being forgotton by the critics.

WRONG!!!!!!

Telling you right now regardless of what is said in articles etc etc - Billy Graham would be in Hatton's corner right now if it were not for Hatton sacking him - FACT.

Off course he would have, but still is he well enough to do an intense 12 week camp. He's admitted his health isn't great. Well enough to be sacked? not sure.... I do know Hatton's performance against Lazscano wasn't vintage, and Matthew's performance against Watson even less so.

I knew a Coach who at 80 and unable to walk to well still Trained Great Fighters. In fairness He had great insight about Fighting Men Eddie Futch

Terry D wrote:
To be fair, and without starting WW4, Graham's role prior to Matthew-Watson was played down, with claims that Beard trained Matt for that fight, only for Graham to cop all the flack post-fight, when the blame should have been shared, the same is true of Floyd/Beard in this instance.

It does seem a very strange set up... with lots of claims and counter claims and things that just don't add up. Firstly, Graham has Beard (who hired him not sure) as Ricky's assistant for the Lazcano fight, and it is claimed he is the "assistant" for MH vs Watson, but then people claim he is more than an assistant for MH.

Strange how Beard and Graham work together for one fight... then comes a bit of a revelation that Beard worked closely Mayweather previously and learned his trade from him.

Then the part company, Graham retires, then claims he was sacked, Team Hatton says its due to his failing health - Graham admits to health problems, but them not being bad.

Obviously not getting the full story and I am sure those with inside information are getting half of the story and the half that don't mind being published on the net.

True, Terry - I remember that Graham interview. The impression I got that Beard was just helping out Graham with the more physical stuff that Graham couldn't handle - but not really imputting.

stujones wrote:

Terry D wrote:
To be fair, and without starting WW4, Graham's role prior to Matthew-Watson was played down, with claims that Beard trained Matt for that fight, only for Graham to cop all the flack post-fight, when the blame should have been shared, the same is true of Floyd/Beard in this instance.

It does seem a very strange set up... with lots of claims and counter claims and things that just don't add up. Firstly, Graham has Beard (who hired him not sure) as Ricky's assistant for the Lazcano fight, and it is claimed he is the "assistant" for MH vs Watson, but then people claim he is more than an assistant for MH.

Strange how Beard and Graham work together for one fight... then comes a bit of a revelation that Beard worked closely Mayweather previously and learned his trade from him.

Then the part company, Graham retires, then claims he was sacked, Team Hatton says its due to his failing health - Graham admits to health problems, but them not being bad.

Obviously not getting the full story and I am sure those with inside information are getting half of the story and the half that don't mind being published on the net.

From what I remember, Beard wanted some space to train his kid, he approached the Phoenix Camp, and Billy being a good guy, let him use his gym. The hattons saw Beards pad work and were presumaby impressed, this coincided with Billy's hands giving him problems, and Beard started his work in the camp. As I understand it and could well be wrong, Graham did not hire Beard, the Hatton's wished for him to help out.

dbf wrote: the Hatton's wished for him to help out.

Should have gone for world peace or a new tent during that candle blow out.