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Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 22:30
by Elton John
ringsider wrote:
Norris doesn't beat Ray in his prime.
Sure he does. historically, Leonard has never done well with boxers-Bonds and Toothpick Hearns. Even the toothpick outboxed Ray using a simple jab and dance approach. This fight really highlights the waeknesses of Ray I think because I can remember his own trainer yelling at him in his corner "you're blowing it son". If your own trainer is telling you you're blowing it, how good can you be? It shows how incompetent leonard really was.

I can't believe people actually use this fight as a reference to highlight his career. I figure, what else was there? Tommy the toothpick would have easily won if they had fed him before the fight.

I don't mean to belittle your other comments "He won't make the Hall of fame" but where you been the last three years? :oops:

Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 22:40
by I Feel Fine
Even at his advanced age and with his slow motion punching Leonard managed to stun Norris a couple of a times.

Norris was a good fighter, but I guess it takes someone with the name of "Elton John" to think that Norris could have had a chance with prime Leonard.

Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 22:40
by Goodnight, Irene
Terry beats a prime Ray-ville is a magical world, where anything is possible, sans Leonard beating Norris. Marciano would have always killed Louis, Fullmer would always have had the edge on Robinson, & no version of Ali touches Berbick.

Dragons domineer the skies & scorch the earth, kings & their armies forge epic wars, & Terry Norris owns, "one win to rule them all..."

Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 23:04
by Elton John
Goodnight, Irene wrote:Terry beats a prime Ray-ville is a magical world, where anything is possible, sans Leonard beating Norris. Marciano would have always killed Louis, Fullmer would always have had the edge on Robinson, & no version of Ali touches Berbick.

Dragons domineer the skies & scorch the earth, kings & their armies forge epic wars, & Terry Norris owns, "one win to rule them all..."
In a magical world where anything is possible Leonard faces Marvin Hagler by 1983. He also faces Mike McCallum and Micheal Nunn in mandatory defenses instead of Don Lalonde.

Checkmate.

Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 23:08
by Elton John
I also forgot to add he beats all three of them. :lol:

Posted: 16 Feb 2008, 23:12
by Goodnight, Irene
"...Checkmate." - Elton

:lol: :TU:

Loving your work, Terry. Wear that win & rule them all!

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 00:25
by Elton John
Goodnight, Irene wrote:"...Checkmate." - Elton

:lol: :TU:

Loving your work, Terry. Wear that win & rule them all!
Now you're on the winning side! :TU:

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 01:09
by elmersalsa
To say that Terry Norris beats Leonard in his prime is like saying Pazienzia beats Duran everytime at lightweight.

If someone tells me that Mike McCallum beats Leonard, Duran and Hearns at 154lbs, I WOULD NOT DISAGREE WITH THAT PERSON...HE MAY BE RIGHT. I COULD SEE MIKE BEATING THOSE THREE. But Norris?

I don't think that Norris was in the same class of Leonard, Hearns or Duran. Hearns at 154 would have BLAST TERRY NORRIS IN 3 ROUNDS, maybe in 2.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 11:07
by Elton John
elmersalsa wrote:To say that Terry Norris beats Leonard in his prime is like saying Pazienzia beats Duran everytime at lightweight.

If someone tells me that Mike McCallum beats Leonard, Duran and Hearns at 154lbs, I WOULD NOT DISAGREE WITH THAT PERSON...HE MAY BE RIGHT. I COULD SEE MIKE BEATING THOSE THREE. But Norris?

I don't think that Norris was in the same class of Leonard, Hearns or Duran. Hearns at 154 would have BLAST TERRY NORRIS IN 3 ROUNDS, maybe in 2.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Hearns at 154 probably could but Leonard is quite a different story. Leonard wasnt nearly as capable at that weight. Recall the problems Leonard had with kalule and Howard. Did he blow either of them away? No, he struggled even with the diminutive and mediocre Howard. And kalule has nowhere the speed Norris had. In both cases Leonard showed that he does not have enough power to burn down buildings ANY jr. middleweight.

Whereas Norris on the other hand can deal with leonard's speed just as he dealt with the speed of Taylor. No man other than Roy Jones and Hector Camacho has ever possessed the speed that Meldrick and yet Norris dealt with him convincingly-more convincing than Leonard ever dealt with any of his foes, especially that tko over Wilfred Benitez.

People here act as though leonard was at a severe disadvantage going into the Norris fight. Had the odds favored Norris I might well agree but Leonard was in fact a 3-1 favorite to win as Hagler was favored 3-1 to beat Leonard. The impressive thing is that Norris beat Leonard no sweat while Leonard didn't beat Hagler at all.

In a way, you could compare Norris-Leonard to the Johnson-Jeffries match in which Jeffries admitted afterwards "I could not have defeated Johnson even in my prime".

he was man enough to admit this so why doesn't leonard?

Add to that Jeffries had been inactive six years and took of 63 pounds for the fight. Now it seems kind of silly to be comparing Leonard's condition to Jeffries, laughable even, when Leonard was as close to his best weight he could be, was never forced out of retirement the way Jeffries was, had been fighting regularly, performed flawlessly against his arch foe previously without being touched I might add, and was actually FAVORED to to beat Norris too. Of course age wasn't a factor.

So now in comparison with what Jim Jeffries had to go thru it now, to say that leonard was anywhere near a shell not only looks ludicrous, IT IS LUDICROUS. These babies who complain that leonard was shot, etc. need to consider all that Jeffries had to go thru before shooting their mouths off "Leonard was over the hill". Bunch of babies.

Anyway, Leonard had his chance to silence his critics by accepting the challenge of Hagler in 1982. He didnt. he turned tail and ran. Then he came back 5 years later just to pick up the leftovers.

he had a chance to face McCallum in '87 but instead he just sat there in his seat petrified calling the action on HBO as McCallum took out Leonard clone Don Curry with a single blow. He'd like the public to think lalonde was a much worthier opponent.

I would be satisfied if Leonard at least had the guts to make a few mandatory defenses with say Frank Tate, Micheal Nunn, and McCallum but he doesn't have the heart to even do the expected minimum. I can't understand how such an undeserving, pampered, son of the media ever made the HOF.

The Norris fight proved once and for all he can't fight his way out of a paper bag.

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 11:57
by ringsider
.......pampered, son of the media ever made the HOF. .......
I will agree with that statement, problem is as much as he was a media darling when it came time, he preformed. You can't take that away from Sugar Ray. Norris jut didn't have the tools SRL had, and quite frankly the heart when push came to shove. :TU: :TU:

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 12:38
by Elton John
You're delusional. In what way did he perform against Norris? All he did was cower on the ropes for 12 rounds. :lol: When push came to shove, when Terry started the shoving, leonard just toppled over. :TU:

Posted: 17 Feb 2008, 12:46
by Elton John
ringsider wrote:
as much as he was a media darling when it came time, he preformed. You can't take that away from Sugar Ray.


I agree. The lalonde fight was some performance! :D

Posted: 19 Feb 2008, 07:47
by Syntax Error
Elton John wrote:
ringsider wrote:
as much as he was a media darling when it came time, he preformed. You can't take that away from Sugar Ray.


I agree. The lalonde fight was some performance! :D
I've just noticed your location & if I'm right, does Sugar Ray reside there?

Is he a neighbour of yours?

You better be careful what you say about him, or he might come back!!! :P :TU:

Posted: 19 Feb 2008, 21:44
by Elton John
Syntax Error wrote:
Elton John wrote:
ringsider wrote:
as much as he was a media darling when it came time, he preformed. You can't take that away from Sugar Ray.


I agree. The lalonde fight was some performance! :D
I've just noticed your location & if I'm right, does Sugar Ray reside there?

Is he a neighbour of yours?

You better be careful what you say about him, or he might come back!!! :P :TU:
No, thank God he's not my neighbor!! If not for boxing he'd have no chance of being a part of the firmament.