wlad -AJ, watched again ...

[jamamb]

That fight was a lesson on the truth of the aphorism "never put off until tomorrow what you can do today". Joshua was dead on his feet and instead of finishing him off Wlad said, "Oh bother, what's the rush? Ill do it next round. He probably won't even come out for the next round."

That's what I was thinking the second time I watched it. Why Wlad didn't finish him we will never know. He wasn't tired, and AJ was all over the place. After the second wstch I concluded AJ was lucky to win that fight, in fact, I would go so far as to say Wlad lost it.

its just wasnt wlads mentality by that point to really throw the kitchen sink, even though his output vs aj was still higher then it had been for years. also aj had rocked him just right before so maybe still a bit hesistant from that.

its true that aj was badly hurt and serriously tired. i thought he was gone. he could barely hold his arms up and was sagging on the ropes.

[Luis Fernando12]

Wlad vs Pulev came out as an one-sided mismatch though

That was mostly down to Pulev getting caught too early and not recovering. Outside of the knockdowns and the knockout of course, the fight was pretty competitive and Wladimir Klitschko wasn't as dominant with his jab or at winning the rounds as he usually is against smaller sized opponents. That fight wasn't a size mismatch.

Now compare that to Wlad vs Povetkin where Povetkin couldn't even win a single second of any round. Or Joshua vs Takam where Takam couldn't win a single round either. Because they were mismatches in terms of size and the smaller boxer has practically no chance at winning against a bigger sized ELITE opponent WHO KNOWS how to use his size advantage.

Povetkin vs Joshua will be the same! Pulev vs Joshua would be far more competitive without a doubt.

Should they have eliminated larger heavies when Tyson and Holyfield thrashing them? Povetkin was rode around the ring the entire fight. The guy was grabbed after most of Wlads punches before he could retaliate. Didn't Wlad grab and push down on Haye every chance he got? Is excessive clinching and constantly pushing down on your opponent effective use of your size? Thought it was illegal.

Should they have eliminated larger heavies when Tyson and Holyfield thrashing them? Povetkin was rode around the ring the entire fight. The guy was grabbed after most of Wlads punches before he could retaliate. Didn't Wlad grab and push down on Haye every chance he got? Is excessive clinching and constantly pushing down on your opponent effective use of your size? Thought it was illegal.

There seems to be an inconsistency on the ruling surrounding clinching/holding. I'm of the belief that it's down to the referees discretion - which personally is not good enough. The Tom Schwartz performance last weekend was about as textbook borderline cheating that you can get. I'd like to see it policed a bit more closely, as smaller guys are unable to establish a game plan. This would help reduce the size dynamic in fights.

I think the division should get an overhaul with the clinching before separating it out. Povetkin had no chance to get any kind of offense running because Klitschko literally broke so many damn rules without repercussion. It would've been nice to see Povetkin get a fair chance. On the plus side, the version of Povetkin that Klitschko fought was a bit of a lazy fighter.

He was soft as hell for the biggest fight of his life. Then he came back against Charr looking like a beast and went on that impressive knockout spree.

Mike Tyson and Evander Holyfield never beat ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS. Each time they faced such ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS who actually knew how to use their size advantages properly, they lost. Which is why Holyfield lost both fights to Lennox Lewis and lost the trilogy against Riddick Bowe. Which is why Mike Tyson lost a lopsided mismatch to Lennox Lewis where he was tossed around like a rag doll. The same way Alexander Povetkin was tossed around by Wladimir Klitschko.

Yes, we could rightly argue that bigger sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to clinch / hold. However, we should also then argue that smaller sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to lean in with their heads either. I think that's when Wlad clinches the most.

However, in the heavyweight division, shouldn't it be up to the boxer to overcome the clinching / holding tactics of their opponent by ensuring that they are physically strong enough and big enough? In the heavyweight division, one can weigh as much as they like over 200 pounds. And the heavyweight division, unlike any other weight division is mostly about size, physical strength and punching power. Which are more important traits than any other traits, including skills. Which isn't the case in any other weight division. Therefore, if one feels they can't deal with an opponent using their strength advantage over them by holding / clinching because they themselves are too small and lack the necessary physical strength themselves, then shouldn't they reconsider being a heavyweight altogether in the first place? Should they even be qualified to compete in the heavyweight division in the first place as credible heavyweights?

Simply put, if you lack the physical strength as Povetkin so clearly did against Wladimir Klitshcko to deal with an opponent out-muscling you, then you simply can't be seen as a respectable, serious or a credible heavyweight any longer

[Luis Fernando12]

Wladimir Klitschko vs Kubrat Pulev was a better fight in my opinion. Wlad wasn't coming off a 2 year layoff at age 41 in that fight.

Either way, that's one of the biggest reasons why there should be a super heavyweight division where super heavyweight sized boxers like Anthony Joshua, Wladimir Klitschko and Kubrat Pulev are separated from small, irrelevant and midget sized heavyweights like Carlos Takam, David Haye and Alexander Povetkin who have no business even being in today's 'SUPER HEAVYWEIGHT' landscape.

Simply because, we will continue to see the most entertaining fights when both boxers are evenly matched in terms of size. Wladimir Klitschko vs Anthony Joshua was an entertaining and a great fight because both were evenly matched in size. Same thing with Lennox Lewis vs Vitali Klitschko. Carlos TAkam vs Alexander Povetkin was also very entertaining and a great fight because both were also evenly matched in size. Meanwhile, Wladimir Klitschko vs Alexander Povetkin, Anthony Joshua vs Carlos Takam and Anthony Joshua vs Alexander Povetkin were / will be boring, non-entertaining and unwatchable mismatches due to the insane size differences between the competitors. It's ridiculous that this problem is still going on and super heavyweights get credit for beating up small men they should really be squashing like bugs / ants / insects and as if they are meant to even be credible fights.

Wlad vs Pulev came out as an one-sided mismatch though

Yes....it was a mismatch which made it uninteresting... There also was a tremendous amount of clinching and rabbit punching... It wasn't a cleanly fought fight and Kubrat didn't do anything... Joshua-Klitschko was an all-time classic.

Wladimir Klitschko vs Kubrat Pulev was about two guys at, or close to their very best, fighting against each other. Whilst Wladimir Klitschko vs Anthony Joshua was a shot, 41 year old heavyweight coming off a 2 year lay off against prime Anthony Joshua. That was supposed to be the real mismatch. Only it wasn't, because Joshua wasn't as good as I thought. Look at what Mike Tyson did to a declined and old former heavyweight champion in Larry Holmes and compare that to Johsua's relative abysmal performance against an even older and more declined version of Wladimir Klitschko.

Peak version of a boxer vs peak version of a boxer (Wladimir Klitschko vs Kubrat Pulev) > declined version of a boxer vs peak version of a boxer (Wladimir Klitschko vs Anthony Joshua).

As for 'clean' fight. Anthony Joshua vs Wladimir Klitschko was just as foul fest, if not more than Wladimir Klitschko vs Kubrat Pulev. Remind us how Joshua landed his fight changing uppercut in the 11th round on Wladimir Klitschko? Oh that's right! By illegally pulling Wlad's head down onto an uppercut. Guess how the fight was stopped? Oh that's right! On Joshua landing illegal, back of the head punches and rabbit punches. Even the stoppage was questionable and arguably premature. Joshua barely landed any legal punches at the time of the stoppage.

So please spare me the idea that Joshua vs Klitschko was any 'cleaner' than Pulev vs Klitschko.

[Luis Fernando12]

no. you don't really believe that.

Oh yes I do! Just because that fight wasn't as hyped up by the Western (especially the British) media and fans, doesn't mean that fight between two Eastern Europeans wasn't also great either.

Wladimir Klitschko wasn't 41 years old and coming off a 2 year lay off against Kubrat Pulev. Wladimir Klitschko vs Anthony Joshua looked entertaining because it was a competitive fight. Which was down to Wladimir Klitschko being shot, ring rusty and his timing being off due to the long lay off and due to being 41 years of age. A younger and a more active Wlad would've finished off Joshua in the 6th round when he had him down.

Wladimir Klitschko's performance against Pulev was far better and superior. That was closer to his best than his performance against Joshua.

Whatever level Klitschko was at at the time of the two fights, I'd say an evenly matched back and forth fight, where you can't predict the winner EASILY beats a one-sided beatdown by a prime elite fighter over someone a clear level or two below.

The Pulev fight was one of Wlad's best performances, but you knew the winner right from the first bell.

I also knew who the winner between a 41 year old Wladimir Klitschko coming off a 2 year lay off vs Anthony Joshua would also be before that fight too. Only difference was, I didn't expect it to be as competitive because I thought Joshua would be better than what he showed against Wladimir Klitschko. And history has shown almost every time, that at the elite level, the 40+ year old heavyweight ALMOST ALWAYS, if not ALWAYS has lost to the future best heavyweight who is around a decade younger. Ergo, based on probability, I made Joshua the significant favorite to beat that shot version of Wladimir Klitshcko.

Yes, Wladimir Klitschko vs Joshua was a very entertaining fight because it was competitive. But it was also somewhat non-entertaining seeing how inaccurate and how poor Wladimir Klitschko's timing was when he was swinging and missing wildly. Wlad's timing and accuracy was shot from the ring rust and the old age against Joshua. Which is why seeing Wlad performing at such a low level, relative to what he is capable of, wasn't as entertaining as seeing him when he is at his best or close to his best.

Against Kubrat Pulev, Wlad's timing and accuracy was firing close to its best. Far better than it did against Joshua. This is why seeing two boxers close to their best or at their best against each other, is far more entertaining than seeing one boxer way past his best, facing a peak version of their opponent.

Joshua vs Wlad was an overrated fight in my opinion. Mainly hyped up by the Western and British media more than it deserves to be.

[MrGuy]

That was mostly down to Pulev getting caught too early and not recovering. Outside of the knockdowns and the knockout of course, the fight was pretty competitive and Wladimir Klitschko wasn't as dominant with his jab or at winning the rounds as he usually is against smaller sized opponents. That fight wasn't a size mismatch.

Now compare that to Wlad vs Povetkin where Povetkin couldn't even win a single second of any round. Or Joshua vs Takam where Takam couldn't win a single round either. Because they were mismatches in terms of size and the smaller boxer has practically no chance at winning against a bigger sized ELITE opponent WHO KNOWS how to use his size advantage.

Povetkin vs Joshua will be the same! Pulev vs Joshua would be far more competitive without a doubt.

Should they have eliminated larger heavies when Tyson and Holyfield thrashing them? Povetkin was rode around the ring the entire fight. The guy was grabbed after most of Wlads punches before he could retaliate. Didn't Wlad grab and push down on Haye every chance he got? Is excessive clinching and constantly pushing down on your opponent effective use of your size? Thought it was illegal.

Should they have eliminated larger heavies when Tyson and Holyfield thrashing them? Povetkin was rode around the ring the entire fight. The guy was grabbed after most of Wlads punches before he could retaliate. Didn't Wlad grab and push down on Haye every chance he got? Is excessive clinching and constantly pushing down on your opponent effective use of your size? Thought it was illegal.

There seems to be an inconsistency on the ruling surrounding clinching/holding. I'm of the belief that it's down to the referees discretion - which personally is not good enough. The Tom Schwartz performance last weekend was about as textbook borderline cheating that you can get. I'd like to see it policed a bit more closely, as smaller guys are unable to establish a game plan. This would help reduce the size dynamic in fights.

I think the division should get an overhaul with the clinching before separating it out. Povetkin had no chance to get any kind of offense running because Klitschko literally broke so many damn rules without repercussion. It would've been nice to see Povetkin get a fair chance. On the plus side, the version of Povetkin that Klitschko fought was a bit of a lazy fighter.

He was soft as hell for the biggest fight of his life. Then he came back against Charr looking like a beast and went on that impressive knockout spree.

Mike Tyson and Evander Holyfield never beat ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS. Each time they faced such ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS who actually knew how to use their size advantages properly, they lost. Which is why Holyfield lost both fights to Lennox Lewis and lost the trilogy against Riddick Bowe. Which is why Mike Tyson lost a lopsided mismatch to Lennox Lewis where he was tossed around like a rag doll. The same way Alexander Povetkin was tossed around by Wladimir Klitschko.

Yes, we could rightly argue that bigger sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to clinch / hold. However, we should also then argue that smaller sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to lean in with their heads either. I think that's when Wlad clinches the most.

However, in the heavyweight division, shouldn't it be up to the boxer to overcome the clinching / holding tactics of their opponent by ensuring that they are physically strong enough and big enough? In the heavyweight division, one can weigh as much as they like over 200 pounds. And the heavyweight division, unlike any other weight division is mostly about size, physical strength and punching power. Which are more important traits than any other traits, including skills. Which isn't the case in any other weight division. Therefore, if one feels they can't deal with an opponent using their strength advantage over them by holding / clinching because they themselves are too small and lack the necessary physical strength themselves, then shouldn't they reconsider being a heavyweight altogether in the first place? Should they even be qualified to compete in the heavyweight division in the first place as credible heavyweights?

Simply put, if you lack the physical strength as Povetkin so clearly did against Wladimir Klitshcko to deal with an opponent out-muscling you, then you simply can't be seen as a respectable, serious or a credible heavyweight any longer

Tyson and Holyfield were both past it at the time if they fought Lewis. They both beat guys even though not as big, that were better than these super heavyweights. Arguing excessive clinching is ok because the other fighter should find a way out if it, is nonsense. It's illegal. That's like saying low blows should be ok, because the other fighter should find a way to negate it. Skill is more important than strength. This isnt weightlifting. The strength advantage should be through punching not holding. If these guys are so great, then why excessively hold to beat smaller fighters? Because they arent better than them. How is leaning in to punch the same as illegally excessively holding? You lean forward to punch. Leaning forward to punch is common sense. You get leverage, not lean back and swat punches.

[Rob3_142]

Mike Tyson and Evander Holyfield never beat ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS. Each time they faced such ELITE SUPER HEAVYWEIGHTS who actually knew how to use their size advantages properly, they lost. Which is why Holyfield lost both fights to Lennox Lewis and lost the trilogy against Riddick Bowe. Which is why Mike Tyson lost a lopsided mismatch to Lennox Lewis where he was tossed around like a rag doll. The same way Alexander Povetkin was tossed around by Wladimir Klitschko.

Yes, we could rightly argue that bigger sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to clinch / hold. However, we should also then argue that smaller sized boxers shouldn't be allowed to lean in with their heads either. I think that's when Wlad clinches the most.

However, in the heavyweight division, shouldn't it be up to the boxer to overcome the clinching / holding tactics of their opponent by ensuring that they are physically strong enough and big enough? In the heavyweight division, one can weigh as much as they like over 200 pounds. And the heavyweight division, unlike any other weight division is mostly about size, physical strength and punching power. Which are more important traits than any other traits, including skills. Which isn't the case in any other weight division. Therefore, if one feels they can't deal with an opponent using their strength advantage over them by holding / clinching because they themselves are too small and lack the necessary physical strength themselves, then shouldn't they reconsider being a heavyweight altogether in the first place? Should they even be qualified to compete in the heavyweight division in the first place as credible heavyweights?

Simply put, if you lack the physical strength as Povetkin so clearly did against Wladimir Klitshcko to deal with an opponent out-muscling you, then you simply can't be seen as a respectable, serious or a credible heavyweight any longer

It's so tiring to read your posts.

[Ilya Muromets]

That fight was a lesson on the truth of the aphorism "never put off until tomorrow what you can do today". Joshua was dead on his feet and instead of finishing him off Wlad said, "Oh bother, what's the rush? Ill do it next round. He probably won't even come out for the next round."

That's what I was thinking the second time I watched it. Why Wlad didn't finish him we will never know. He wasn't tired, and AJ was all over the place. After the second wstch I concluded AJ was lucky to win that fight, in fact, I would go so far as to say Wlad lost it.

Yep, Wlad snatched defeat from out of the jaws of victory. Shame too. The greatest heavyweight of all times, with the exception of, or co honor going to, big brother Vitali, he should have retired with one final big triumph. Well, maybe both of them will still come back again. Wouldnt that be something! They do always stay in top shape.

Maybe I'll come back too. All i need is a rebuilt back and a few decades.

[KiwiRider]

That fight was a lesson on the truth of the aphorism "never put off until tomorrow what you can do today". Joshua was dead on his feet and instead of finishing him off Wlad said, "Oh bother, what's the rush? Ill do it next round. He probably won't even come out for the next round."

That's what I was thinking the second time I watched it. Why Wlad didn't finish him we will never know. He wasn't tired, and AJ was all over the place. After the second wstch I concluded AJ was lucky to win that fight, in fact, I would go so far as to say Wlad lost it.

Yep, Wlad snatched defeat from out of the jaws of victory. Shame too. The greatest heavyweight of all times, with the exception of, or co honor going to, big brother Vitali, he should have retired with one final big triumph. Well, maybe both of them will still come back again. Wouldnt that be something! They do always stay in top shape.

Maybe I'll come back too. All i need is a rebuilt back and a few decades.

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

[Ilya Muromets]

That's what I was thinking the second time I watched it. Why Wlad didn't finish him we will never know. He wasn't tired, and AJ was all over the place. After the second wstch I concluded AJ was lucky to win that fight, in fact, I would go so far as to say Wlad lost it.

Yep, Wlad snatched defeat from out of the jaws of victory. Shame too. The greatest heavyweight of all times, with the exception of, or co honor going to, big brother Vitali, he should have retired with one final big triumph. Well, maybe both of them will still come back again. Wouldnt that be something! They do always stay in top shape.

Maybe I'll come back too. All i need is a rebuilt back and a few decades.

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

Excellent. If Doctor Margaret comes knocking on the door tell her I'm not in.

[SenorPipino]

Yep, Wlad snatched defeat from out of the jaws of victory. Shame too. The greatest heavyweight of all times, with the exception of, or co honor going to, big brother Vitali, he should have retired with one final big triumph. Well, maybe both of them will still come back again. Wouldnt that be something! They do always stay in top shape.

Maybe I'll come back too. All i need is a rebuilt back and a few decades.

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

Excellent. If Doctor Margaret comes knocking on the door tell her I'm not in.

Oh yeah, you're one of those guys here who has a problem with lady doctors.

[KiwiRider]

Yep, Wlad snatched defeat from out of the jaws of victory. Shame too. The greatest heavyweight of all times, with the exception of, or co honor going to, big brother Vitali, he should have retired with one final big triumph. Well, maybe both of them will still come back again. Wouldnt that be something! They do always stay in top shape.

Maybe I'll come back too. All i need is a rebuilt back and a few decades.

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

Excellent. If Doctor Margaret comes knocking on the door tell her I'm not in.

Keep the blinds closed, and stay away from the windows. If she does suss your there, you might have to put out to nullify her. Now I want your A game if that happens. No quickie slap and tickle, your going to have to put what's left of your back into it lad

[Ilya Muromets]

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

Excellent. If Doctor Margaret comes knocking on the door tell her I'm not in.

Keep the blinds closed, and stay away from the windows. If she does suss your there, you might have to put out to nullify her. Now I want your A game if that happens. No quickie slap and tickle, your going to have to put what's left of your back into it lad

Ha ha but i can't do that, partner. I won't hit a woman even if she is a bitch in the mafia with a mail order make believe doctor degree. Besides she usually has her strongarm crew with her!

[man]

Look at what Mike Tyson did to a declined and old former heavyweight champion in Larry Holmes and compare that to Johsua's relative abysmal performance against an even older and more declined version of Wladimir Klitschko.

wlad was in tremendous shape as proven
by his performance throughout eleven hard
rounds. it is outright amazing he could achieve
that. larry holmes on the other hand clearly had
the physique of a man past his prime.

i think wlad put everything on the line and threw
out all emanual had made him do in order to
get to the top and stay there for so long. he did
want to make one definitive statement about
himself as a boxer. that is what made him overcome
age that night. he would have vaporised tyson fury
with that attitude IMHO.

regarding the pulev bout, i thought it was wlad's
best fight in a long time proving his ability to
overcome adversity and show that he indeed
could take a punch, but it was never even close
to the excitement and drama of the joshua fight.

[Ilya Muromets]

Right. We will get you booked in to fuse those discs, meantime let's start you in on the PEDs

Excellent. If Doctor Margaret comes knocking on the door tell her I'm not in.

Oh yeah, you're one of those guys here who has a problem with lady doctors.

If i don't like someone you extrapolate it to mean i don't like everyone in her sex and profession? Well that's really stupid, but then all your posts are stupid, aren't they? As a matter of fact one of my best friends is a lady doctor.

[Luis Fernando12]

Look at what Mike Tyson did to a declined and old former heavyweight champion in Larry Holmes and compare that to Johsua's relative abysmal performance against an even older and more declined version of Wladimir Klitschko.

wlad was in tremendous shape as proven
by his performance throughout eleven hard
rounds. it is outright amazing he could achieve
that. larry holmes on the other hand clearly had
the physique of a man past his prime.

i think wlad put everything on the line and threw
out all emanual had made him do in order to
get to the top and stay there for so long. he did
want to make one definitive statement about
himself as a boxer. that is what made him overcome
age that night. he would have vaporised tyson fury
with that attitude IMHO.

regarding the pulev bout, i thought it was wlad's
best fight in a long time proving his ability to
overcome adversity and show that he indeed
could take a punch, but it was never even close
to the excitement and drama of the joshua fight.

Physique doesn't tell us the level of performance of a boxer. Chubbier and fatter looking Alexander Povetkin and David Tua always had better stamina than much more muscular and less fat boxers in Mike Tyson or Frank Bruno. It's pretty much an undeniable fact that athletes lose their athletic attributes as they grow older, especially when they reach their late 30's. Wladimir Klitschko is not an exception to this rule! There is a reason why very rarely, if ever do we see Olympic gold medalists in their late 30's or beyond. There is also a reason why even in boxing, boxers are rarely successful at being the number 1 boxer in their division after reaching the late 30's. Until proven otherwise, the correct conclusion is when a boxer reaches their late 30's, they are no longer a credible elite level fighter. Only when there is a continuous trend of boxers in their late 30's and beyond start dominating at the elite level as number 1 boxers in their division, should we start reconsidering the age at which they decline.

The only reason why Anthony Joshua vs Wladimir Klitschko was as exciting and entertaining as it was, was because of how much Wladimir Klitschko declined for that fight. Which caused the fight to be more competitive and therefore more entertaining. I saw a slightly different fight than what others saw in the Wlad vs Joshua fight. I saw a Wladimir Klitschko who's timing was shot, especially in the left hook from the long lay off and old age. I saw a Wladimir Klitschko who was swinging and missing unlike rarely before. That to me wasn't very entertaining. Maybe from a competitiveness standpoint, but not from a peak performance standpoint.

Meanwhile, Wladimir Klitschko's performance against Kubrat Pulev was closer to his peak. And in terms of seeing a boxer at his best (or close to his best), I found Wladimir Klitschko's performance against Kubrat Pulev far more entertaining than seeing his rusty performance against Anthony Joshua.

That just proves how great of a boxer Wladimir Klitschko is. The fact that even when he is at one of his poorest forms, he is still able to make a fight as competitive as he did against an opponent who is his prime that is also 10+ years younger. A peak version of Wladimir Klitschko would've dispatched Anthony Joshua with relative ease IMO.

[Rob3_142]

Can someone give this guy a word limit?

[SenorPipino]

There should be no limits on fascinating insight.

[squiggy]

That fight was a lesson on the truth of the aphorism "never put off until tomorrow what you can do today". Joshua was dead on his feet and instead of finishing him off Wlad said, "Oh bother, what's the rush? Ill do it next round. He probably won't even come out for the next round."

That's what I was thinking the second time I watched it. Why Wlad didn't finish him we will never know. He wasn't tired, and AJ was all over the place. After the second wstch I concluded AJ was lucky to win that fight, in fact, I would go so far as to say Wlad lost it.

I felt like it was pretty obvious why Wlad didn't finish him: Because he was almost fifteen years into suppressing his instinct to go for the kill in order not to suffer any stoppage losses himself.

[Ilya Muromets]

A young Wlad would have had Joshua deep in lala land. Watch Wlad's early fights. He was a devestating finisher back then.

[Ilya Muromets]

Look at what Mike Tyson did to a declined and old former heavyweight champion in Larry Holmes and compare that to Johsua's relative abysmal performance against an even older and more declined version of Wladimir Klitschko.

wlad was in tremendous shape as proven
by his performance throughout eleven hard
rounds. it is outright amazing he could achieve
that. larry holmes on the other hand clearly had
the physique of a man past his prime.

i think wlad put everything on the line and threw
out all emanual had made him do in order to
get to the top and stay there for so long. he did
want to make one definitive statement about
himself as a boxer. that is what made him overcome
age that night. he would have vaporised tyson fury
with that attitude IMHO.

regarding the pulev bout, i thought it was wlad's
best fight in a long time proving his ability to
overcome adversity and show that he indeed
could take a punch, but it was never even close
to the excitement and drama of the joshua fight.

Physique doesn't tell us the level of performance of a boxer. Chubbier and fatter looking Alexander Povetkin and David Tua always had better stamina than much more muscular and less fat boxers in Mike Tyson or Frank Bruno. It's pretty much an undeniable fact that athletes lose their athletic attributes as they grow older, especially when they reach their late 30's. Wladimir Klitschko is not an exception to this rule! There is a reason why very rarely, if ever do we see Olympic gold medalists in their late 30's or beyond. There is also a reason why even in boxing, boxers are rarely successful at being the number 1 boxer in their division after reaching the late 30's. Until proven otherwise, the correct conclusion is when a boxer reaches their late 30's, they are no longer a credible elite level fighter. Only when there is a continuous trend of boxers in their late 30's and beyond start dominating at the elite level as number 1 boxers in their division, should we start reconsidering the age at which they decline.

The only reason why Anthony Joshua vs Wladimir Klitschko was as exciting and entertaining as it was, was because of how much Wladimir Klitschko declined for that fight. Which caused the fight to be more competitive and therefore more entertaining. I saw a slightly different fight than what others saw in the Wlad vs Joshua fight. I saw a Wladimir Klitschko who's timing was shot, especially in the left hook from the long lay off and old age. I saw a Wladimir Klitschko who was swinging and missing unlike rarely before. That to me wasn't very entertaining. Maybe from a competitiveness standpoint, but not from a peak performance standpoint.

Meanwhile, Wladimir Klitschko's performance against Kubrat Pulev was closer to his peak. And in terms of seeing a boxer at his best (or close to his best), I found Wladimir Klitschko's performance against Kubrat Pulev far more entertaining than seeing his rusty performance against Anthony Joshua.

That just proves how great of a boxer Wladimir Klitschko is. The fact that even when he is at one of his poorest forms, he is still able to make a fight as competitive as he did against an opponent who is his prime that is also 10+ years younger. A peak version of Wladimir Klitschko would've dispatched Anthony Joshua with relative ease IMO.

Good post, and i agree, except you are always disparaging Povetkin. He is not "chubby". You are mistaking the natural look of an athlete with the cut up steroidal look that is so common now. Wlad was cut up too, but i don't think he did drugs - i could be wrong, though. He, and his brother, were just totally dedicated physical fitness buffs and always stayed in top shape, plus, of course, exceptional genetics. I was like that too, but of course not on their level, and various people accused me of using steroids but i never touched anything like that. I wasn't cut up in the steroid way either. I was just into physical fitness and therefore became quite muscular (i posted my photo here once). Wlad did change his style when - his name slips my mind - managed him and then he became much more cautious and much less exciting to watch.

[Ilya Muromets]

Klitscho KO's. No, Joshua wouldn't have lasted long against the younger Wladimir. Cody Koch "the Alaskan assassin" was one of Wlad's victims in this film. Koch was killed in a bar twenty years ago.

[HeavyHitters]

Yes, Wlad vs Joshua was a good heavyweight championsip fight, but I wouldn't say the best ever.

You guys need to check out fights like:

Riddick Bowe vs. Evander Holyfield 1 & 2

James "Buster" Douglas vs. Mike Tyson

Mike Tyson vs. Donovan "Razor" Ruddock 1 & 2

Riddick Bowe vs. Andrew Golota 1 & 2

Evander Holyfield vs. Mike Tyson 1 & 2

Lennox Lewis vs. Vitali Klitschko

Lamon Bewster vs. Wladimir Klitschko

Corrie Sanders vs. Wladimir Klitschko

Evander Holyfield vs. Bert Cooper

And many others from the 80's and 90's.....

[HeavyHitters]

Klitscho KO's. No, Joshua wouldn't have lasted long against the younger Wladimir. Cody Koch "the Alaskan assassin" was one of Wlad's victims in this film. Koch was killed in a bar twenty years ago.

Yes, I remember Cody Koch. He was a good young promising heavyweight, up until that tragedy happened. Very sad.

[Ilya Muromets]

Klitscho KO's. No, Joshua wouldn't have lasted long against the younger Wladimir. Cody Koch "the Alaskan assassin" was one of Wlad's victims in this film. Koch was killed in a bar twenty years ago.

Yes, I remember Cody Koch. He was a good young promising heavyweight, up until that tragedy happened. Very sad.

Last i heard nobody was arrested and the circumstances of his death were unclear. I think they found him handcuffed and dead with a bunch of bouncers around him. Was there further developments?

[man]

Can someone give this guy a word limit?