BoxRec

King Geedorah wrote:

Lenny wrote:No I agree Lewis didn't have the style to outbox McCall and stay out of trouble like he would have later in his career under Steward. Also the Briggs fight whilst not be comparably, was only an example of Lewis coming back after being hurt albeit not to the same extent

It's more the point that an early knockdown should be necessarily a sign of things to come. Was Lewis really more hurt than say Haye against Mormeck? I'm not necessarily saying it was a bad stoppage but Lewis wasn't given the chance at the time to prove his toughness that other fighters have. Holmes was and whilst you can point at his tough sparing, he still needs the ref to be experienced like he was and take that into account.

Okay as I think I keep contradicting myself and we are dealing with twilight zones, how about the Lewis from the Tua fight is the one that is put down by McCall (regardless of whether you think that would have happened), can you see a case for him being aloud to continue?

It doesn’t work like that in my mind as the Lewis from the Tua fight identified Tua’s danger punch and kept his right hand glued to his ear, used movement and held in close. Say Lewis and Pepe had studied McCall, which they may have done to be fair, although there’s a difference between seeing a fight and watching it, they still would have been caught out as Steward was brought in, along with Page, specifically to pick Lewis apart.

At the time Lennox stayed in the pocket and flailed away, this made him more effective offensively as it goes, but post-Ruddock he loaded up on the right and would drop his left when throwing it plus threw it in a bowling motion. There’s an issue of Boxing Monthly in which Lewis talks about hiring Manny and Steward reveals how they took Lewis apart, they show photos from the Phil Jackson(?) fight to highlight their points. I will dig out the issue number ASAP or maybe Glyn can recall it.

I don’t think Briggs hurt him too badly, Lennox struggled with speed but the moment you mentioned was more balance than a shot.

Back to Lewis-McCall 1. Lewis was a lot worse than Haye versus Mormeck, a lot worse, he was very much gone and unlike Haye had never been in this position before so didn’t know what to do. Both refs had a lot to take into account when it came to Holmes, Lewis didn’t have that reputation, the ref had a stricken fighter who was all at sea and made the right call. I have never questioned that call.

Don’t forget, Lewis argued bitterly against it but swore he could carry on in Africa, albeit briefly, and isn’t really an accurate judge.

As you say, it is guesswork but my guess is that had Lewis been allowed to continue it would have been similar to Louis-Schmeling 1 in that both men had a huge flaw clinically exploited and could not adjust during the right itself. The difference is that Louis was a superior fighter to Lewis in almost every department, I’m not sure Lennox could take that type of prolonged beating and bounce back.

To misquote Tyson, ‘Lennox should stand up on his mother’s shoulders and kiss that ref’s ass’ as he allowed Lennox to make crucial changes.

King Geedorah wrote:

loaded_gloves wrote:When the ref stopped Lewis vs McCall, people seem to forget Lewis was falling 'into' the ref at the time - if the ref had stepped aside he'd have fallen on his face!

He was unsteady for a fair while after the stoppage. Legit KO, face it Brits.

I concur, and if this man is who I think he is then he knows his onions when it comes to heavies

Old bones Ian wrote:The king of Brutal Knockouts ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3PpR12yaRs

Jeff Thomas wrote:

Old bones Ian wrote:The king of Brutal Knockouts ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3PpR12yaRs

more then that.... he was the greatest

Old bones Ian wrote:

Jeff Thomas wrote:

Old bones Ian wrote:The king of Brutal Knockouts ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3PpR12yaRs

more then that.... he was the greatest

he is certainly up in the top, i always think its hard to pick one guy that would of beaten them all. But Louis was something else when it came to brutalising an opponent, he just punched hard from start to finish of a fight. And had one of the best right hands of any heavyweight.

MightyWarrior wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEaDtbGzMb4

2:20 in......Shavers knocks down Holmes. I've never seen a fighter hit so hard then get up and win the fight. Even more amazing when you realise he's been hit full blooded by possibly the hardest puncher in heavyweight history. Larry Holmes, what a legend.