BoxRec

Larrylefthook wrote:So Wlad isn't a top fighter? Who are the top fighters in the HW division?

Did I say that?? No, neither was I trying to imply it but it should be obvious that the lame style of Wlad which is to throw one shot and hug pales in comparison to the variety of punches and style that a fighter like Ortiz brings to the table. Wilder though amateurish at times is more dynamic in his volume and output of punches ahead of Klitschko.

Do I really have to spell it out how badly Wlad's style pales in comparison to the rest of the HWs who'd be far busier, throwing shots from different angles and moving in and out constantly, some of them will even move laterally but none of them simply throws one shot and then hug like boring @$$ Klitschko.

You have to see now why I made my comment in that way.

Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

Undefeated49-0 wrote:

Larrylefthook wrote:So Wlad isn't a top fighter? Who are the top fighters in the HW division?

Did I say that?? No, neither was I trying to imply it but it should be obvious that the lame style of Wlad which is to throw one shot and hug pales in comparison to the variety of punches and style that a fighter like Ortiz brings to the table. Wilder though amateurish at times is more dynamic in his volume and output of punches ahead of Klitschko.

Do I really have to spell it out how badly Wlad's style pales in comparison to the rest of the HWs who'd be far busier, throwing shots from different angles and moving in and out constantly, some of them will even move laterally but none of them simply throws one shot and then hug like boring @$$ Klitschko.

You have to see now why I made my comment in that way.

Wilder may throw more but he landed only 30% of his punches against a guy he had a massive reach and height advantage over, that's just embarrassing look at his punch stats in his last fight http://www.boxingnews24.com/2016/01/204236/. I prefer quality over quantity. His level of competition has been too low for an Olympic medallist with 36 fights and has made 3 defences of the WBC title, when he faces someone world class he will get exposed badly.

Larrylefthook wrote:Wilder may throw more but he landed only 30% of his punches against a guy he had a massive reach and height advantage over, that's just embarrassing look at his punch stats in his last fight http://www.boxingnews24.com/2016/01/204236/. I prefer quality over quantity. His level of competition has been too low for an Olympic medallist with 36 fights and has made 3 defences of the WBC title, when he faces someone world class he will get exposed badly.

I don't doubt anything you've stated here, I've said over and over that Wilder is not fundamentally sound enough imho to face a more skilled fighter like Ortiz. Go and read my posts on Wilder in other threads related about him and you'll see I'm probably his biggest critic on this forum.

Breland needs to teach him so many other things but despite that and his poor stats it's still better than watching boring Wlad throw one shot and hug his opponents into oblivion.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

...well, we don't know it...what we know though is that he dominated the HW division for a long time..everything else is a matter of personal like and dislikes...

greg wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

...well, we don't know it...what we know though is that he dominated the HW division for a long time..everything else is a matter of personal like and dislikes...

Well, that's what p4p lists are. He was clearly the best heavyweight for a decade and he had a decided size advantage in most every fight.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

greg wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

...well, we don't know it...what we know though is that he dominated the HW division for a long time..everything else is a matter of personal like and dislikes...

Well, that's what p4p lists are. He was clearly the best heavyweight for a decade and he had a decided size advantage in most every fight.

Very much unlike John Ruiz. Wlad dominated the HW division for 11 years and 23 fights. And Ruiz?

If you bring up the Ruiz-Holyfield trilogy, that trilogy makes Fury-Wlad look like the Thrilla In Manila.

By your "logic," Danny Williams and Kevin McBride are ATGs because they beat Mike Tyson.

BAD INTENTIONS wrote:I don't get the appeal of heavyweights.

the top ten heavies beat every fighter below
cruiser without it being even a contest. that's
the appeal. in the end it as a combat sport
and there is only one pinnacle.

greg wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

...well, we don't know it...

i think we do know.

man wrote:

greg wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Wlad never belonged on any p4p list. Size was his biggest attribute. Size being equal, he'd lose to hundreds of guys.

...well, we don't know it...

i think we do know.

...we assume we know, but then again, your assumption is as good as mine...

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

greg wrote: ...well, we don't know it...what we know though is that he dominated the HW division for a long time..everything else is a matter of personal like and dislikes...

Well, that's what p4p lists are. He was clearly the best heavyweight for a decade and he had a decided size advantage in most every fight.

Very much unlike John Ruiz. Wlad dominated the HE division for 11 years and 23 fights. And Ruiz?

If you bring up the Ruiz-Holyfield trilogy, that trilogy makes Fury-Wlad look like the Thrilla In Manila.

By your "logic," Danny Williams and Kevin McBride are ATGs because they beat Mike Tyson.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Well, that's what p4p lists are. He was clearly the best heavyweight for a decade and he had a decided size advantage in most every fight.

Very much unlike John Ruiz. Wlad dominated the HE division for 11 years and 23 fights. And Ruiz?

If you bring up the Ruiz-Holyfield trilogy, that trilogy makes Fury-Wlad look like the Thrilla In Manila.

By your "logic," Danny Williams and Kevin McBride are ATGs because they beat Mike Tyson.

That's my exact response to EVERY John Ruiz fight. In a Wlad or Wilder fight, the opponent can become unconconscious at any second. The only people in danger of lapsing into unconsciousness in a Ruiz fight are the fans, not the opponent.

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Tony1244 wrote:

Very much unlike John Ruiz. Wlad dominated the HE division for 11 years and 23 fights. And Ruiz?

If you bring up the Ruiz-Holyfield trilogy, that trilogy makes Fury-Wlad look like the Thrilla In Manila.

By your "logic," Danny Williams and Kevin McBride are ATGs because they beat Mike Tyson.

That's my exact response to EVERY John Ruiz fight. In a Wlad or Wilder fight, the opponent can become unconconscious at any second. The only people in danger of lapsing into unconsciousness in a Ruiz fight are the fans, not the opponent.

he was certainly boring. Not quite as bad as reading your nonstop posts of no significance to the topic at hand or the posts you quote, but close.

greg wrote:... your assumption is as good as mine...

no. it's not.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

That's my exact response to EVERY John Ruiz fight. In a Wlad or Wilder fight, the opponent can become unconconscious at any second. The only people in danger of lapsing into unconsciousness in a Ruiz fight are the fans, not the opponent.

he was certainly boring. Not quite as bad as reading your nonstop posts of no significance to the topic at hand or the posts you quote, but close.

Well at least we agree 50%, which is progress for us.

Ruiz was quite boring, but I credit him for doing what he did with his lack of speed and power. If he had even attempted to avenge his defeat to Tua, my respect for him would have tripled.

Nothing to disagree on. Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali. I think vitali would beat him too, I don't rate anyone on fights that never happened.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Nothing to disagree on. Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali. I think vitali would beat him too, I don't rate anyone on fights that never happened.

I have no ax to grind with you being a Ruiz fan.
Do a poll, if you'd like, on who is more accomplished Vit or John Ruiz.
You couldn't find 1 real boxing expert in 100, who would say Ruiz is more accomplished.

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Nothing to disagree on. Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali. I think vitali would beat him too, I don't rate anyone on fights that never happened.

I have no ax to grind with you being a Ruiz fan.
Do a poll, if you'd like, on who is more accomplished Vit or John Ruiz.
You couldn't find 1 real boxing expert in 100, who would say Ruiz is more accomplished.

A poll? On boxrec forum? Where the experts reside? If it is so important to you, why not tell me why its wrong instead of constantly fabricating bs? What is so super fabulous about your beloved vitalis resume? While you mock John beating an old evander, your belived vitali made his name on getting his ass whipped by an old Lewis. Shit, Ruiz beat the guy that vitali ran from.

man wrote:

BAD INTENTIONS wrote:I don't get the appeal of heavyweights.

the top ten heavies beat every fighter below
cruiser without it being even a contest. that's
the appeal. in the end it as a combat sport
and there is only one pinnacle.

Didn't a light heavyweight once beat a heavyweight champion and rap about it?

Guess that debunks your little theory.

PS - The 175 Bernard Hopkins in like 2008/2009 beats Tyson Fury 12-0. Tyson would NEVER get an opportunity to land any SIGNIFICANT punch throughout the ENTIRE fight ... and I do mean that literally.

- Super Joe exposed Popkins as a bawling crybaby in 08 and his tears have cascaded ever since.

Now I understand that sissies prefer bawlers like TUE and Poppy whereas most all the most revered boxers were fighters with real power. Otherwise prime Ironboy Calderon could whip both on the same night with nary a fight in sight.

Keep it real or keep it on your little boxing playstations 8)

BAD INTENTIONS wrote:Didn't a light heavyweight once beat a heavyweight champion and rap about it?

Guess that debunks your little theory.

sure. whatever you say, genius.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Tony1244 wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Nothing to disagree on. Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali. I think vitali would beat him too, I don't rate anyone on fights that never happened.

I have no ax to grind with you being a Ruiz fan.
Do a poll, if you'd like, on who is more accomplished Vit or John Ruiz.
You couldn't find 1 real boxing expert in 100, who would say Ruiz is more accomplished.

A poll? On boxrec forum? Where the experts reside? If it is so important to you, why not tell me why its wrong instead of constantly fabricating bs? What is so super fabulous about your beloved vitalis resume? While you mock John beating an old evander, your belived vitali made his name on getting his ass whipped by an old Lewis. poo, Ruiz beat the guy that vitali ran from.

I already told you "why its wrong," scroll up. I'm not even a fan of Vit's, I'm just being realistic. IF you know anything about HW boxing, you're kidding about Ruiz's superior resume.

"The 175 Bernard Hopkins in like 2008/2009 beats Tyson Fury 12-0"
- that is plain retarded
"Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali"
- bold and dumb (unless accomplishment accounts to loosing a HW title to the MW)
"Wlad's boring ass won it and then went into hiding"; "The capital city of boxing is Las Vegas"
- ignorant
"the top ten heavies beat every fighter below cruiser without it being even a contest"
- simply a lie

This constant profanation and agressive mediocrity is unbearable. Well, I guess its good riddance to me

Leonid wrote:"The 175 Bernard Hopkins in like 2008/2009 beats Tyson Fury 12-0"
- that is plain retarded
"Ruiz is more accomplished than vitali"
- bold and dumb (unless accomplishment accounts to loosing a HW title to the MW)
"Wlad's boring ass won it and then went into hiding"; "The capital city of boxing is Las Vegas"
- ignorant
"the top ten heavies beat every fighter below cruiser without it being even a contest"
- simply a lie

This constant profanation and agressive mediocrity is unbearable. Well, I guess its good riddance to me

The first 3 are patently ridiculous and known to be nonsense to anyone with even a high 2-digit boxing IQ.

The last one I have to agree with. Size does matter to a huge extent. Now the ranked #100 HW couldn't beat GGG, but everyone in the top 10 HWs could.