BoxRec

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:[Only a few are. He belongs in the elite. He belongs in the US.

Yup, most truly elite boxers lose to Siaca, get dropped by Nishizawa and Kim and constantly fight the likes of Rico Chong Nee, Ruben Acosta and Pablo Daniel Zamora Nievas while passing up Title shots they think they might lose...

Marlin wrote:

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:[Only a few are. He belongs in the elite. He belongs in the US.

Yup, most truly elite boxers lose to Siaca, get dropped by Nishizawa and Kim and constantly fight the likes of Rico Chong Nee, Ruben Acosta and Pablo Daniel Zamora Nievas while passing up Title shots they think they might lose...

Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

manfredo obviously isnt a world beater but hes certainly a step up for mundine, judgin by mundines last few fights.

i expect mundine to win this, i dont see a stoppage though as mundines power is vastly over rated...

adamheight wrote:manfredo obviously isnt a world beater but hes certainly a step up for mundine, judgin by mundines last few fights.

i expect mundine to win this, i dont see a stoppage though as mundines power is vastly over rated...

I think he might come close to stopping him late. But he won't go for it. He will just consolidate and finish safely.

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:

Marlin wrote:

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:[Only a few are. He belongs in the elite. He belongs in the US.

Yup, most truly elite boxers lose to Siaca, get dropped by Nishizawa and Kim and constantly fight the likes of Rico Chong Nee, Ruben Acosta and Pablo Daniel Zamora Nievas while passing up Title shots they think they might lose...

Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

UB2 - did u fall asleep during the 3rd round of the Kim fight (yes mundines LAST fight)...Mundine got dropped, and got dropped HARD.

by the way, if this fight gets made will it be in australia or the US?

Mundines chin isn't an issue. Its decent. Nothing special, nothing less.

But its all concentration. You underestimate your opponent. You don't expect a shot. Bang your going to the canvas.

I can't see how all the good work his chin did against Kessler and Green. Can be over riden, by 1 unexpected shot.

kessler didnt hit him clean and lets be honest the fists were NOT flying and kessler was injured. Green was SO slow in comparison and went foe the body heaps-proved he has an iron body but Green did not chin him.
as for unexpected shot-it was from a VERY average fighter.A fighter claiming to be THE BEST should never have been dropped by such a fighter.How many times did Glen Kelly even touch roy Jones-not many. oK mundine may not have been on his A game but then even a very past his best Hamden managed to land a few good ones.
The way I see it Crazy should have never landed that shot.Whenever Mundine does punch a bit in a fight he leaves himself open. Hence when he fights soemone he knows can really hurt him(eg Kessler,even siacca )he goes into his shell. Green was an exemption to this but it was clear after about 30 seconds that Mundine was seeing his punches coming a mile away.

JSA wrote:kessler didnt hit him clean and lets be honest the fists were NOT flying and kessler was injured. Green was SO slow in comparison and went foe the body heaps-proved he has an iron body but Green did not chin him.
as for unexpected shot-it was from a VERY average fighter.A fighter claiming to be THE BEST should never have been dropped by such a fighter.How many times did Glen Kelly even touch roy Jones-not many. oK mundine may not have been on his A game but then even a very past his best Hamden managed to land a few good ones.
The way I see it Crazy should have never landed that shot.Whenever Mundine does punch a bit in a fight he leaves himself open. Hence when he fights soemone he knows can really hurt him(eg Kessler,even siacca )he goes into his shell. Green was an exemption to this but it was clear after about 30 seconds that Mundine was seeing his punches coming a mile away.

Disagree, Kessler hit Mundine clean plenty of times. I have watched the Kessler and Green fights bout 10 times each.

Round 3, or 4, Kessler lands a massive left hook on the temple. Mundine takes it well.

Go to round 8 of the Mundine Green, Mundine is show boating. And although the commentators didn't see it. The right Danny Landed was massive.

Kessler looked more injured against Calzaghe, than against Mundine. I don't buy that argument.

Also when Mundines up against a power puncher. He sits on the back foot more. And his defence is a lot tighter. Protecting his chin.

adamheight wrote:by the way, if this fight gets made will it be in australia or the US?

Not sure. I would think Australia.

we agree to disagree mate.that said perhaps i will try watch the fights again.while i dont think Mundine has a china chin i would not rate it anywhere above average and that concerns me. still sticking to my guns and feel no way Crazy should have done what he did to him. was puzzled at how it looked initially(ie gAME OVER-eyes rolling and a hhard fall) but then he did get up pretty quick and got up well. That Choc is the definition of inconsistency in sooooooo many ways.

JSA wrote:we agree to disagree mate.that said perhaps i will try watch the fights again.while i dont think Mundine has a china chin i would not rate it anywhere above average and that concerns me. still sticking to my guns and feel no way Crazy should have done what he did to him. was puzzled at how it looked initially(ie gAME OVER-eyes rolling and a hhard fall) but then he did get up pretty quick and got up well. That Choc is the definition of inconsistency in sooooooo many ways.

Yeh. I have no doubt if that was Kessler or Pavlik in that ring, they would have finished him, as soon as Choc got up.

But my logic is. The knock down was a lapse in concentration. And he can perform well on the big stage. Which as a Choc fan, im hoping and think he does/will.

id say mundine wins this and fairly easily , a bit like the 2nd soliman fight


on another note manfredo has fought at middle before i think and hes not a real big super middle so maybe it could be mundines 1st fight at middle.
or that could just be wishful thinking on my behalf

cace wrote:on another note manfredo has fought at middle before i think and hes not a real big super middle so maybe it could be mundines 1st fight at middle.
or that could just be wishful thinking on my behalf

Wishful thinking. Although I, and many others, believe Manfredo Jr should have little trouble making 160 lbs (maybe even 154 lbs), he has been quoted as saying that it's too hard (or words to that effect).

adamheight wrote:manfredo obviously isnt a world beater but hes certainly a step up for mundine, judgin by mundines last few fights.

i expect mundine to win this, i dont see a stoppage though as mundines power is vastly over rated...

Agree

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:

Marlin wrote:

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:[Only a few are. He belongs in the elite. He belongs in the US.

Yup, most truly elite boxers lose to Siaca, get dropped by Nishizawa and Kim and constantly fight the likes of Rico Chong Nee, Ruben Acosta and Pablo Daniel Zamora Nievas while passing up Title shots they think they might lose...

Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

Kim was his last fight and that is the fight he took instead of fighting Kessler for the Title... I would say that is pretty recent...

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:
Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

The logic was spot-on though, whether you want to read it or not.
Mundine is a terrible dodger. He also steps down to fight easy challengers when he should be stepping up. He fights Kessler, a world-rated opponent and follows it up with Rashid Matmula and Rico Chong Nee. Danny Green is followed up with Ruben Acosta. The fight against Pablo Nievas (if memory serves correctly) was held in Queensland because he couldn't get it approved in NSW - yes, it went the distance but no-one expected Nievas to go the distance or to even be able to put up a fight. This was the 2nd fight that Mundine couldn't get approved in NSW because his opponent was deemed to be too outclassed. (The first one was I believe Brad Mayo, but that one gets a pass because it was still early in his career and straight after a devasting KO loss to a power puncher in a world title fight). He's fought Sean Sullivan twice. His last couple of fights have been against a past-his-prime Nader Hamden, Sam Soliman - a good fighter, but fighting above his weight and Crazy Kim who was not supposed to last the distance either. Then dodged Kessler for their rematch. Skill has never been Mundine's problem, it has been the desire to challenge himself and try and create a worthy legacy by fighting contenders and world-class calibre opponents instead of padding his record against chumps. He will be remembered more for who he didn't fight then who he did. And while he's fought a handful of world-class boxers, he hasn't fought enough of them and the opportunities have been there for him to. Instead of fighting Hamden or Nievas he could have been getting fighters who were in the top 20 without too much hassle. He fought chumps in "world title defences" instead of fighting contenders, simply because he could get away with it and refused to fight a mandatory when finally forced to. He wants to be the best but doesn't have it in him to do what it takes.

Very well said

madball1982 wrote:

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:
Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

The logic was spot-on though, whether you want to read it or not.
Mundine is a terrible dodger. He also steps down to fight easy challengers when he should be stepping up. He fights Kessler, a world-rated opponent and follows it up with Rashid Matmula and Rico Chong Nee. Danny Green is followed up with Ruben Acosta. The fight against Pablo Nievas (if memory serves correctly) was held in Queensland because he couldn't get it approved in NSW - yes, it went the distance but no-one expected Nievas to go the distance or to even be able to put up a fight. This was the 2nd fight that Mundine couldn't get approved in NSW because his opponent was deemed to be too outclassed. (The first one was I believe Brad Mayo, but that one gets a pass because it was still early in his career and straight after a devasting KO loss to a power puncher in a world title fight). He's fought Sean Sullivan twice. His last couple of fights have been against a past-his-prime Nader Hamden, Sam Soliman - a good fighter, but fighting above his weight and Crazy Kim who was not supposed to last the distance either. Then dodged Kessler for their rematch. Skill has never been Mundine's problem, it has been the desire to challenge himself and try and create a worthy legacy by fighting contenders and world-class calibre opponents instead of padding his record against chumps. He will be remembered more for who he didn't fight then who he did. And while he's fought a handful of world-class boxers, he hasn't fought enough of them and the opportunities have been there for him to. Instead of fighting Hamden or Nievas he could have been getting fighters who were in the top 20 without too much hassle. He fought chumps in "world title defences" instead of fighting contenders, simply because he could get away with it and refused to fight a mandatory when finally forced to. He wants to be the best but doesn't have it in him to do what it takes.

totally agree mate

hvywt wrote:

madball1982 wrote:

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:
Thats the kind of logic i don't want to read. True boxing fans know that is not the Mundine that enters the ring now. Totally different fighter. With a high quality defence. Decent power, and blinding speed. As long as his chin holds up, he competes well with the best.

I have never understood Australian boxing fans. Most recognize Mundine is a fantastic fighter. The others continue to get dragged into Ottke, Siaca, Nishizawa discussion. When we all know, and the man himself knows, thats not half the fighter, who enters the ring today.

I will stick by my guns. A lot of talent is right in front of us!

The logic was spot-on though, whether you want to read it or not.
Mundine is a terrible dodger. He also steps down to fight easy challengers when he should be stepping up. He fights Kessler, a world-rated opponent and follows it up with Rashid Matmula and Rico Chong Nee. Danny Green is followed up with Ruben Acosta. The fight against Pablo Nievas (if memory serves correctly) was held in Queensland because he couldn't get it approved in NSW - yes, it went the distance but no-one expected Nievas to go the distance or to even be able to put up a fight. This was the 2nd fight that Mundine couldn't get approved in NSW because his opponent was deemed to be too outclassed. (The first one was I believe Brad Mayo, but that one gets a pass because it was still early in his career and straight after a devasting KO loss to a power puncher in a world title fight). He's fought Sean Sullivan twice. His last couple of fights have been against a past-his-prime Nader Hamden, Sam Soliman - a good fighter, but fighting above his weight and Crazy Kim who was not supposed to last the distance either. Then dodged Kessler for their rematch. Skill has never been Mundine's problem, it has been the desire to challenge himself and try and create a worthy legacy by fighting contenders and world-class calibre opponents instead of padding his record against chumps. He will be remembered more for who he didn't fight then who he did. And while he's fought a handful of world-class boxers, he hasn't fought enough of them and the opportunities have been there for him to. Instead of fighting Hamden or Nievas he could have been getting fighters who were in the top 20 without too much hassle. He fought chumps in "world title defences" instead of fighting contenders, simply because he could get away with it and refused to fight a mandatory when finally forced to. He wants to be the best but doesn't have it in him to do what it takes.

totally agree mate

here here

s

Both of these guys are going nowhere, mundne - talent no heart, Manfredo not much talent all heart, this is a nothing fight that does nthing for either man

ross

Ross wrote:Both of these guys are going nowhere, mundne - talent no heart, Manfredo not much talent all heart, this is a nothing fight that does nthing for either man

ross

Don't right choc off mate.

He could earn the same money fighting Shannon Taylor. Why is he fighting Manfredo?

he wants US recognition for a fight with Winky.

Maybe after the Green rematch.

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:

Ross wrote:Both of these guys are going nowhere, mundne - talent no heart, Manfredo not much talent all heart, this is a nothing fight that does nthing for either man

ross

Don't right choc off mate.

He could earn the same money fighting Shannon Taylor. Why is he fighting Manfredo?

he wants US recognition for a fight with Winky.

Maybe after the Green rematch.

Had lotsa hope in mundine, but sadly he has been a disappointment, and dont worry he will end up fighting Taylor soon enough.

ross

Ultimateboxa2 wrote:

Ross wrote:Both of these guys are going nowhere, mundne - talent no heart, Manfredo not much talent all heart, this is a nothing fight that does nthing for either man

ross

Don't right choc off mate.

He could earn the same money fighting Shannon Taylor. Why is he fighting Manfredo?

he wants US recognition for a fight with Winky.

Maybe after the Green rematch.

Choc has been written off because of the reasons that have previously been stated and for me because of my previous post.

He's fighting Manfredo because he figures it'll be an easy fight for him to win based probably on a jab-jab-back foot-counter-backfoot-jab-repeat-UD win fight plan.

He won't fight Winky at least for another 4-5yrs when he's gone past his prime and really shouldn't be fighting anymore. That's even if Winky accepts the fight.

He should fight Taylor. It's what the fans have come to expect.

But do you think the Americans want to fight him?

I mean he brings little $$$ what so ever.

He needs to fight Manfredo to increase value in his name.