BoxRec

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:07**

ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:30
gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:22 The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.
I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......

Haye and Fury are now twitters and not fighters until proven otherwise.

The division would suck less if they fought more.

I'd say:

1st rung are Joshua, Wilder, Ortiz, Povetkin

2nd ring: Parker, Ruiz, Takam, Whyte, Pulev, Miller

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:08**

I'm sure he'll face Fury at some point. Too much money for it not to happen, and when he does you'll all see what happens to Fury when he's a Heavyweight Championship FIGHT and not a Heavyweight Championship Staring Contest.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:11**

Tony1244 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:07
ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:30
gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:22 The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.
I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......
Haye and Fury are now twitters and not fighters until proven otherwise.

The division would suck less if they fought more.

I'd say:

1st rung are Joshua, Wilder, Ortiz, Povetkin

2nd ring: Parker, Ruiz, Takam, Whyte, Pulev, Miller

Tony, I wrote : Haye (fit) and Fury (fit). I can imagine both of them to be fit by the end of the year.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:14**

Haye's finished dude I'm telling ya. Even if he beats Bellew in their rematch that's gonna be it for him. He'll never win another meaningful fight. That doesn't necessarily mean he won't participate in one, but he won't win another one. I could see them feeding him to AJ if he beats Bellew because that was probably the plan the first time he fought Bellew.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:17**

gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:08 I'm sure he'll face Fury at some point. Too much money for it not to happen, and when he does you'll all see what happens to Fury when he's a Heavyweight Championship FIGHT and not a Heavyweight Championship Staring Contest.

TF might be a "half-crazy" guy, but he already has been faced (and defeated) the best HW after Lennox Lewis retirement.
It is a fact, and noone can change this........................

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:18**

Rooting for Wilder or Ortiz? Probably Wilder. He seems a little annoying, but his power always makes it interesting. He seems to have a lot of detractors due to his record, I can understand that to a certain degree -- inasmuch as wanting to see him step up. Wanting to see him get beaten because of it is a bit much, to me at least anyways.
The prospect of AJ against Wilder is far more interesting to me than AJ Vs Ortiz.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:19**

gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:14 Haye's finished dude I'm telling ya. Even if he beats Bellew in their rematch that's gonna be it for him. He'll never win another meaningful fight. That doesn't necessarily mean he won't participate in one, but he won't win another one. I could see them feeding him to AJ if he beats Bellew because that was probably the plan the first time he fought Bellew.

If he is healthy, he will KO Bellew early. I don't expect him to defeat Joshua, of course.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:20**

ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:17
gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:08 I'm sure he'll face Fury at some point. Too much money for it not to happen, and when he does you'll all see what happens to Fury when he's a Heavyweight Championship FIGHT and not a Heavyweight Championship Staring Contest.
TF might be a "half-crazy" guy, but he already has been faced (and defeated) the best HW after Lennox Lewis retirement.
It is a fact, and noone can change this........................

No one can change the result indeed, and no one can change the fact that it was one of the worst fights of all time that lowered both fighters.

Why it has elevated Fury in anybody's eyes will always be a mystery to me. I came out of that fight thinking a whole lot less of both he and Klitschko. Klitschko gained a measure of his dignity back with his brave stand against Joshua. I don't suspect Fury ever will.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:24**

ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:11
Tony1244 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:07
ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:30

I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......
Haye and Fury are now twitters and not fighters until proven otherwise.

The division would suck less if they fought more.

I'd say:

1st rung are Joshua, Wilder, Ortiz, Povetkin

2nd ring: Parker, Ruiz, Takam, Whyte, Pulev, Miller
Tony, I wrote : Haye (fit) and Fury (fit). I can imagine both of them to be fit by the end of the year.

Yeah, I know where you are going with it, but considering recent history, I'll stick with my until proven otherwise....

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:28**

I would say Haye is almost certainly finished as a formidable force even if he beats Bellew.

If I had to bet, I'd bet against Fury, but stranger things have happened like the Foreman comeback. I think Foreman was sober all those years, which is gonna help. If Fury is sober and serious, he does have a shot, but wake me up when he steps into the ring.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:30**

Tony1244 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:28 I would say Haye is almost certainly finished as a formidable force even if he beats Bellew.

If I had to bet, I'd bet against Fury, but stranger things have happened like the Foreman comeback. I think Foreman was sober all those years, which is gonna help. If Fury is sober and serious, he does have a shot, but wake me up when he steps into the ring.

Foreman was one of the bigger punchers of all time. Fury has very mediocre punching power when you consider his size. If not for his size he'd have almost none.

Considering that Fury's style is reliant on him being able to use his legs, and outbox his opponent I think the drug use and excessive weight gain will hinder his future chances at success in a Boxing ring greatly.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:55**

siablo14 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:05
asdfjkl wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:38
siablo14 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 14:31
Ray had the reach and height advantage and used it until he was KO. That's the same strategy Wilder use to win the first fight.
Have you seen the "KO"? Ray was standing still with his hands up to the referee
I can't remember it but it looked within the rules. What's your take on it?

It made me laugh, especially since Ray Austin was ahead on points, it was a bit like AJ Takam, imagine Takam being ahead on points at that moment. Well, Austin was actually on the ground at some point, but I think I would have let them fight on.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 15:58**

gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:30
Tony1244 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:28 I would say Haye is almost certainly finished as a formidable force even if he beats Bellew.

If I had to bet, I'd bet against Fury, but stranger things have happened like the Foreman comeback. I think Foreman was sober all those years, which is gonna help. If Fury is sober and serious, he does have a shot, but wake me up when he steps into the ring.
Foreman was one of the bigger punchers of all time. Fury has very mediocre punching power when you consider his size. If not for his size he'd have almost none.

Considering that Fury's style is reliant on him being able to use his legs, and outbox his opponent I think the drug use and excessive weight gain will hinder his future chances at success in a Boxing ring greatly.

Fury would have to want it "Like a hog wants slop," as Joe Frazier use to say.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 16:09**

I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 21:15**

ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 16:09 I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.

You mean Wilder who get's busted by the police with his car full of drugs, but for some odd reason never gets caught by his personal lab?

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 22:33**

asdfjkl wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 21:15
ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 16:09 I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.
You mean Wilder who get's busted by the police with his car full of drugs, but for some odd reason never gets caught by his personal lab?

I don't care if people use recreational drugs. I do care if they use PEDs. According to the article I read, Wilder's "car full of drugs" was in fact "a small amount of marijuana", whereas Ortiz has been found to be using drugs that can be used as masking agents for performance enhancers. So yeah, I'll root for Wilder.

Posted: **10 Feb 2018, 23:04**

asdfjkl wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 21:15
ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 16:09 I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.
You mean Wilder who get's busted by the police with his car full of drugs, but for some odd reason never gets caught by his personal lab?

Yes asdjfkl, there you go again, as El Jefe pointed out.

Wilder's car "full of drugs" as you claim? Hardly.

Reports describe the amount of marijuana found in the vehicle as either "small or 'minimal "

It was found laying on the console. It wasn't as if it was packaged in kilos and ready for distribution as you would want us to believe.

Wilder was recently sentenced to 60 hours of community service. And some probation. Nothing more.

If the car had been "full of drugs" then he'd be doing prison time, not community service.

As it is, there are many state's with much more liberal laws than Alabama that wouldn't bothered with the case.

There wasn't much there at all.

And whatever anount was in that car must have been a hellava lot less than what you've been smoking lately.

How else do you explain you're ongoing hallucination about Shannon Briggs being the most feared and avoided man in the heavyweight division?

Cheech and Chong had nothing on you.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 00:07**

SenorPipino wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 23:04
asdfjkl wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 21:15
ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 16:09 I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.
You mean Wilder who get's busted by the police with his car full of drugs, but for some odd reason never gets caught by his personal lab?
Yes asdjfkl, there you go again, as El Jefe pointed out.

Wilder's car "full of drugs" as you claim? Hardly.

Reports describe the amount of marijuana found in the vehicle as either "small or 'minimal "

It was found laying on the console. It wasn't as if it was packaged in kilos and ready for distribution as you would want us to believe.

Wilder was recently sentenced to 60 hours of community service. And some probation. Nothing more.

If the car had been "full of drugs" then he'd be doing prison time, not community service.

As it is, there are many state's with much more liberal laws than Alabama that wouldn't bothered with the case.

There wasn't much there at all.

And whatever anount was in that car must have been a hellava lot less than what you've been smoking lately.

How else do you explain you're ongoing hallucination about Shannon Briggs being the most feared and avoided man in the heavyweight division?

Cheech and Chong had nothing on you.

Dude. I gave up arguing with assfuckt
He's the biggest troll on Boxrec. Admin won't do anything with him.
So just ignore him. He's a joke and not worth your time

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 00:10**

Wilder! I'm a fan! He's a big personality! Deserves more credit than he gets IMO.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 02:10**

ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 22:33
asdfjkl wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 21:15
ElJefe wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 16:09 I don't really like Wilder but I dislike drug cheats more, so I'll be rooting for the wild, technically poor but huge punching Yank in this one.
You mean Wilder who get's busted by the police with his car full of drugs, but for some odd reason never gets caught by his personal lab?
I don't care if people use recreational drugs. I do care if they use PEDs. According to the article I read, Wilder's "car full of drugs" was in fact "a small amount of marijuana", whereas Ortiz has been found to be using drugs that can be used as masking agents for performance enhancers. So yeah, I'll root for Wilder.

Lol, even water can be used as a masking agent, even time can be used as a masking agent, it's just silly to avoid a fight because of such things and blackmail him on top of all that. Sad thing is, such a thing will happen again, because we all know Wilder will never get in the ring with anyone reasonable.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 09:46**

caldo2025 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 09:11 I personally think that Ortiz is going to sleep in this one and then cover your eyes and ears for the next year because Wilder is just going to be unbearable. We've seen how Wilder gets after knocking out taxi drivers. Imagine a KO over a quality boxer? Annoying. But I sure would like to see Ortiz win this one and bring Wilder down a peg. A Wilder loss would be the best thing to happen to the division and probably his career. Then we'd probably see more risk inside the division with matchups.

Oh sh1t you're right Caldo. There you have it Snr Pip when you ask what's not to like? It's the huge ego, the bragging, the hysteria. At least if he's beaten Ortiz there will be an element of substance to his boasting.

@Siablo14: I think the Omar shooting was equally David Simon's perverse sense of humour and his horror that his creation was moving toward the great hollywood cliche ending, with a shoot-out between the wronged hero and the boss-baddie. Simon hates to be predictable and the shooting by an insignificant child-nobody made it more true to life, more unexpected, more ironic and appealing to his idea of funny. Sorry to non-"Wire" lovers for straying off-topic.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 10:24**

gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:20
ValMar wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:17
gilgamesh wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 15:08 I'm sure he'll face Fury at some point. Too much money for it not to happen, and when he does you'll all see what happens to Fury when he's a Heavyweight Championship FIGHT and not a Heavyweight Championship Staring Contest.
TF might be a "half-crazy" guy, but he already has been faced (and defeated) the best HW after Lennox Lewis retirement.
It is a fact, and noone can change this........................
No one can change the result indeed, and no one can change the fact that it was one of the worst fights of all time that lowered both fighters.

Why it has elevated Fury in anybody's eyes will always be a mystery to me. I came out of that fight thinking a whole lot less of both he and Klitschko. Klitschko gained a measure of his dignity back with his brave stand against Joshua. I don't suspect Fury ever will.

X2 Well said Gil.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 12:17**

ValMar wrote: ↑08 Feb 2018, 15:41Who ? Why ?

Ortiz just because Wilder waited for him to be near 40. This fight could have happened three years ago. Wilder usually fights easy men only for title shots.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 18:30**

candyslim wrote: ↑11 Feb 2018, 09:46
caldo2025 wrote: ↑10 Feb 2018, 09:11 I personally think that Ortiz is going to sleep in this one and then cover your eyes and ears for the next year because Wilder is just going to be unbearable. We've seen how Wilder gets after knocking out taxi drivers. Imagine a KO over a quality boxer? Annoying. But I sure would like to see Ortiz win this one and bring Wilder down a peg. A Wilder loss would be the best thing to happen to the division and probably his career. Then we'd probably see more risk inside the division with matchups.
Oh sh1t you're right Caldo. There you have it Snr Pip when you ask what's not to like? It's the huge ego, the bragging, the hysteria. At least if he's beaten Ortiz there will be an element of substance to his boasting.

The "huge ego, the bragging, the hysteria."

Wow. That sounds exactly like another fighter who went on to have a pretty decent heavyweight career, although he was routinely dismissed and derided as an untalented blowhard during his early years.

You know who he is---that guy from Louisville, KY. Went by the name of Muhammad Ali. Wilder's hero, BTW.

Those traits you cite are actually part of the reason I'm enamored with the Bronze Bomber. PERSONALITY. I like my fighters to have some color, some flavor. No dull vanilla for me.

You also know that Ali eventually morphed from a "despised plague on the sport" to one of the most beloved icons in history.

Give Wilder a chance, CandyS. I guarantee that he'll grow on you.

Posted: **11 Feb 2018, 18:35**

i like wilders personality. hes a funny guy with energy. and fun to watch in the ring with amazing ko power. i dont get all the hate.

not his fault pedvetkin and ortiz tested positive and even without them hes still easily got a top record in the division. of course ortiz was hyped up as a boogeyman and now look at ppl turning on him so they can still not give wilder credit.

ppl build these guys up and then when the time comes for wilder to knock them down suddenly there no good

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