Off Topic: Bin Laden Killed by US Forces

[Glyn Leach]

Is assassination illegal under International Law?

Wellington at Waterloo when informed that a clear shot of Napoleon was available: 'Generals have far better things to to than take potshots at each other.'

Times have changed.

Yes, now it's unmanned drones that fire missiles, remotely controlled from 1000's of kilometres away. The bravery and nobility of modern war!

A bit of that Simon (in fact I like to think of it that way, kind of British and comforting) but a fair bit of pragmatism in the statement as well I think — killing a general doesn't mean you don't have to fight his army. Good PR coup, but the real work still remains to be done.

[palooka]

Assassination against anyone oppressive is legal I believe, I'd love to violently murder the thief who created speed cameras. 8)

I dig what you say and my next door neighbour has a girl of 7 who has one leg after being knocked over by a sober, speeding driver :(

[exittored]

You do realise there was no actual evidence linking Bin Laden with 9/11 or that there's no such thing as al qaeda but hey don't let Facts get in the way of a good story, carry on believing in fairytales the government controlled media tells you.

This really was the last window of opportunity for Obama to announce the capture/death of Bin Laden. September 11th 2011 would have marked the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attack and the biggest question the Media would have been asking was 'How come Bin Laden hasn't be found' so it was really now or never as any time from September would have been too convenient and even the 'sheeple' would have questioned the story after that with his re-election year coming up in 2012.

Also very convenient he was killed...so America has at it's disposal the most modern tools of warefare including stun grenades, flash and tear gas and have a house surrounded and they can't take him alive or at least partly injured, absolute bullshit and stops America having to put him on trial and actually come up with some Evidence to try him or have certain Facts revealed.

We the people have been duped yet again although some of us are more AWAKE then others!

[banjo]

Assassination against anyone oppressive is legal I believe, I'd love to violently murder the thief who created speed cameras. 8)

I dig what you say and my next door neighbour has a girl of 7 who has one leg after being knocked over by a sober, speeding driver :(

That's sad to hear but I'm a biker and ride fast but competently unlike these reckless pricks on four wheels.

[Dioufy]

Should've burned the twat's corpse on live TV; I'd watch that over Britain's Got Talent anyday.

[Jeff Thomas]

You do realise there was no actual evidence linking Bin Laden with 9/11 or that there's no such thing as al qaeda but hey don't let Facts get in the way of a good story, carry on believing in fairytales the government controlled media tells you.This really was the last window of opportunity for Obama to announce the capture/death of Bin Laden. September 11th 2011 would have marked the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attack and the biggest question the Media would have been asking was 'How come Bin Laden hasn't be found' so it was really now or never as any time from September would have been too convenient and even the 'sheeple' would have questioned the story after that with his re-election year coming up in 2012.

Also very convenient he was killed...so America has at it's disposal the most modern tools of warefare including stun grenades, flash and tear gas and have a house surrounded and they can't take him alive or at least partly injured, absolute bullshit and stops America having to put him on trial and actually come up with some Evidence to try him or have certain Facts revealed.

We the people have been duped yet again although some of us are more AWAKE then others!

This point seems to be missed by most news agencies. The immediate death scenario too is very convenient.

[palooka]

I thought Bin Laden had been on dialysis for the last dozen years?

[hoot]

Who says you carn't take "bin" out on a bank holiday !

[Deserter]

there's no such thing as al qaeda but hey don't let Facts get in the way of a good story, carry on believing in fairytales the government controlled media tells you.

This really was the last window of opportunity for Obama to announce the capture/death of Bin Laden. September 11th 2011 would have marked the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attack and the biggest question the Media would have been asking was 'How come Bin Laden hasn't be found' so it was really now or never as any time from September would have been too convenient and even the 'sheeple' would have questioned the story after that with his re-election year coming up in 2012.

Also very convenient he was killed...so America has at it's disposal the most modern tools of warefare including stun grenades, flash and tear gas and have a house surrounded and they can't take him alive or at least partly injured, absolute bullshit and stops America having to put him on trial and actually come up with some Evidence to try him or have certain Facts revealed.

It depends on your definition - Al Qaeda wasn't the streamlined terrorist force that some media outlets portray it as, but it existed as a broad movement with commonalities of purpose, most notably the establishment of an Islamist Caliphate.
As for your other points, I don't subscribe to the notion that it was Obama's last window of opportunity at all - the idea that missing the 10th anniversary 'deadline' and suspicion regarding the timing would outweigh the upswing that such a 'reveal' would result in doesn't ring true to me.
And while I'm sure there are those with experience who can talk with far more authority than me (Macho, where are you?!), but while I can completely understand how in theory you'd think it would be a straightforward proposition to capture him given the technology involved, none of us know the reality of being in a 'live' situation like that and there is plenty of precedent to suggest it's never straightforward.
Finally, what I find somewhat bizarre about conspiracy theorists is there willingness to accept things being twisted one way, but not twisted the other. For example, if you believe the States is capable of such a level of deceit and spin, surely it's relatively easy for them to conjure up 'evidence' to use at a show trial?

[banjo]

I thought Bin Laden had been on dialysis for the last dozen years?

He has, he was a dying man before 9/11.

[exittored]

there's no such thing as al qaeda but hey don't let Facts get in the way of a good story, carry on believing in fairytales the government controlled media tells you.

This really was the last window of opportunity for Obama to announce the capture/death of Bin Laden. September 11th 2011 would have marked the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attack and the biggest question the Media would have been asking was 'How come Bin Laden hasn't be found' so it was really now or never as any time from September would have been too convenient and even the 'sheeple' would have questioned the story after that with his re-election year coming up in 2012.

Also very convenient he was killed...so America has at it's disposal the most modern tools of warefare including stun grenades, flash and tear gas and have a house surrounded and they can't take him alive or at least partly injured, absolute bullshit and stops America having to put him on trial and actually come up with some Evidence to try him or have certain Facts revealed.

It depends on your definition - Al Qaeda wasn't the streamlined terrorist force that some media outlets portray it as, but it existed as a broad movement with commonalities of purpose, most notably the establishment of an Islamist Caliphate.
As for your other points, I don't subscribe to the notion that it was Obama's last window of opportunity at all - the idea that missing the 10th anniversary 'deadline' and suspicion regarding the timing would outweigh the upswing that such a 'reveal' would result in doesn't ring true to me.
And while I'm sure there are those with experience who can talk with far more authority than me (Macho, where are you?!), but while I can completely understand how in theory you'd think it would be a straightforward proposition to capture him given the technology involved, none of us know the reality of being in a 'live' situation like that and there is plenty of precedent to suggest it's never straightforward.
Finally, what I find somewhat bizarre about conspiracy theorists is there willingness to accept things being twisted one way, but not twisted the other. For example, if you believe the States is capable of such a level of deceit and spin, surely it's relatively easy for them to conjure up 'evidence' to use at a show trial?

Let me make this clear for you once again...THERE IS NO ISLAMIC ORGANISATION KNOWN AS AL QAEDA. Sure there are a few wacko's here or there who want to set up a GLOBAL 'Islamist Caliphate' as you put it but their numbers are non existent and we're talking pockets of a few men sitting in darkened rooms plotting to take over the world...are they dangerous? yes they could be and need to stopped but they're no where near the danger we're led to believe.

The media now uses the term 'Al Qaeda' to coin any so called terrorist group as though they're all linked when each group have totally different aims and have no connection. Islamic groups fighting their governments in Pakistan, China, Palestine, Egypt, Tunisia, Bangladesh, Philipines, Libya, Iraq, Morocco, Saudi arabia etc etc don't give 2 fecks about some Global take over of the world.

Who knows what the truth is but the window of opportunity theory makes more sense to me then anything i'm likely to read or hear on the BBC, SKY and all other mainstream media. Bush needed the 'Bin Laden' monster to be alive and now when he's served his purpose it was time to kill him off just before the 10th Anniversary and all of America can finally put it to rest in September and no more questions need to be asked because he's dead so JUSTICE has been served.

I'm pretty sure they'd have had strong intelligence well in advance for the location of Bin Laden, having seen the actual house he was supposed to be staying at, it really wasn't that well fortified or protected and he didn't have any security apart from a few other gun men including his son. With a highly trained US military unit i'd see no real problem they'd have in taking Bin Laden alive or at least partially injured with the use of tear gas or stun grenades. Having said that there may have been a 'shoot to kill' policy ordered.

Sure they could have conjured up 'evidence' but a defence lawyer would have easily destroyed their evidence and the worst thing of all is that 'Bin Laden' could have actually been found 'Not Guilty' due to lack of evidence, that would have been their worst nightmare.

[Deserter]

Let me make this clear for you once again...THERE IS NO ISLAMIC ORGANISATION KNOWN AS AL QAEDA.

Which is EXACTLY why I made it clear that I was referring to a movement rather than an organisation, as there is no doubt (as you yourself acknowledge) that it has acted in a symbolic manner for a number of disparate groups many of whom as part of their stated policy and/or purpose subscribe to notions such as the establishment of a caliphate and sharia law.

[exittored]

Let me make this clear for you once again...THERE IS NO ISLAMIC ORGANISATION KNOWN AS AL QAEDA.

Which is EXACTLY why I made it clear that I was referring to a movement rather than an organisation, as there is no doubt (as you yourself acknowledge) that it has acted in a symbolic manner for a number of disparate groups many of whom as part of their stated policy and/or purpose subscribe to notions such as the establishment of a caliphate and sharia law.

Fair enough and i agree with the above statement in regards to certain islamic groups.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I'm extremely dubious about this. Would Obama, given that he is the most wanted man in the world, be living in a mansion!? Surely a little too conspicuous no?

Also, the body buried immediately at sea. Hmmmmm, really? Surely you would think the US Administration would release pictures of the dead Bin Laden to celebrate the triumph?

I think it is quite possible that Osama died years ago, lots of grainy videos and audio tapes are pretty easy to fake. Osama was the ideal bogey man for the US, a good excuse to go invading various other nation states.

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but I definitely smell a rat here.

[doctorboxing]

You can already see the way this thread is going to go....... "its all a conspiracy, 9/11, 7/7, madrid, osama's death"

In fact maybe it was organised simply to distract the media from Kate and Wills honeymoon destination......

As I predicted, the conspiracy theorists have come out in force.

People sure do give a lot of credit to successive American Governments who have been able to fake moon landings, kill their own people and bring down the twin towers, fake osama's death etc. etc.

Makes you wonder why these people can't prevent Monica Lewinsky's semen splattered dress being seen round the world, organize universal healthcare or get their own economy in some kind of order?

[observer1]

You would think they wouldnt release this news without evidence to back it up and all the body buried at sea business seems strange. Could it be the case they buried the body at sea to stop a battle by his family to give him a proper funnel which would lead to a celebration of his life and his grave become a place of worship.

Somethings does not make sense..

Apparently took 6 hours for the DNA test...
Then to put him into the sea, which is far far far away from Abbotobad, the place where he was claimed to be killed is another issue.

I think the nearest sea is the Persian gulf 1500 miles away....

They said they wanted him buried him well within 24 hours. But announced his death and burial well before even several hours had passed..

i dunno..

[funso banjo baby]

Killed in a mansion outside Islamabad after a firefight involving US special forces, according to Obama.

Watching his live speech now.

I know this is off topic, but I thought that it was such a momentous occasion, given how we've suffered at this scumbag's hands.

you live in a very small , shallow world if you think this is 'momentous' news. its pointless drivel designed to whip the retards in America into line.

grow up everyone

[jamesmcdonnell]

You can already see the way this thread is going to go....... "its all a conspiracy, 9/11, 7/7, madrid, osama's death"

In fact maybe it was organised simply to distract the media from Kate and Wills honeymoon destination......

As I predicted, the conspiracy theorists have come out in force.

People sure do give a lot of credit to successive American Governments who have been able to fake moon landings, kill their own people and bring down the twin towers, fake osama's death etc. etc.

Makes you wonder why these people can't prevent Monica Lewinsky's semen splattered dress being seen round the world, organize universal healthcare or get their own economy in some kind of order?

I am not a conspiracy theorist. I don't think the moon landings are fake, nor do I think the twin towers was organised by the US - thought iu do think they were happy to let it happen as it gave them the excuses they needed to invade iraq and make a grab for the oil.

They don't need to try hard to fake Osama's death. Who is going to produce evidence to the contrary. I think it's likely he died quite some time ago, but they wanted to wait for an opportune time to say it has happened. After all, he was a very useful bogeyman to whip up US patriotic sentiment and stop people asking annoying questions about US forreign polcy.

[The Lone Wolf]

Apparently Bin Laden a known Arsenal fan was spotted out celebrating his teams win last night which lead to his ultimate downfall.

[whiskey]

I couldn't really care tbh.

[palooka]

I'm extremely dubious about this. Would Obama, given that he is the most wanted man in the world, be living in a mansion!? Surely a little too conspicuous no?

Also, the body buried immediately at sea. Hmmmmm, really? Surely you would think the US Administration would release pictures of the dead Bin Laden to celebrate the triumph?

I think it is quite possible that Osama died years ago, lots of grainy videos and audio tapes are pretty easy to fake. Osama was the ideal bogey man for the US, a good excuse to go invading various other nation states.

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but I definitely smell a rat here.

Some of the very worst among humanity live in absolute luxury with people catering to their every whim. Many others scattered around the world do business and help their aims for a premium.

[exittored]

You do realise there was no actual evidence linking Bin Laden with 9/11 or that there's no such thing as al qaeda but hey don't let Facts get in the way of a good story, carry on believing in fairytales the government controlled media tells you.This really was the last window of opportunity for Obama to announce the capture/death of Bin Laden. September 11th 2011 would have marked the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attack and the biggest question the Media would have been asking was 'How come Bin Laden hasn't be found' so it was really now or never as any time from September would have been too convenient and even the 'sheeple' would have questioned the story after that with his re-election year coming up in 2012.

Also very convenient he was killed...so America has at it's disposal the most modern tools of warefare including stun grenades, flash and tear gas and have a house surrounded and they can't take him alive or at least partly injured, absolute bullshit and stops America having to put him on trial and actually come up with some Evidence to try him or have certain Facts revealed.

We the people have been duped yet again although some of us are more AWAKE then others!

This point seems to be missed by most news agencies. The immediate death scenario too is very convenient.

Exactly. We know he had no part in the planning or execution of the 9/11 attacks so basically that just leaves it to whether he bankrolled it and so far after 10 years there has been no link or evidence found of this, watch this short film which explains it better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6YgmhBvwCo

Yet now the case is closed and once again we the people have been left in the dark.

[Carbo]

My God, I didn't know there were so many folks on here sitting at home in their tin foil hats reading conspiracies about international cabals of lizard people controlling the world.

Guys, Osama Bin Laden and his organization -- whatever you want to call it -- was involved in terrorism long before 9/11. He was involved on the attack against the USS Cole, the bombing of the basement car park in the World Trade Centre, the devastating bomb in Nairobi, and more. He was on the FBI most wanted list long before 9/11.

It is true that Al-Qaeda is a loosely formed collection of often autonomous cells with an overarching belief-system; however, that is by necessity the nature of terrorist organizations. There really can't be a proper command structure and physical organization if they wish to survive.

I freely admit that there were no underground cave complexes at Tora Bora as was reported at the time, but that Al-Qaeda, or that organization under a different name, existed and posed a real terrorist threat to the west, I have no doubt.

As for Bin Laden being dead for years, he's done a damn good job of appearing on a series of videos and tapes looking progressively older during recent years, hasn't he? And I ask you, which politician could resist the temptation to gain the huge popularity boost which would have come from the announcement of his death? None, of course, and certainly not the craven Bush.

No, they won't have had him dead for years and years.

Further, the idea that this has just been released for the benefit Barack Obama's reelection is preposterous to anyone who knows anything about politics. Obama is running for reelection, so the most beneficial time to have released the news would have been in late October 2012 just days before the election, to give him a sudden surge in popularity and stop the opposition from responding. That he would do it now, 18 months out, if he had a choice, is laughable.

As for the comments about his 'dodgy passport' they're so stupid that I think it's best not even to justify them with a response.

The reason he was buried at sea is perfectly understandable: if he had been buried on land, his grave would have become a focal point for every Islamicist loon and a freak show for every whack job the world over. Getting rid of him quickly, at sea, stops in its tracks any efforts to have him buried, and complies with Islamic tradition.

Get a grip, chaps.

[palooka]

My God, I didn't know there were so many folks on here sitting at home in their tin foil hats reading conspiracies about international cabals of lizard people controlling the world.

Guys, Osama Bin Laden and his organization -- whatever you want to call it -- was involved in terrorism long before 9/11. He was involved on the attack against the USS Cole, the bombing of the basement car park in the World Trade Centre, the devastating bomb in Nairobi, and more. He was on the FBI most wanted list long before 9/11.

It is true that Al-Qaeda is a loosely formed collection of often autonomous cells with an overarching belief-system; however, that is by necessity the nature of terrorist organizations. There really can't be a proper command structure and physical organization if they wish to survive.

I freely admit that there were no underground cave complexes at Tora Bora as was reported at the time, but that Al-Qaeda, or that organization under a different name, existed and posed a real terrorist threat to the west, I have no doubt.

As for Bin Laden being dead for years, he's done a damn good job of appearing on a series of videos and tapes looking progressively older during recent years, hasn't he? And I ask you, which politician could resist the temptation to gain the huge popularity boost which would have come from the announcement of his death? None, of course, and certainly not the craven Bush.

No, they won't have had him dead for years and years.

Further, the idea that this has just been released not to benefit Obama is preposterous to anyone who knows anything about politics. Obama is running for reelection, so the most beneficial time to have released the news would have been in late October 2012 just days before the election, to give him a sudden surge in popularity and stop the opposition from responding. That he would do it now, 18 months out, if he had a choice, is laughable.

As for the comments about his 'dodgy passport' they're so stupid that I think it's best not even to justify them with a response.

The reason he was buried at sea is perfectly understandable: if he had been buried on land, his grave would have become a focal point for every Islamicist loon and a freak show for every whack job the world over. Getting rid of him quickly, at sea, stops in its tracks any efforts to have him buried, and complies with Islamic tradition.

Get a grip, chaps.

The Tora Bora cave system was widely reported throughout the world. It was not a rogue reporter; more a systematic dis-information ploy. If Government agencies and News providers were willing to fabricate, embellish and then propagate this sort of thing; how can ordinary (yet sentient) people trust whatever they are told by the same sources?

If you believe that the hoy polloy of the general population gets anywhere near the full truth of what transpires in these events then you are a very nieve fellow.

The growing use of remote controlled drones and missiles controlled and fired from 1000's of kilometres away (often with major civilian casualties is in some peoples eyes as disgusting as a suicide bomb or road side improvised device).

[NazNaci1]

Bin Laden was killed in 2007.