BoxRec

Cotto has been one of the best boxers of his generation. Yes he lost a few but that's what happens when fighters generally fight the best around , they win some and they lose some. it's very rare that a fighter faces all his top level peers and remains undefeated.

I'd rather face the best and have a few defeats than remain undefeated with a protected record.

The only fights he should probably have had that he didn’t were against Hatton when he was at Light welterweight and Golovkin at middleweight.

Boxing needs more Miguel Cottos

Jip wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 09:32 Top 50 boxer ever. Was close beating floyd. Prime manny beat him, peak prime manny is a very bad man, atg 10! No problem losing against that guy.

Not a chance top 50 ever. Ludicrous.

caldo2025 wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 07:58

jamamb wrote: ↑29 Nov 2017, 16:13 ops THE biggest bitcher on boxrec. cotto not overrated at all. farewell to a very good fighter with a very good career. could outbox guys or hunt and beat them down.

stvernes beating wilder errbody!

The literary genius is back with his incredible writing prowess. He has no idea what letters need to be capitalized or how to form a sentence but he gets to stalk me on my every post. You should have to pass a writing test to get a login to this site or at least make it through 2nd grade.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 12:41

Jip wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 09:32 Top 50 boxer ever. Was close beating floyd. Prime manny beat him, peak prime manny is a very bad man, atg 10! No problem losing against that guy.

Slow your roll now, he was a very exciting and great fighter. He's not top 200. Boxing has a very rich history. Hit your local library and read up on it...or hell...use the internet.

You'd be well served to learn that Boxing didn't start in the year 2000.

And by the way. I'm not trying to insult you by saying this, so don't take it as an insult because that's not my intention. Everybody's gotta learn about the past at some point. You won't regret it. Boxing has a very fascinating history.

Not top 200? That might be more ridiculous than top 50.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 15:40

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 12:41

Jip wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 09:32 Top 50 boxer ever. Was close beating floyd. Prime manny beat him, peak prime manny is a very bad man, atg 10! No problem losing against that guy.

Slow your roll now, he was a very exciting and great fighter. He's not top 200. Boxing has a very rich history. Hit your local library and read up on it...or hell...use the internet.

You'd be well served to learn that Boxing didn't start in the year 2000.

And by the way. I'm not trying to insult you by saying this, so don't take it as an insult because that's not my intention. Everybody's gotta learn about the past at some point. You won't regret it. Boxing has a very fascinating history.

Not top 200? That might be more ridiculous than top 50.

Could be. I haven't actually made a list that extensive, but he's definitely not Top 50 nor Top 100.

I wouldn't have an issue with him at the back of the top 100. He compares favorably with Pryor, who definitely isn't top 50 either.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:01 I wouldn't have an issue with him at the back of the top 100. He compares favorably with Pryor, who definitely isn't top 50 either.

There's always gonna be some disagreement with lists like these, but nevertheless it's a lot more realistic than a list than includes mostly guys from right now

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:20

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:01 I wouldn't have an issue with him at the back of the top 100. He compares favorably with Pryor, who definitely isn't top 50 either.

There's always gonna be some disagreement with lists like these, but nevertheless it's a lot more realistic than a list than includes mostly guys from right now

Your list in fine, only a handful of stand out errors. Pryor being the most glaring. Thats not a disagreement, that's just wrong. Dempsey too.

Pryor was toward the back end. I don't doubt there are guys I could be swayed to put ahead of him upon further review, but I know you seem to have a distaste for Pryor as all your comments on him seem to be negative. So I have to take your stance on Pryor here with a grain of salt.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:28 Pryor was toward the back end. I don't doubt there are guys I could be swayed to put ahead of him upon further review, but I know you seem to have a distaste for Pryor as all your comments on him seem to be negative. So I have to take your stance on Pryor here with a grain of salt.

I was a big Pryor fan. You can take whatever you like from my wisdom, he ain't top 50. Not even close.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:52

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:28 Pryor was toward the back end. I don't doubt there are guys I could be swayed to put ahead of him upon further review, but I know you seem to have a distaste for Pryor as all your comments on him seem to be negative. So I have to take your stance on Pryor here with a grain of salt.

I was a big Pryor fan. You can take whatever you like from my wisdom, he ain't top 50. Not even close.

Who would you replace him with...and I assume you'd replace Dempsey as well?

Alright. So who with?

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:55

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:52

gilgamesh wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 16:28 Pryor was toward the back end. I don't doubt there are guys I could be swayed to put ahead of him upon further review, but I know you seem to have a distaste for Pryor as all your comments on him seem to be negative. So I have to take your stance on Pryor here with a grain of salt.

I was a big Pryor fan. You can take whatever you like from my wisdom, he ain't top 50. Not even close.

Who would you replace him with...and I assume you'd replace Dempsey as well?

Alright. So who with?

I don't think he would be in my top 100. I'd replace a lot of guys, but a lot of it is subjective. Morales wouldn't be in my top 50, do I hate him too? If you want a name, Kid Gavilan is in my top 20. So is Jimmy McClarnin. Not having them in the top 50 is comical. Holman Williams is neck and neck with Burley. Fidel LaBarba. Luis Rodriguez, Carlos Monzon, Ted Lews, Jack Britton, Pancho Villa, etc.. Happy?

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 17:05
I don't think he would be in my top 100. I'd replace a lot of guys, but a lot of it is subjective. Morales wouldn't be in my top 50, do I hate him too? If you want a name, Kid Gavilan is in my top 20. So is Jimmy McClarnin. Not having them in the top 50 is comical. Holman Williams is neck and neck with Burley. Fidel LaBarba. Luis Rodriguez, Carlos Monzon, Ted Lews, Jack Britton, Pancho Villa, etc.. Happy?

Yes I am actually. I could've done without the snarkiness, but other than that, I appreciated the name drops

I believe the snarkiness started with you this time. If mcclarnin wasn't just someone you forgot you should look him up. His resume is better than Pryor and Dempsey combined. Not sure if you had Barney Ross either.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑30 Nov 2017, 17:45 I believe the snarkiness started with you this time. If mcclarnin wasn't just someone you forgot you should look him up. His resume is better than Pryor and Dempsey combined. Not sure if you had Barney Ross either.

I had Barney, and yeah actually McLarnin is just someone I forgot.

good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

So is Adrien Broner, and Broner's not even a great in his own time.

Cotto is definitely an ATG don't get me wrong, but how many weight classes a guy won a World Title in doesn't mean what it used to in the era of Cracker Jack Box titles.

Ricky Burns for instance is a 3 weight World Champion, and I don't think he's ever been one of the Top 5 guys in any weight class he's ever competed in at any point.

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:33

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

Who was 'the man' at 140 circa 2004?

I don't really like Cotto tbh. Have to admit though that he's rated pretty fairly. He's a very good fighter and has faced most of the best guys. I thought he done alright against Mayweather as well and had his moments. I personally hate these farewell type fights so I'm kinda hoping the guy Ali can get the win but I reckon Cotto will stop him.

Always think back to Cotto v Hatton at 140! It's a shame that never happened. Hatton always fancied the job. Would've been an interesting contest.

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:33

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

Not that I agree with the criteria, but he was 'the man' after he beat Mosley.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:36

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 13:23 good fighter with a fan-friendly style, drew-in the puerto rican market

not an all time great though

and yea sergio was just looking for a final payday in that fight and pretty much gave cotto the mideleweight belt.
didn't hurt martinez's legacy since we all know prime sergio would most likley KO cotto

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

So is Adrien Broner, and Broner's not even a great in his own time.

Cotto is definitely an ATG don't get me wrong, but how many weight classes a guy won a World Title in doesn't mean what it used to in the era of Cracker Jack Box titles.

Ricky Burns for instance is a 3 weight World Champion, and I don't think he's ever been one of the Top 5 guys in any weight class he's ever competed in at any point.

Yes he has, just haven't beaten them. He lost to Crawford.

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:44

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:33

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

Who was 'the man' at 140 circa 2004?

circa 2004? Tszyu then Hatton. Cotto didn't really blossom until he was at 147.

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:44

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:33

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

Who was 'the man' at 140 circa 2004?

I think Kostya Tszyu was if i remember correctly

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 18:01

phillykid wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 17:33

Ricky_ wrote: ↑01 Dec 2017, 16:25

What's your standard for ATG? Cotto is a 4 weight world champion.

well, for me one of the criteria to be an all-time great is you have to be the man in your division for awhile, at the very least 1 point in time.

cotto was always top 5 when he was at super lightweight and welterweight, but he was never the man, but he was marketable and did provide a good payday to those who fought him

cotto was good for boxing and great for his time, but not an all time great to me.

Not that I agree with the criteria, but he was 'the man' after he beat Mosley.

i forgot about that, that was actually a good win against a pretty good version of Mosely.

i'd say he was close, but not exacly the man at that point, Mayweather was also pretty big at the time as well and just had fights with Hatton and Oscar.

2008 on the other hand, was supposed to be Cotto's year to really establish dominance but then the Margarito fight sort of derailed that.