BoxRec

allahsnackbar wrote:WHY DO YOU CAPITALIZE YOUR THREAD TITLES

Quixall wrote:

allahsnackbar wrote:WHY DO YOU CAPITALIZE YOUR THREAD TITLES

COS I WANT TO

Quixall wrote:

Finch wrote:Gomez,

Most of what you say about the backslappers, the khan show, the immaturity of the arm waving etc is true, and i hope this defeat humbles him and his extremely arrogant team. However, to say Roach and Ariza are overrated is an insult and khan's speed and accuracy is some of the best in the business. His approach and attitude are to blame, not his skills or trainer.

I was going to reply to Gomez, but you have neatly said what i was roughly going to say

allahsnackbar wrote:

Quixall wrote:

allahsnackbar wrote:WHY DO YOU CAPITALIZE YOUR THREAD TITLES

COS I WANT TO

OK!!!!!

WELL I THINK AMIR WILL LEARN FROM THIS AND COME AGAIN!!!

ROACH IS NOT TEACHING HIM HOW TO FIGHT INSIDE THOUGH. WE SEE THE SAME MISTAKES IN THE MAIDANA AND PETERSON FIGHTS. HE NEEDS TO LEARN HOW TO SPOIL ON THE INSIDE!!!

PERHAPS MANNY STEWART WOULD BE A GOOD TRAINER FOR HIM!!!!!!!

WHAT DO YOU THINK MATE!!!!!!!??

G0mez wrote:I don't know why the need to write pages of assessment when the fact is simple: The guy is just not all that.

That's a devastating loss to Prescott and now a to-the-wire loss against a fringe contender.

If Khan was the truth, he'd have ran straight through Peterson like a juggernaut.

This "blurring handspeed" is overated. He is wreckless and innacurate with the shots. His grinning and putting his hands in the air isn't kidology, it's immaturity.

Fact is, with his huge entourage of back-slappers, the massively overated Roach and Ariza, the Seckbachs, the rappers and all the other shit -it masquerades a very flaky operator.

Even the boxing press and pundits were waxing lyrical about 'stopping Peterson' and that's just lazyness. I've watched a ton of Peterson fights and knew he wouldn't get stopped. Hurt yes, go down - probably. But the kid would keep coming.

Talk should now focus on him. Because he never had the superstar team, the GBP cheerleaders or the physical gifts that Khan (supposedly) had... he just rolled his sleeves up and put the work in.

And this criticsm of the referee is uncalled for. Khan didn't have one cut, lump or bruise from Peterson's head. Yet Peterson's eye was badly swollen cos Khan through an elbow in it. Khan's use of the elbow, complaining and whinging was the action's of a prima donna. Cortez saved Khan's ass against Maidana and he expected it yet again but because he never got it,he now attacks the ref.

He forgot Peterson was here to win and wasn't making the numbers up for the Amir Khan show.

He thought he'd turn up and clown Peterson with his "skillz" and then call out Mayweather or Bradley. How wrong he was.

Quixall wrote:

allahsnackbar wrote:

Quixall wrote: COS I WANT TO

OK!!!!!

WELL I THINK AMIR WILL LEARN FROM THIS AND COME AGAIN!!!

ROACH IS NOT TEACHING HIM HOW TO FIGHT INSIDE THOUGH. WE SEE THE SAME MISTAKES IN THE MAIDANA AND PETERSON FIGHTS. HE NEEDS TO LEARN HOW TO SPOIL ON THE INSIDE!!!

PERHAPS MANNY STEWART WOULD BE A GOOD TRAINER FOR HIM!!!!!!!

WHAT DO YOU THINK MATE!!!!!!!??

I DONT THINK THAT ROACH WANTS HIM TO FIGHT INSIDE BECAUSE HIS STYLE HAS BEEN CRAFTED AROUND PROTECTING HIS CHIN. I THINK ROACH IS A GOOD ENOUGH TRAINER BUT KHAN NEEDS TO LISTEN TO HIM MORE.

allahsnackbar wrote:

Quixall wrote:

allahsnackbar wrote:
OK!!!!!

WELL I THINK AMIR WILL LEARN FROM THIS AND COME AGAIN!!!

ROACH IS NOT TEACHING HIM HOW TO FIGHT INSIDE THOUGH. WE SEE THE SAME MISTAKES IN THE MAIDANA AND PETERSON FIGHTS. HE NEEDS TO LEARN HOW TO SPOIL ON THE INSIDE!!!

PERHAPS MANNY STEWART WOULD BE A GOOD TRAINER FOR HIM!!!!!!!

WHAT DO YOU THINK MATE!!!!!!!??

I DONT THINK THAT ROACH WANTS HIM TO FIGHT INSIDE BECAUSE HIS STYLE HAS BEEN CRAFTED AROUND PROTECTING HIS CHIN. I THINK ROACH IS A GOOD ENOUGH TRAINER BUT KHAN NEEDS TO LISTEN TO HIM MORE.

YEAH BUT KHAN JUST CANT SEEM TO KEEP FIGHTS ON THE OUTSIDE EVEN THOUGH HE HAS THE SPEED AND SKILLS. ITS INEVITABLE THAT HE WILL BE FORCED TO FIGHT ON THE INSIDE. HE NEEDS TO KNOW HOW TO NEGATE THE OTHER FIGHTER ON THE INSIDE. ROACH HASNT TAUGHT HIM THAT

Quixall wrote:THERE IS AN ARGUMENT THAT SAYS THAT KHAN LIKES OR ALLOWS HIMSELF TO GET TAKEN INTO BRAWLS AND ANOTHER THAT SAYS HE TIRES MID ROUNDS AND THAT IT IS INEVITABLE THAT AT SOME POINT HIS OPPONENT WILL CATCH UP WITH HIM AND THAT HE IS THEN CLUELESS AS TO DEAL WITH THAT SITUATION AKA MAIDANA AN NOW PETERSON. .

Counter-puncher wrote:how is it that you're all so sure Khan is trying to prove his machismo in getting involved with exchanges/ resting on the ropes and taking shots, etc?

just to throw another idea out there:

he moves in a totally hyperactive way that's almost certainly unsustainable throughout the course of the fight.

at some points he gets tired and has to stop moving. that's when he starts taking shots.

I'm not sure its part of any decision on his part, or representative of any macho streak, or any of the other things people like to read into boxer's psyches.

i just think he gets tired and loses the plot and doesn't have the faintest fecking clue what else to do.

Counter-puncher wrote:

Quixall wrote:THERE IS AN ARGUMENT THAT SAYS THAT KHAN LIKES OR ALLOWS HIMSELF TO GET TAKEN INTO BRAWLS AND ANOTHER THAT SAYS HE TIRES MID ROUNDS AND THAT IT IS INEVITABLE THAT AT SOME POINT HIS OPPONENT WILL CATCH UP WITH HIM AND THAT HE IS THEN CLUELESS AS TO DEAL WITH THAT SITUATION AKA MAIDANA AN NOW PETERSON. .

i think you will find that the latter argument, being mine, is correct.

seriously, i think my theory has 2 benefits, being (1) it doesn't try mindreading and (2) has at least some reference to facts and not speculation, IE fighters who circumnavigate the ring like runaway trains tire much quicker than the average.

the third alternative is that Khan in and out of the ring is so stupid he can't walk and chew metaphorical gum at the same time, so any kind of decision-making under pressure is likely to be a fraught affair, at best, and will sometimes end up in him making no decision at all ie lolling on the ropes like a slightly drunken sailor.

G0mez wrote:I don't know why the need to write pages of assessment when the fact is simple: The guy is just not all that.

That's a devastating loss to Prescott and now a to-the-wire loss against a fringe contender.

If Khan was the truth, he'd have ran straight through Peterson like a juggernaut.

This "blurring handspeed" is overated. He is wreckless and innacurate with the shots. His grinning and putting his hands in the air isn't kidology, it's immaturity.

Fact is, with his huge entourage of back-slappers, the massively overated Roach and Ariza, the Seckbachs, the rappers and all the other shit -it masquerades a very flaky operator.

Even the boxing press and pundits were waxing lyrical about 'stopping Peterson' and that's just lazyness. I've watched a ton of Peterson fights and knew he wouldn't get stopped. Hurt yes, go down - probably. But the kid would keep coming.

Talk should now focus on him. Because he never had the superstar team, the GBP cheerleaders or the physical gifts that Khan (supposedly) had... he just rolled his sleeves up and put the work in.

And this criticsm of the referee is uncalled for. Khan didn't have one cut, lump or bruise from Peterson's head. Yet Peterson's eye was badly swollen cos Khan through an elbow in it. Khan's use of the elbow, complaining and whinging was the action's of a prima donna. Cortez saved Khan's ass against Maidana and he expected it yet again but because he never got it,he now attacks the ref.

He forgot Peterson was here to win and wasn't making the numbers up for the Amir Khan show.

He thought he'd turn up and clown Peterson with his "skillz" and then call out Mayweather or Bradley. How wrong he was.

DaveBoyMorrison wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:how is it that you're all so sure Khan is trying to prove his machismo in getting involved with exchanges/ resting on the ropes and taking shots, etc?

just to throw another idea out there:

he moves in a totally hyperactive way that's almost certainly unsustainable throughout the course of the fight.

at some points he gets tired and has to stop moving. that's when he starts taking shots.

I'm not sure its part of any decision on his part, or representative of any macho streak, or any of the other things people like to read into boxer's psyches.

i just think he gets tired and loses the plot and doesn't have the faintest fecking clue what else to do.

Agree with that, if Khan could have ran all night and won he would have. Peterson was too determined and strong for him, Khan threw the kitchen sink at him early on and tired out. The bodyshots from Peterson took a lot of the wind from his sails.

It was an excellent fight, really glad Peterson won and I hope Khan gets some of his own medicine with regards to a rematch.

mrbassie wrote:

G0mez wrote:I don't know why the need to write pages of assessment when the fact is simple: The guy is just not all that.

That's a devastating loss to Prescott and now a to-the-wire loss against a fringe contender.

If Khan was the truth, he'd have ran straight through Peterson like a juggernaut.

This "blurring handspeed" is overated. He is wreckless and innacurate with the shots. His grinning and putting his hands in the air isn't kidology, it's immaturity.

Fact is, with his huge entourage of back-slappers, the massively overated Roach and Ariza, the Seckbachs, the rappers and all the other shit -it masquerades a very flaky operator.

Even the boxing press and pundits were waxing lyrical about 'stopping Peterson' and that's just lazyness. I've watched a ton of Peterson fights and knew he wouldn't get stopped. Hurt yes, go down - probably. But the kid would keep coming.

Talk should now focus on him. Because he never had the superstar team, the GBP cheerleaders or the physical gifts that Khan (supposedly) had... he just rolled his sleeves up and put the work in.

And this criticsm of the referee is uncalled for. Khan didn't have one cut, lump or bruise from Peterson's head. Yet Peterson's eye was badly swollen cos Khan through an elbow in it. Khan's use of the elbow, complaining and whinging was the action's of a prima donna. Cortez saved Khan's ass against Maidana and he expected it yet again but because he never got it,he now attacks the ref.

He forgot Peterson was here to win and wasn't making the numbers up for the Amir Khan show.

He thought he'd turn up and clown Peterson with his "skillz" and then call out Mayweather or Bradley. How wrong he was.

Great post agree completely. He is a good fighter and that was a great fight but he's flawed. I too don't understand all this "machismo" talk. The fact is, he couldn't stop Peterson from getting close to him and at mid-range and close-range all Khan has got is a high guard.
Blaming the ref is a child's tantrum. I counted about 7 warnings not to push before the first point deduction. Peterson fought a much cleaner fight but the ref wasn't ignoring anything he did wrong, Khan was just rougher.
Good one for pointing out the use of the elbow, I though I was the only one who noticed that.

I hope this loss brings him down a peg or two once it sinks in that he was fairly beaten. He clearly belives everyone telling him the sun shines out of his arse.

Quixall wrote:
I have seen fighters do much worse than Khan did and if you negate those two point deductions he won the fight by a unanimous decision (Card 114-111, 112-113, 112-113) (Card without deductions 114-111, 114-113, 114-113) so it was the subjectivity of the referee that gave the victory to Peterson, not a spell binding performanc from Peterson, so i don't know where you get this "he was fairly beaten" idea from, because the judges saw the fight for Khan before the deuctions. If Peterson had performed as you seem to suggest then the two point deduction wouldn't have come into play, but as it was it made the verdict of the fight change from the benefit of one fighter to the another. You and Gomez make some points i agree with regarding Khan's performance and his possible weaknesses, but that fight went to Peterson because of the referee, not because he out classed Amir Khan.

mrbassie wrote:

Quixall wrote:
I have seen fighters do much worse than Khan did and if you negate those two point deductions he won the fight by a unanimous decision (Card 114-111, 112-113, 112-113) (Card without deductions 114-111, 114-113, 114-113) so it was the subjectivity of the referee that gave the victory to Peterson, not a spell binding performanc from Peterson, so i don't know where you get this "he was fairly beaten" idea from, because the judges saw the fight for Khan before the deuctions. If Peterson had performed as you seem to suggest then the two point deduction wouldn't have come into play, but as it was it made the verdict of the fight change from the benefit of one fighter to the another. You and Gomez make some points i agree with regarding Khan's performance and his possible weaknesses, but that fight went to Peterson because of the referee, not because he out classed Amir Khan.

Well, I'll explain it to you. he was beaten fairly because the point deductions were fair and I'm not going to discount them because they in fact happened. I don't understand why you're shitting on the ref for doing his job properly. Khan resorted to pushing him away because he coudln't keep him off. You're not allowed to push, he was repeatedly warned but didn't stop so quite rightly the ref penalised him.
Look for Dave Parris to referee the rematch.

Quixall wrote: Well, whether the referee was correct or not is a subjective argument, some say it was right others disagree, i personally have seen fighters do much worse and i have rarely seen a fight where two points were deducted, but that i the referee's perogative and he took the points. My main issue with what you said was that you seemed to be hinting that Peterson won that fight because he was the better fighter on the night. All i was pointing out was that the deductions aside, the judges didn't agree with you, as i high-lighted on the previous post. Now, i agree that points deductions are a part of the sport and in this case it swayed the verdict completely to Peterson, Khan had a bad night and didn't employ the correct tactics and attitude, but Peterson did not win that fight without the help of the referee, for suppossed fouls that other referees would have ignored. As i said earlier, you would have had a case if the scores had been something like 116-112 with the two points deducted, still making Peterson the winner by a margin that wouldn't have been affected by a two point deduction. That would have gone some way to make people conclude that Peterson out fought, out smarted and out skilled Khan for much of the fight, but that was not the case and he beat Khan, a very below Khan by a very narrow margin with the help of a two point deduction by the referee.

Counter-puncher wrote:Khan's got away with infractions unpunished in the past (rabbitpunching Paulie M, possibly deserved a point off for holding vs Maidana?), so to an extent and perceived unfairness may have just been equalled out.

DaveBoyMorrison wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:Khan's got away with infractions unpunished in the past (rabbitpunching Paulie M, possibly deserved a point off for holding vs Maidana?), so to an extent and perceived unfairness may have just been equalled out.

Before the fight I wanted Khan to win, after he started sprinting backwards trying to spoil I was with Peterson. After another while I was shouting ineffectually for the ref to take a point off for elbowing. I continued even after the first point was off because Khan was doing it because he could not handle the inside pressure, not for any other reason and its simply illegal in boxing. I've defo seen other refs let fighters get away with far more but I don't think they should. I think refs on the whole could do with being more stringent regarding holding and spoiling. I really disliked Hatton for bringing it to most of his fights, its just rubbish IMO.

mrbassie wrote:Have you considered that that might not be a good thing?