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Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 03 Aug 2009, 10:56
by teddy007
alexpaterson wrote:I think Warren has done wonders for Khan 3 fights after his 1st round defeat he's a world champ that is some shrewd matchmaking imo I think BJ Saunders will bring big crowds with his all action style

IMO BJS is not in the best shape and should be fighting at a maximum Middle-Weight, probably light-middle.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 03 Aug 2009, 10:59
by Goz
jamesmcdonnell wrote:
Goz wrote:If W@rren has a half a effing brain he would be running regular shows with the Olympians on the BBC or ITV even if it means making no money now. The $$$ will come later when they are household names.

Even in the man in the street knows who Audley Harrison despite him being shite.

Frank, you're a fool if you don't attempt to build them up on terrestrial tv, and Sky you are fools too.

Build them up for 2/3 years then take them across to Sky and then onto PPV if they ever progress to big enough fights (although our opinion of what constitutes a big fight clearly varies).
Yes, but terrestrial TV is not interested. They have recoiled from boxing almost totally, so it's not really an option. Unless you count ITV4 as 'mainstream TV.'
I think the Beeb and ITV are aware that boxing gets pretty decent figures which is they do keep coming back - even if is just showing a week old rerun of a Hatton/Calzaghe/Froch fight.

I think if both sides (Terrestrial & Non) were pragmatic about it they could reach a mutually satisfactory deal. Obviously without being privvy to figures etc then I'm talking out of my rather large posterior but it at least seems very plausible to me - especially if the incumbent promoter of the Olympians were to sit them down (a favourite term of Frank's who is always planning to 'sit down' with people) and explain it's less now but "I'll make you a star!"

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 03 Aug 2009, 11:40
by Asterix
teddy007 wrote:
alexpaterson wrote:I think Warren has done wonders for Khan 3 fights after his 1st round defeat he's a world champ that is some shrewd matchmaking imo I think BJ Saunders will bring big crowds with his all action style
IMO BJS is not in the best shape and should be fighting at a maximum Middle-Weight, probably light-middle.
I touched on that a while back. I think they're letting him stay a little fleshy as he's so young. It's important not to stunt his growth with severe weight draining. No doubt he'll get more and more in shape over the next year or so.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 03 Aug 2009, 18:58
by stujones
I think an important question in a few years will be whether terrestial TV coverage will be that fundamental. When Digital TV becomes forced with the switch over, other free to air channels (which are available on all platforms) could become major players.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 04:28
by coneye
He's been so good at his job and made a few a lot of money through excellent , high reward , low risk fights that anyone who has the potential now wants to see the big money early .

I'M not privy to the Khan contract, but i would be suprised if Warren, did'nt have his arse covered in some way , furthermore i think Khan, if he is making big demands will shoot himself in the foot , Really what other options are there for him , leave and go to the states , let him go i would give him 2 maybee 3 fights and he'll be finished , he would want the money and they would want to put him in with the best.

I'm still not convinced about him,his last win proved to me he's European level , because in all honesty thats all his opponent was , forget the belt there 10 a penny now, its about the quality of opponent.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 06:26
by MightyWarrior
Hard to know for sure, but as the UK's main promoter he had to resign Khan really - I mean who else has he got, at that level? He needs someone like Khan as the hook to hang the rest of his shows on, while he quietly builds up his Olympic boys.

And the way he re-built him, after the Prescott disaster, was near on a work of art.

Never been a big FW fan of course, but personaly I'm hoping he pulls through the tough times we're going through right now.
Might be a bit of a cheap thrill for some to have a gloat over the low PPV numbers, but I imagine a realist like Frank was just looking to break even there, at the most.

If he goes down, it's bad news for British boxing.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 07:46
by boxingchat
Goz wrote:If W@rren has a half a effing brain he would be running regular shows with the Olympians on the BBC or ITV even if it means making no money now. The $$$ will come later when they are household names.

Even in the man in the street knows who Audley Harrison despite him being shite.

Frank, you're a fool if you don't attempt to build them up on terrestrial tv, and Sky you are fools too.

Build them up for 2/3 years then take them across to Sky and then onto PPV if they ever progress to big enough fights (although our opinion of what constitutes a big fight clearly varies).
So what if ITV or the BBC don';t have any money to pay for these things?

I am sure if they did then Warren would be doing exactly that.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 07:47
by boxingchat
Goz wrote:
Bomber 1 wrote:Hatton was built on sky and is the biggest draw this countrys ever seen.

Calzaghe couldn't draw flies until he beat Lacy and even then was still struggling!! Look at the Bika & Manfredo match attendances.He got a huge draw in Wales for the Kessler match but the show was still at a loss to FW, To the tune of £500'000 if I remember him printing right :o ...

FW would not be backing Amir if it wasn't in his best intrests, The place was sold out when he fought Barrera, Yes it was far from full when he boxed Kotelnik BUT the show was moved from the 02 in London and thousands had already paid good money for tickets,travel & accomodation etc,2 weeks is not nearly long enough to sell out a show. I think you'll see Amir built up and in the end he'll be able to rival almost anyone with attendance figures, In the end I can see him filling the Reebok stadium in a unification match that will make tens of millions of pounds in revenue TV,Attendance,Sponsors etc etc..

I can't remember FW ever backing someone as much as he's backed Amir and it not workin out.. :wink:
Hatton was built on Sky but more importantly he was built at the MEN and on the back of the boozed up Manc football supporting type crowd.

I still firmly believe the Brunos, Benns, Eubanks etc were all so popular because they were so easily identifiable by the man on the street.

Eubank? What a strange street you must live in!! :lol:

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 09:50
by DG.
Unless Khan makes him some money Fwank will cash out with a big fight against Manny Pac in the States - or maybe Cotto if Khan REALLY pisses fwank off.



:lol:

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 09:56
by doctorboxing
DG. wrote:Unless Khan makes him some money Fwank will cash out with a big fight against Manny Pac in the States - or maybe Cotto if Khan REALLY pisses fwank off.
If it was just a cash out he was looking for then the man to go for is Hatton but Fwank has said he doesn't want to see this fight happening.

PPV in the current economic climate is only going to work if the fight is something unmissable. The average sports fan will not buy a Khan-Maidina or Khan-Salita fight for £15, not a hope in hell.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 09:59
by alexpaterson
Asterix wrote:
teddy007 wrote:
alexpaterson wrote:I think Warren has done wonders for Khan 3 fights after his 1st round defeat he's a world champ that is some shrewd matchmaking imo I think BJ Saunders will bring big crowds with his all action style
IMO BJS is not in the best shape and should be fighting at a maximum Middle-Weight, probably light-middle.
I touched on that a while back. I think they're letting him stay a little fleshy as he's so young. It's important not to stunt his growth with severe weight draining. No doubt he'll get more and more in shape over the next year or so.
Agree with you both he looks fleshy and should fight at LMW in the future when he gets to title level until then he may as well stay at this weight imo

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 10:24
by danfoster
Slightly disagree on this point - if he's fleshy he's either not eating right, boozing or not training properly

These problems need to be sorted out early. His natural talent will carry him along so far - flesh and all - but when he eventually has to put it in he will struggle if he hasn't done it the right way on the way up.

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 11:24
by ourkid1984
I don't know about all the time but since I've been watching boxing in the mid 90's Warren has always relied on 'big name' boxers and a bunch of 'support acts' to prop them up. Just look at Hatton and Calazaghe.

Wareren uses the Friday night fight nights to build up popularity of his 'big star' then wack them on Pay per view as early as he can and Sky fall for the hype every time. I think the thing is with Khan is he put him on Pay Per View too early and he lost the fight really fast, the public have never really trusted Khan on Pay Per View since.

After all there are other fighters with better undeafeated records that don't even get on as a highlight. In my opinion Warren has got too greedy when it has come to Khan and it's just made Khan into a money hungry machine, instead of a fighting machine.

The best promotor in my eyes in the UK is Hennessy because he seems to give all of his fighters a fair chance in the limelight and is not affraid to let them fight on other promoters bills

Re: Did Frank W.arren make a mistake?

Posted: 04 Aug 2009, 18:12
by WildWaylon
I would love to see PPV fail so miserably it gets dropped, I am really against it. I am even against boxing on Sky Sports, not everyone can afford to buy sports channels. Trouble is ITV and the BBC just dont have enough interest in the sport. I am not really all that bothered what Warren makes from Khan fights. Warren is a shrewd businessman and profit is profit, so I imagine he is making enough to have made it worthwhile. These are hard times and its not so easy to get people to part with their money. What Warren has to do is put together quality bills, not take the piss with an undercard of Olympians fighting no hopers, just turning up for the payday. He also needs to think about getting decent subs lined up in the event of pullouts.