BoxRec

punchoutsb wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

crow wrote:

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php?title=Fight:2098240

Boxrec has spoken.

Don't shoot the messenger.

What on earth are you talking about? Larger sample sizes more accurately reflect the perceptions of the population.

86 > 60

That depends on where the samples are gathered. Over-representation of a group or area can skew results.

So you're undermining the intellectual value of the media scores that you originally cited, because sample data can be flawed... or will you instead insist on being hypocritical?

You simply can't have it both ways, just because the obvious conclusions drawn from a larger sample of media scores doesn't adhere to your preferred perception of reality.

Enlightened-One wrote:

punchoutsb wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: What on earth are you talking about? Larger sample sizes more accurately reflect the perceptions of the population.

86 > 60

That depends on where the samples are gathered. Over-representation of a group or area can skew results.

So you're undermining the intellectual value of the media scores that you originally cited, because sample data can be flawed... or will you instead insist on being hypocritical?

You simply can't have it both ways, just because the obvious conclusions drawn from a larger sample of media scores doesn't adhere to your preferred perception of reality.

I didn't cite anything, I'm just stating that greater population =/= more accurate results. There are a variety of factors that can influence this.

punchoutsb wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

punchoutsb wrote:
That depends on where the samples are gathered. Over-representation of a group or area can skew results.

So you're undermining the intellectual value of the media scores that you originally cited, because sample data can be flawed... or will you instead insist on being hypocritical?

You simply can't have it both ways, just because the obvious conclusions drawn from a larger sample of media scores doesn't adhere to your preferred perception of reality.

I didn't cite anything, I'm just stating that greater population =/= more accurate results. There are a variety of factors that can influence this.

Sorry, I mistook you for Crow. However, in the context of the media scores for the Kovalev-Ward fight, I respectfully disagree with your point.

keithmoonhangover wrote:You can always rely on Kathy for a unbiased take on the situation.

Here's the thing..... Punch stats reveal that Ward was the more accurate puncher in 11 of the 12 rounds, which also translates to him being the better defensive boxer in all but the round he was knocked down in. Ward won the fight fare and square.

You're an idiot... Clean, effective punching is the primary criteria... Kovalev landed more, harder, and more effective punches... He took more chances and landed more shots, which means he's going to miss more. That's what effective aggression is all about. If you throw more and land fewer you aggression doesn't mean anything because it's not effective. This is not baseball where you strike out if you miss 3 swings, but you have to land more or else you lose the round.. Kovalev won 9 of the 12 rounds and scored the knockdown.. It wasn't a flash knockdown like Mayweather-Judah. It was solid.

I knew a robbery was coming when I read all 3 judges and the referee named by the commission were Americans... I never thought Kovalev was safe at any time... I thought he needed 2 knockdowns and 10 rounds in the bank.

Tanzio wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:

Tanzio wrote: Back to the same old tired sh!t, eh Caldo? Immediately leap to calling a professional fighter, who actually gets into the ring with fighters like Krusher, a punk and make grandiose Nostradumbass predictions that you will never acknowledge were crap when they turn out to be, well, crap.

If Ward retires for real more power to him. He has a beautiful family and he is skilled and gifted in more than just professional boxing. If he does return in short order and it was all a charade I will eviscerate him for it.

If he retires for good, or actually chooses to give Krusher his rematch, will you admit that you are just another Nostradumbass?

Again Tanzio, you've got me confused with someone who can't admit when he's wrong. I can make you late for work reading my list of Nostradumbass opinions i've had. But this one, i'll take the Pepsi Challenge on this one any day of the week. So here's my proposition for you, Tanzio. Gentleman's bet here. I bet you that Andre Ward will get in the ring again eventually but it won't be against Kovalev. Ward will find a way to avoid it completely in Andre Ward fashion.

You certainly give a lot of love to a guy that doesn't have the integrity to honor contracts but fully expects the other party to. That's the definition of a scumbag where i come from. I couldn't give a shat about his family...everyone has a family, that's no big accomplishment. My buddy D has a family and he can barely spell his name.

No, in the world of MEN...you are measured on integrity and Andre Ward has proven on many occasions that he has no concept of it. It's this typical American Boxer mentality nowadays of entitlement and do as i say not as I do. The fact that it doesn't bother you says a lot about your character actually. Sorry, truth.

I was among Ward's biggest and most consistent critics for years. I have no problem criticizing him again when it is warranted. Nothing that he has done so far warrants it.

Contract law is settled in court. I have relatively deep experience in contract law and the gray areas that can be and are found in agreements. I have battled three contract cases in court in 2016 and executed a restraining order against a managing partner who according to contract would be the operator of one of my companies when / if he is released from jail for destruction of property (the company's). I am preparing the case to remove him from his position and his interest in the company.

You have no fvcking clue what the details of the contract disputes that Ward fought in court are, do you?

Making a family is easy. Taking full responsibility for your family and raising your children to be productive members of society is not as easy. Ward has options. He can retire and pursue his side job as a commentator. He could start other businesses.

Ward is simply negotiating his way through life. Let's see where his negotiating takes him before we condemn him for it.

Honestly Tanzio, if I had to listen to your silly opinion day in and day out, i'd also start bashing stuff and defacing property. i'm being humorous as that does sound like a stressful situation and a real life problem instead what we do here to kill time with our coffee in the morning.

Wards contract issues are the same issues that Mikey Garcia had with TR. These guys ended up signing contracts that were great at the time and put money in their pockets but once they made comfortable coin, they decided they didn't like the contract anymore. It's the same principle going on here with the rematch clause. It got Kovalev inside the ring and now it's Andre Ward's world where he's bigger than any contract. Same exact thing.

Look at the responses in here bubba. You are in the minority when it comes Ward and the ramifications of this pending rematch clause. Wards legacy is entirely on the line here with this decision. He may say it means nothing to him but we all know that's not true. If Ward fails to give Kovalev this rematch then no one will be happier than Canelo because they'll be a new pussy in town and we can forget about old red for awhile.

Ward's unhappiness with his contract was caused by his desire to be getting more than he was actually earning with his boring performances. He thought that if he is next to Mayweather in the p4p list, then his paychecks should also be second best. He needed a charity promoter who would add money out of his own pocket like Jay Z does.

Enlightened-One wrote:

punchoutsb wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: So you're undermining the intellectual value of the media scores that you originally cited, because sample data can be flawed... or will you instead insist on being hypocritical?

You simply can't have it both ways, just because the obvious conclusions drawn from a larger sample of media scores doesn't adhere to your preferred perception of reality.

I didn't cite anything, I'm just stating that greater population =/= more accurate results. There are a variety of factors that can influence this.

Sorry, I mistook you for Crow. However, in the context of the media scores for the Kovalev-Ward fight, I respectfully disagree with your point.

Nothing to disagree with really. It is easy to manipulate statistics by including a higher percentage from certain demographics or organizations. That's a fact.

More than half of Americans think Kovalev won... I wonder what % of Russians thought Ward won.

If the fight were held in Moscow with 3 Russian judges and a Russian referee, do you think it would be a 1-point score??? or more like 118-109 Kovalev?

crow wrote:

SFW wrote:I went back and watched that 12th round. No idea how anyone could possibly score that for Ward.

Fixed.

13 total punches landed to Ward's 12.

Kovalev visibly hurt Ward in that rd.

Kovalev was not landing cleanly if not flat out missing. That's bullshit, more proof people counted what they wanted to see instead of what happened. And I thought Kovalev won by 2-3 points overall

SFW wrote:

crow wrote:

SFW wrote:I went back and watched that 12th round. No idea how anyone could possibly score that for Ward.

Fixed.

13 total punches landed to Ward's 12.

Kovalev visibly hurt Ward in that rd.

Kovalev was not landing cleanly if not flat out missing. That's bullshit, more proof people counted what they wanted to see instead of what happened. And I thought Kovalev won by 2-3 points overall

Even the HBO crew acknowledged Kovalev hurt Ward with body shots in that 12 rd, and had him backing up.

How is that not landing clean?

He landed more than Ward in that last rd.

We can all argue about the scorecards until we are blue in the face but let's face facts here can we? In this fight, considering location and Wards reputation, the judges were going to score this one the following way:

Kovalev needed to CLEARLY win a round to get the judges to give it to him.
Ward was going to win all of the close rounds that Kovalev didn't blatantly win.

This is what happened and we've seen it happen this way forever. The whole "you have to BEAT the champion to defeat the champion" BS was ever present in this one. Even though, Kovalev was champ, Ward carried that right into the ring that night for some reason. Judges were not going to blemish Ward's record and image in a close fight.

Kovalev won this fight but he didn't win by ENOUGH to justify the blemish to Wards record. That's the sad truth

The insanity of referencing what the hbo puppets said highlights how off you and they were. Try watching again without outside influence. Ward was backing up a lot, whilst being effective. He wasn't always forced backward he kept moving to keep Sergei on the move as well, which obviously worked. To what extent is debatable, but definitely had an effect. Fact is Sergei hardly landed clean at all that round, bogus compusux numbers are irrelevant.

crow wrote:No comment needed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDh3uFC5dfU

And yes Kath you was a big part in it you took the deal you knew who the judge's were when all the negotiation's were taking place bad management stop blaming the world its your fault

caldo2025 wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
Again Tanzio, you've got me confused with someone who can't admit when he's wrong. I can make you late for work reading my list of Nostradumbass opinions i've had. But this one, i'll take the Pepsi Challenge on this one any day of the week. So here's my proposition for you, Tanzio. Gentleman's bet here. I bet you that Andre Ward will get in the ring again eventually but it won't be against Kovalev. Ward will find a way to avoid it completely in Andre Ward fashion.

You certainly give a lot of love to a guy that doesn't have the integrity to honor contracts but fully expects the other party to. That's the definition of a scumbag where i come from. I couldn't give a shat about his family...everyone has a family, that's no big accomplishment. My buddy D has a family and he can barely spell his name.

No, in the world of MEN...you are measured on integrity and Andre Ward has proven on many occasions that he has no concept of it. It's this typical American Boxer mentality nowadays of entitlement and do as i say not as I do. The fact that it doesn't bother you says a lot about your character actually. Sorry, truth.

I was among Ward's biggest and most consistent critics for years. I have no problem criticizing him again when it is warranted. Nothing that he has done so far warrants it.

Contract law is settled in court. I have relatively deep experience in contract law and the gray areas that can be and are found in agreements. I have battled three contract cases in court in 2016 and executed a restraining order against a managing partner who according to contract would be the operator of one of my companies when / if he is released from jail for destruction of property (the company's). I am preparing the case to remove him from his position and his interest in the company.

You have no fvcking clue what the details of the contract disputes that Ward fought in court are, do you?

Making a family is easy. Taking full responsibility for your family and raising your children to be productive members of society is not as easy. Ward has options. He can retire and pursue his side job as a commentator. He could start other businesses.

Ward is simply negotiating his way through life. Let's see where his negotiating takes him before we condemn him for it.

Honestly Tanzio, if I had to listen to your silly opinion day in and day out, i'd also start bashing stuff and defacing property. i'm being humorous as that does sound like a stressful situation and a real life problem instead what we do here to kill time with our coffee in the morning.

Wards contract issues are the same issues that Mikey Garcia had with TR. These guys ended up signing contracts that were great at the time and put money in their pockets but once they made comfortable coin, they decided they didn't like the contract anymore. It's the same principle going on here with the rematch clause. It got Kovalev inside the ring and now it's Andre Ward's world where he's bigger than any contract. Same exact thing.

Look at the responses in here bubba. You are in the minority when it comes Ward and the ramifications of this pending rematch clause. Wards legacy is entirely on the line here with this decision. He may say it means nothing to him but we all know that's not true. If Ward fails to give Kovalev this rematch then no one will be happier than Canelo because they'll be a new pussy in town and we can forget about old red for awhile.

I am obviously comfortable being in the minority

caldo2025 wrote:
Honestly Tanzio, if I had to listen to your silly opinion..

Y u don't call him by his real name ?

@TANZIDIOT

crow wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:
Honestly Tanzio, if I had to listen to your silly opinion..

Y u don't call him by his real name ?

@TANZIDIOT

Keep on cawing, croward

SFW wrote:The insanity of referencing what the hbo puppets said highlights how off you and they were. Try watching again without outside influence. Ward was backing up a lot, whilst being effective. He wasn't always forced backward he kept moving to keep Sergei on the move as well, which obviously worked. To what extent is debatable, but definitely had an effect. Fact is Sergei hardly landed clean at all that round, bogus compusux numbers are irrelevant.

Seriously??? What were you watching? What about all those jabs shaking Ward? They were not clean enough for you? Best of Kovalev's jabs were shaking Ward better than any of Ward's slaps ever affected him.