BoxRec

coatzee was not past it at 29!! less than a year earlier, he won the title from dokes!!!

are u telling me page knocked out a past his prime coatzee?

Who would have won the South African Showdown between Gerrie Coetzee vs Frans Botha?

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:coatzee was not past it at 29!! less than a year earlier, he won the title from dokes!!!

are u telling me page knocked out a past his prime coatzee?

I dont even count that loss to Page as legimate as Coetzee was beating the hell out of him through out the fight, but lost his title because some stupid timekeeper couldnt count to 180. If Coetzee was British/Europien or American it would of been ruled either an NC or he would get a rematch.....Gerrie got neither and his world title he fought for was gone. He still didnt get fair treatment when the British fans treated him cruely leading up to the Bruno bout but at least the Americans treated Coetzee and our past fighters warmly - The same cant be said about the British which is sad considering our forefathers fought along side the British in WW1 and WW2 where we fought with them against the Japanese, the Korean war and to a lesser extent the Falklands war.

RazorKO wrote:

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:coatzee was not past it at 29!! less than a year earlier, he won the title from dokes!!!

are u telling me page knocked out a past his prime coatzee?

I dont even count that loss to Page as legimate as Coetzee was beating the hell out of him through out the fight, but lost his title because some stupid timekeeper couldnt count to 180. If Coetzee was British/Europien or American it would of been ruled either an NC or he would get a rematch.....Gerrie got neither and his world title he fought for was gone. He still didnt get fair treatment when the British fans treated him cruely leading up to the Bruno bout but at least the Americans treated Coetzee and our past fighters warmly - The same cant be said about the British which is sad considering our forefathers fought along side the British in WW1 and WW2 where we fought with them against the Japanese, the Korean war and to a lesser extent the Falklands war.

in what way did the british fans treat him cruelly?

headhunter wrote:

RazorKO wrote:

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:coatzee was not past it at 29!! less than a year earlier, he won the title from dokes!!!

are u telling me page knocked out a past his prime coatzee?

I dont even count that loss to Page as legimate as Coetzee was beating the hell out of him through out the fight, but lost his title because some stupid timekeeper couldnt count to 180. If Coetzee was British/Europien or American it would of been ruled either an NC or he would get a rematch.....Gerrie got neither and his world title he fought for was gone. He still didnt get fair treatment when the British fans treated him cruely leading up to the Bruno bout but at least the Americans treated Coetzee and our past fighters warmly - The same cant be said about the British which is sad considering our forefathers fought along side the British in WW1 and WW2 where we fought with them against the Japanese, the Korean war and to a lesser extent the Falklands war.

in what way did the british fans treat him cruelly?

Booing him, sending garbage to his hotel room, making threats to him if he dont leave the UK, the typical Britsh bullshit. Same when American fighters go to the UK or foreign fighters they are treated bad, Ruddock is another who got a hostile reception when he fought in Earls Court. We treated British fighters like Herbie Hide when he came to Sun city and treated him well. But its the typical Europian shit we have to put up with when our sportsman go to their country, as I said at least in America Coetzee and the rest of our fighters were treated good.

RazorKO wrote:the typical Britsh bullshit.

Hey, that one massive sweeping judgemental statement there.

KOJOE90 wrote:

RazorKO wrote:the typical Britsh bullshit.

Hey, that one massive sweeping judgemental statement there.

I find British Bullshit to be of the most diverse and resplendant character. So much so that you can quite honestly say there is no such thing as "Typical" British Bullshit.

KOJOE90 wrote:

RazorKO wrote:the typical Britsh bullshit.

Hey, that one massive sweeping judgemental statement there.

Well i dont mean offense but its true, more so with Britain when compared to other Europien countries - The British fans boo the national anthem of their rival, shout abuse and send threats, didnt happen just with Coetzee but also with fighters like Gerald McClelan - There were british fans shouting 'DIE YOU YANK' or cheering when McClelan was dieing in the ring, an absolute disgrace, you wouldnt see us, the Americans, Candians etc doing it, yes our fans boo the opponent sometimes but we have NEVER scooped down into booing the national anthem of the opponent like the British had done so many times over - Thats an all time low and a disgrace to this sport.

So what Razor is saying...."Bad Behavior... Strictly a British Passtime"

Does make things rather simple. Saves on so much of that annoying "thinking" that can be so aggravating. I'm very tempted to buy in....anyone else?

I have to admit it when fans boo and jeer 'the opponents; national anthem and I agree it is very disrespectfull.

But in my exprience of attending fights in the UK ringside over the last 14+years is that a vast majority of the fans that 'boo' anthems appear to be the more casual/beerboy fan rather than 'hardcore' fight fans.

RazorKO wrote:[There were british fans shouting 'DIE YOU YANK' or cheering when McClelan was dieing in the ring.

I've never heard that been stated before about the aftermath of the Benn vs G-Man fight and that got A LOT of coverage for the obvious reasons.

There may well have been one or two morons shoating crap like that but in a crown of a many hundreds you are always going to get the odd sick idiot. I am sure no real British (or any other nationallity) would shout such things.

BoxBuzz wrote:So what Razor is saying...."Bad Behavior... Strictly a British Passtime"

Does make things rather simple. Saves on so much of that annoying "thinking" that can be so aggravating. I'm very tempted to buy in....anyone else?

Well from my point of view it is. I remember when Hagler got hurled racist abuse and missles fired at him when he beat Alan Minter in Wembly, but in South Africa when Weaver came to fight Coetzee we treated him with the respect he deserved, Weaver said to the reporter along the lines of that he didnt know what the fuss was about on going to fight Coetzee, the South Africans treated me like a king. Also when Page went to fight Coetzee, we gave him a huge cheer and a welcome - And this is at the height of the Aparthied - this proves we wernt racist like the British were and we treated everone equally.

Another thing is that there was a lot of trouble when people tried to convince Bruno not to fight Coetzee because he was a 'Symbol of Aparthied'. But just a mere 5/6 years earlier, the British had as I said hurled racist abuse at Hagler because he was black. I was a young man during the Aparthied so I have know what life was like during this time but I never saw scenes like this in my country like I saw in Britain during sporting events.

KOJOE90 wrote:

RazorKO wrote:[There were british fans shouting 'DIE YOU YANK' or cheering when McClelan was dieing in the ring.

I've never heard that been stated before about the aftermath of the Benn vs G-Man fight and that got A LOT of coverage for the obvious reasons.

There may well have been one or two morons shoating crap like that but in a crown of a many hundreds you are always going to get the odd sick idiot. I am sure no real British (or any other nationallity) would shout such things.

I read in that in the 10th Anniversary of the McClelan - Benn bout article that they shouted that out, but as you said it may be just 1 or 2 people.

Well most bad behavior is the work of individuals. That fall in some "catagory"

Some Gender...safe to say usually men.
Some Nationality
Some Race
Some Philosophy


The only tie that binds these folks together really is the term...Fool

which knows no other true common denominator. They are a special class unto themselves and they are found everywhere.

BoxBuzz wrote:The only tie that binds these folks together really is the term...Fool.

Even more so if they have been drinking on a empty head.

BoxBuzz wrote:Well most bad behavior is the work of individuals. That fall in some "catagory"

Some Gender...safe to say usually men.
Some Nationality
Some Race
Some Philosophy


The only tie that binds these folks together really is the term...Fool

which knows no other true common denominator. They are a special class unto themselves and they are found everywhere.

Yep and all ive seen do it is the British do it during boxing (as well as football) . You cant hide the truth on what they do as I already know

RazorKO wrote:

BoxBuzz wrote:Well most bad behavior is the work of individuals. That fall in some "catagory"

Some Gender...safe to say usually men.
Some Nationality
Some Race
Some Philosophy


The only tie that binds these folks together really is the term...Fool

which knows no other true common denominator. They are a special class unto themselves and they are found everywhere.

Yep and all ive seen do it is the British do it during boxing (as well as football) . You cant hide the truth on what they do as I already know

What SOME of them do

And trust me, plenty of people in Britain hate them just as much as you do, if not more.

Yep...no fool like the local fool.

Forget it you guys.. you cant reason with Razor. The guy is obviously loopy & the more he writes the more it becomes obvious he has all these extreme opinions he cant back up & keeps inventing 'facts' out of thin air to suit his agenda. He lost whatever credibility he had when he re-worded the Terry Lawless quote.

And a guy from the home of apartheid criticising Brits for racist abuse. Thats rich!!!

The guy is skirting around the fact that he has never seen the Coetzee/Tillis fight & cannot offer an educated comment on it, deluded when trying to sell the notion that Page was somehow being 'beaten up' in the Coetzee fight... And as for saying Bruno got knocked out everytime he stepped up... Yeah, what the hell could Coetzee have done against Lennox Lewis & Mike Tyson??? Or even Bonecrusher or Witherspoon?

The highest Coetzee himself ever 'stepped up' was against Weaver & Page -inferior to Bonecrusher (KO1 Weaver, 1986) & Witherspoon (W12 Page, 1984)- he too was stopped, but laid out & COUNTED OUT!!

I saw the Coetzee/Tilis fight and he was hospitalised and suffered a horrendus cut, he should of quit after that but he for Bruno, but Bruno is such a poor quality fighter that Coetzee...despite him being old now would of took him out if he had trained properly.

As for the Page fight, Coetzee as I already stated was beating the living SHIT out of Page and if you didnt see that than you must be blind. Page also commited fouls like rushing Coetzee before the bell had started and punching Coetzee WAY after the bell around round 6. Coetzee was ko'ed when he should of been in his corner, but if he was Europian/British he would of got a rematch or the fight ruled a NC.

Bonecrusher KO'ed an old Mike Weaver after he was knocked out brutally by Pinklon Thomas - and even then Weaver was stopped controversially as he got up but the ref stopped it, almost as bad as Weaver - Dokes. Coetzee got up at 8 after being knocked down by Weaver's best punch but the ref waved it off as he saw he was exhastued - not hurt by Weaver.
At least Coetzee was never nearly knocked out by JUMBO CUMMINGS of all people. The best heavyweights you have is slow Bruno and journeyman Cooper (Do not even think of classing Lewis as British since he was born in Jamica and fought for Canada).

And as for your point about me accusing Britain of racist abuse... look back at the Hagler Minter fight where you hurled abuse at a legendary fighter like Hagler - no wonder Hagler left with hatred towards the British and it was no surpise he didnt fight Sibson there. We never did that EVEN AT THE HEIGHT OF THE APARTHIED.

Wow, that is quite a wild & directionless rant... But please can you share some more details of the Coetzee/Tillis fight since you claimed to have seen it? I can verify anything you say about it as i have the tape.

You obviously have never seen Bonecrusher/Weaver. Weaver got up & staggered like a drunk, his legs trying to walk in different directions. He laid against the corner with his eyes pointing in different directions yet you say this was 'controversial'? Lol, yeah, okay! As for him being old... Well i guess by your bizarre standards he was a senior citizen, but in actual fact he was coming off a big 2 rd KO of Carl Williams (who was top 10 ranked & only loss a split decison to Holmes might i add). Not bad for a pensioner.

By the way genius, let me correct yet another of your invented 'facts'- Lewis was not born in Jamaica, he was born in WEST HAM, LONDON.

RazorKO wrote:I saw the Coetzee/Tilis fight and he was hospitalised and suffered a horrendus cut, he should of quit after that but he for Bruno, but Bruno is such a poor quality fighter that Coetzee...despite him being old now would of took him out if he had trained properly.

As for the Page fight, Coetzee as I already stated was beating the living SHIT out of Page and if you didnt see that than you must be blind. Page also commited fouls like rushing Coetzee before the bell had started and punching Coetzee WAY after the bell around round 6. Coetzee was ko'ed when he should of been in his corner, but if he was Europian/British he would of got a rematch or the fight ruled a NC.

Bonecrusher KO'ed an old Mike Weaver after he was knocked out brutally by Pinklon Thomas - and even then Weaver was stopped controversially as he got up but the ref stopped it, almost as bad as Weaver - Dokes. Coetzee got up at 8 after being knocked down by Weaver's best punch but the ref waved it off as he saw he was exhastued - not hurt by Weaver.
At least Coetzee was never nearly knocked out by JUMBO CUMMINGS of all people. The best heavyweights you have is slow Bruno and journeyman Cooper (Do not even think of classing Lewis as British since he was born in Jamica and fought for Canada).

And as for your point about me accusing Britain of racist abuse... look back at the Hagler Minter fight where you hurled abuse at a legendary fighter like Hagler - no wonder Hagler left with hatred towards the British and it was no surpise he didnt fight Sibson there. We never did that EVEN AT THE HEIGHT OF THE APARTHIED.

Razor

I'm not sure that Coetzee was beating Page up as you say but I do agree that there should have been a rematch at the very least. King tried to get Tyson's Douglas loss erased becasue of a so called long count but nobody seemed to give a fig about Coetzee's loss.

The Minter-Hagler fight was infiltrated with racist fans there's no doubt about that. Hagler deserved better and it was a disgrace and a dishonour. I'm not so sure about the McClellan fight. Don King was a few paces away from him, as he was lying on the floor, and giving an interview in which he called Gerald a dog. That is what stays with me. There may have been a few idiots shouting abuse but I can't verify that one way or another.

I think it's true that over in Britain we do have a thug element to our sport. There is a malicious streak in some of the fans BUT you can't blame Britain as a whole. if you read up on marvin hagler now you'll see that even he likes the UK and is amazed at just how popular he is. He gets one of his warmest welcomes from any country when he visits our shores.

Ezzard wrote:

RazorKO wrote:I saw the Coetzee/Tilis fight and he was hospitalised and suffered a horrendus cut, he should of quit after that but he for Bruno, but Bruno is such a poor quality fighter that Coetzee...despite him being old now would of took him out if he had trained properly.

As for the Page fight, Coetzee as I already stated was beating the living SHIT out of Page and if you didnt see that than you must be blind. Page also commited fouls like rushing Coetzee before the bell had started and punching Coetzee WAY after the bell around round 6. Coetzee was ko'ed when he should of been in his corner, but if he was Europian/British he would of got a rematch or the fight ruled a NC.

Bonecrusher KO'ed an old Mike Weaver after he was knocked out brutally by Pinklon Thomas - and even then Weaver was stopped controversially as he got up but the ref stopped it, almost as bad as Weaver - Dokes. Coetzee got up at 8 after being knocked down by Weaver's best punch but the ref waved it off as he saw he was exhastued - not hurt by Weaver.
At least Coetzee was never nearly knocked out by JUMBO CUMMINGS of all people. The best heavyweights you have is slow Bruno and journeyman Cooper (Do not even think of classing Lewis as British since he was born in Jamica and fought for Canada).

And as for your point about me accusing Britain of racist abuse... look back at the Hagler Minter fight where you hurled abuse at a legendary fighter like Hagler - no wonder Hagler left with hatred towards the British and it was no surpise he didnt fight Sibson there. We never did that EVEN AT THE HEIGHT OF THE APARTHIED.

Razor

I'm not sure that Coetzee was beating Page up as you say but I do agree that there should have been a rematch at the very least. King tried to get Tyson's Douglas loss erased becasue of a so called long count but nobody seemed to give a fig about Coetzee's loss.

The Minter-Hagler fight was infiltrated with racist fans there's no doubt about that. Hagler deserved better and it was a disgrace and a dishonour. I'm not so sure about the McClellan fight. Don King was a few paces away from him, as he was lying on the floor, and giving an interview in which he called Gerald a dog. That is what stays with me. There may have been a few idiots shouting abuse but I can't verify that one way or another.

I think it's true that over in Britain we do have a thug element to our sport. There is a malicious streak in some of the fans BUT you can't blame Britain as a whole. if you read up on marvin hagler now you'll see that even he likes the UK and is amazed at just how popular he is. He gets one of his warmest welcomes from any country when he visits our shores.

Thanks for this post, of course not the whole of Britain are like that, but when I see a major fight in England they all seem to boo the national anthem etc but at least you are the only one to say Coetzee deserved another chance of the long round against Page. Unlike Overhand right where he keeps claiming Coetzee was counted out against Weaver when infact (if he has watched the fight) he got up but the ref stopped it and saw the exhastauted Coetzee walk back to his corner.

Razor you think you got the blues, Everyday I get up I get reminded that Floyd Patterson handed Archie Moore his ass. This is far more burden than what you have to put up with. Count your blessings.

RazorKO wrote:
As for the Page fight, Coetzee as I already stated was beating the living SHIT out of Page and if you didnt see that than you must be blind. Page also commited fouls like rushing Coetzee before the bell had started and punching Coetzee WAY after the bell around round 6. Coetzee was ko'ed when he should of been in his corner, but if he was Europian/British he would of got a rematch or the fight ruled a NC.

.

They must have produced two versions of the fight, kind of like when they shoot two alternate endings in the movies.

Well, in the Page-Coetzee version that I have the South African was clearly behind, because he somehow thought he could fight Page without a jab and on the basis of wild right hand swings. Most of those right hands he desperately threw were badly telegraphed and easily avoided by Page.

He did fight with courage, specially after being down in round 7 and for a short while in round 8 it looked as if he might be able to come back, but Page's combos proved too much for him in the end.

The timekeeper blew it and I agree that Coetzee should have been offered a rematch for that mishap, but in the end what counts is historical fact... and that happens to be (again in the film version that I have ) that Gerrie was sent flat on his back and remained there long after he was counted out.