Muhammad Ali vs Jimmy Young - The scoring thread

[Collins2000]

Round 8.

Young outboxes Ali.

Round 8 - Young - 10-9

[Collins2000]

The first 4 rounds of Young-Ali are a good cure for insomnia. Ali does zero and Young does 0.1

So you have it 40-36 to Young going into Round 5?

I agree, not the most exciting spectacle but it's a result that gets talked about in here regularly so I am gonna stick with watching it.

[Collins2000]

Rounds 3, 4 & 5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXJB0tHtivs

Rounds 6, 7 & 8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aIcolsjwXg

[Collins2000]

Round 9

Some lovely jabs by Young early and a solid right hand counter got Ali's attention.

I'm not too impressed by that "dance and flick the left" shite by Ali in this round. The punch either falls short or lands with almost zero impact.

Round 9 - Young - 10-9.

[Robinson]

Ali vs Young round 7.

This is a hard one to judge, but I gave it to Young as well.
I could have scored it a draw.

Young 10-9


I shall cacth up later today. I have the BJJ nationals on here
in Adelaide that I am going to check out.

[raylawpc]

Was Ali-Young so boring that you guys couldn't make it past 10 rounds?

(To your credit, you've made it farther than I would. You'd have to pay me to get me to watch that snoozefest again!)

[Collins2000]

Round 10

More flick and, mainly, miss from Ali.

Young still keeps landing the cleaner punches.

Close round.

Young - 10-9

[Collins2000]

Round 11

I'm struggling to find a round for Ali...

I thought he started off better in this round now he has stopped the flicking crap.

Still, not enough work from Ali and Young nicks the round again with just a few decent punches.

Young - 10-9

[Collins2000]

Round 12

Ali seemed to realise he needed a big finish and got to work (at last).

What happened at the end of the round when Young got tangled up in the ropes? The ref looked to be giving him a count...

Ali - 10-9 (10-8 if that was a count Young was given for fekkin around in the ropes)

[Collins2000]

Round 13

Young hiding outside the ropes?

Ali starting to find the range at last.

Best action of the fight so far!

Ali - 10-9

[Collins2000]

Round 14

Ali started off well but Young won the round with half a dozen decent head shots, a couple of which pulled Ali up in his tracks.

Young - 10-9

[Collins2000]

Round 15

Ali tried to finish strongly and did enough for me to win the round.

Ali - 10-9

[Collins2000]

I had it 10 rounds to Young and 5 rounds to Ali.

If all were 10-9 rounds, my score would be a Young victory by 145 - 140. However if the 12th was a 10-8 round then my score is 144 - 140.

Actually, listening to the official scores it seems they were using the old "5 point must" system.

Anyway, a clear win for Young in my view.

[John Galt]

I scored the fight 9-6 for Young, but a lot of rounds were close. For most of the fight, Ali was the aggressor. Some rounds Young did a good job of boxing but even when he made Ali miss and countered well he didn't do a lot. Another thing is that the pace was comfortable for both fighters so neither of them showed much fatigue, even in the later rounds.

I scored all of the rounds in which Young stuck his head out of the ropes for Ali. While I scored it for Young, I can understand how someone could have scored it for Ali. A lot of rounds were close and if you believe that a challenger has to "take" the title, Young probably didn't do enough.

[Collins2000]

I scored the fight 9-6 for Young, but a lot of rounds were close. For most of the fight, Ali was the aggressor. Some rounds Young did a good job of boxing but even when he made Ali miss and countered well he didn't do a lot. Another thing is that the pace was comfortable for both fighters so neither of them showed much fatigue, even in the later rounds.

I scored all of the rounds in which Young stuck his head out of the ropes for Ali. While I scored it for Young, I can understand how someone could have scored it for Ali. A lot of rounds were close and if you believe that a challenger has to "take" the title, Young probably didn't do enough.

I think Ali's main problem, apart from not being in shape mentally and physically and the fact his opponent was much better than expected , was that he was forced to be the aggressor. It didn't seem to suit his style of fighting.

If Young had got the decision, I expect there would have been a rematch. Do you think an in shape and focussed Ali would be able to win? I'm not sure. That styles of Young's gave him a lot of trouble.

[I Feel Fine]

You can't use a lot of mobility when you're that much over weight. Ali was supposed to stop Young in the mid rounds, so he fought aggressively. He probably boxes more in a rematch. But Ali should have never fought Young in the first place, should have retired, he was old but there was too much money out there. Young in his prime and in better shape wouldn't fight Cooney the same way either.

[John Galt]

I scored the fight 9-6 for Young, but a lot of rounds were close. For most of the fight, Ali was the aggressor. Some rounds Young did a good job of boxing but even when he made Ali miss and countered well he didn't do a lot. Another thing is that the pace was comfortable for both fighters so neither of them showed much fatigue, even in the later rounds.

I scored all of the rounds in which Young stuck his head out of the ropes for Ali. While I scored it for Young, I can understand how someone could have scored it for Ali. A lot of rounds were close and if you believe that a challenger has to "take" the title, Young probably didn't do enough.

I think Ali's main problem, apart from not being in shape mentally and physically and the fact his opponent was much better than expected , was that he was forced to be the aggressor. It didn't seem to suit his style of fighting.

If Young had got the decision, I expect there would have been a rematch. Do you think an in shape and focussed Ali would be able to win? I'm not sure. That styles of Young's gave him a lot of trouble.

Collins, I agree with you, the Young style is going to be a problem for Ali regardless of conditioning. IMO, Ali was physically better than Young, but Young doesn't make many mistakes. He cuts the ring well, he slips punches, rolls under punches, and he is a sharp, accurate puncher himself.

I do think that although Ali's conditioning might not have been a big factor in this fight because of the comfortable pace, his punching and timing were off. A good training camp would probably give Ali better timing and make his punching sharper. In a rematch, Ali would probably still have be the aggressor, but maybe Ali could be more effective with his jab and maybe land some flashy 1-2s that would give him the win.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Tough to imagine a rematch. Young's style was awful for Ali, who wasn't getting any younger. On the other hand, Ali's focus seemed almost as pathetic that night as his conditioning --- make no mistake, Boxing is Boxing, &, comfortable pace or not, Ali's weight undoubtedly would make him suffer in any fight.

Eyes on the prize & in-condition, maybe Ali wins, but my second sentence stands, making a prediction difficult.

[BoxBuzz]

I started out watching these rounds hedging and I suppose I have to continue to do so. This is not the trip to the woodshed that granny makes it out to be on behalf of Young over Ali. And I think that Young did not do enough to take a championship from his opponent. And on the very same score...if Young was champion on that night he would have walked out champion on that night...at least the way I see it. I give away my bias for a champion. I know I'm in the minority here and pure blind justice is perhaps the ideal. But there is something about defending vs taking. I think taking requires something remarkable.

If this was an amateur fight....Young probably won.....if this were two contenders..perhaps the same.

But Young did not "win" a championship in my estimation based on this performance regardless of what even my own score card may say. To win a championship fight takes just a skosh more than purely and simply and barely not losing to your opponent. Which may be the best way to describe this.

Some will disagree, and I understand why, this was an understeamed affair to say the least. Could good and competent people score this for Ali? I believe they did.


The first Lewis Holyfield affair had plenty of steam and to me Lewis did that "remarkable" thing that I believe is required for a championship to change hands. This fight? Not so much.

[Collins2000]

I don't subscribe to the theory that a challenger has to do any more than win more rounds than the champ to take the title.

I still don't see your actual round by round score Buzz.

Any fool can give his overall impression. Even Lard Arse Irene could do that. (But I wouldn't see it, thankfully).

[Robinson]

Round 7
10-10 even
Round 8
Young 10-9
Round 9
Young 10-9
Round 10
10-10 even
Round 11
Young 10-9
Round 12
Ali 10-9
Round 13
Ali 10-9
Round 14
Young 10-9
Round 15
Ali 10-9


I had it for Young. Not the prettiest fight going around however.

[Robinson]

I think it turned out I had it 142-145 Young.

[BoxBuzz]

I don't subscribe to the theory that a challenger has to do any more than win more rounds than the champ to take the title.

I still don't see your actual round by round score Buzz.

Any fool can give his overall impression. Even Lard Arse Irene could do that. (But I wouldn't see it, thankfully).

I figured you didn't subscribe. You'd be too cheap to pay the bill. I do subscribe. And for this I must live with myself even at the cost of hearing that it makes me a Hauser house pet from grabby. I will post my scores..sometime before I shed this mortal coil.

[Robinson]

I don't subscribe to the theory that a challenger has to do any more than win more rounds than the champ to take the title.

I still don't see your actual round by round score Buzz.

Any fool can give his overall impression. Even Lard Arse Irene could do that. (But I wouldn't see it, thankfully).

I figured you didn't subscribe. You'd be too cheap to pay the bill. I do subscribe. And for this I must live with myself even at the cost of hearing that it makes me a Hauser house pet from grabby. I will post my scores..sometime before I shed this mortal coil.

You better or I will dob

[Goodnight, Irene]

I'm guessing it escapes Collins --- simple fellow, that he is --- the magnitude of difference in what you see scoring a fight live, from ringside, & what you see scoring it on youtube.

I'm not defending Ali, or the decision --- but it's a huge difference. As I say, I'm sure it hasn't crossed Collins' mind for so much as a nanosecond.