BoxRec

Here is mine...

1, Fury
2, AJ
3, Whyte
4, Wilder
5, Ruiz
6, Parker
7, Pulev
8, Povetkin
9, Hunter
10, Ortiz
11, Usyk
12. Chisora
13. Rivas
14. Helenius
15. Martin

Damn making the 10-15 part of the list is hard. Not much between the guys. Drop on quality there.

Yeah that Usyk's a bit sh1t isn't he?

candyslim wrote: ↑11 Mar 2020, 03:34 Yeah that Usyk's a bit sh1t isn't he?

Hard to rank currently. With only 1 fight in HW and that was against really weak opponent. I just can't put him in the top 10 yet.

I am expecting him to jump near the top soon tho.

Agreed.

Heretic wrote: ↑11 Mar 2020, 03:12 Thanks for compiling the list.

I was thinking of doing one vote list my self. Just didn't have time to do it.

If someone would take up the job that Dac(don't remember the rest of the name) and I think it was jezzamundo before him did I would be really happy to vote on it.

One easier way to do it would be to just have vote once every month. Lot less of hassle than running the proper one with votes after each fight.

It would be worse ranking but still something.

It was Dagilechia, who used to do it. He had flags and everything! He must have spent some time formatting it all.
Though maybe saving a template in a word file would make things easier.

I reckon doing it after any fight that involve top-30 boxrec fighters would be more fun, than redoing the full list at the end of each month.

The trouble is keeping a top the scheduled fights.

Anyway I'm in Japan, and just got an email that my university will be closed until April 20th at the earliest due to the Corona virus, so perhaps I'll have time after all.

Here are the official HeavyHitters heavyweight rankings:

1. Tyson Fury
2. Antony Joshua
3. Deontay Wilder
4. Dillian Whyte
5. Alexander Povetkin
6. Joseph Parker
7. Luis Ortiz
8. Andy Ruiz
9. Kubrat Pulev
10. Daniel Dubois
11. Joe Joyce
12. Oleksandr Usyk
13. Michael Hunter
14. Charles Martin
15. Robert Helenius

I do believe Wilder has a great chance of redeeming himself in the 3rd fight against Fury. To me, something didn't seem quite right for Deontay that night. I think he will have a deep burning desire to prove to everyone that he had an off night, and that coupled with Fury getting a little softer after his victory, will translate into a Wilder victory, and once again vault himself to the top of the heavyweight heap.

We all know something was off, his ringwalk outfit was too heavy, remember, that's what he says and no reason not to believe him, as long as he changes that he'll win

Bloody politicians. You can never take what they say at face value

There was nothing off with Wilder.

He just got beaten more easily than most expected.

I believe she was being ironic

Heretic and HeavyHitter, I will include your top 15. Cheers

Just a quick note if you say something like "I like NAME's list, but...", it's difficult for me to know what your true intention is.

So if anyone wants their ratings included in the calculation please can you throw up your top 15, even if it is a cut and paste of another poster's list.

1. Fury
2. Josh
3. Leshun
4. Dill Pickle
5. Ruiz
6. Ortiz
7. Povetkin
8. Hunter
9. Pulev
10. Parker
11. Chis
12. Usyk
13. Rivas
14. Joyce
15. Martin

So after including 5 more posters ratings, we ended up with:


The (dagilechia memorial) Boxrec Forum Heavyweight Top 15:

1. Tyson Fury - 30(21) 0 1

2. Anthony Joshua - 23(21) 1(1) 0

3. Deontay Wilder - 42(41) 1(1) 1

4. Dillian Whyte - 27(18) 1(1) 0

5. Andy Ruiz Jr - 33(22) 2(0) 0

6. Alexander Povetkin - 35(24) 2(1) 1

7. Joseph Parker - 27(21) 2(0) 0

8. Kubrat Pulev - 28(14) 1(1) 0

9. Luis Ortiz - 31(26) 2(2) 0

10. Michael Hunter - 18(12) 1(0) 1

11. Oleksandr Usyk - 17(13) 0 0

12. Dereck Chisora - 32(23) 9(3) 0

13. Joe Joyce - 10(9) 0 0

14. Charles Martin - 28(25) 2(1) 1

15. Óscar Rivas - 26(18) 1(0) 0


I changed my method for averaging the votes, it was more time consuming, but seems to smooth out for instances of one fighter being voted particularly low or high by one or two posters. My method was the following:

To take a top 30 list from PBO ranking (don't worry no votes fell outside of the top30). I then included everyone's rankings. If people only gave a top 10, I defaulted the remainder to “11”. If people went as far as a top 25, I defaulted the remainder to “26”. Finally, I removed one vote for the highest score and one from the lowest for each fighter (to smooth out any outliers).
I apologise if your vote was an outlier, but it seemed the fairest way to do it. Truth be told I would prefer not to include Usyk until after the Chisora fight, but as I say, this is the outcome the board have voted for.
p.s. If anyone has comments or suggestions for my method please let me know (I'm not a statistician).

Right so now we have a top 15, maybe we can start voting after any fight that could potential effect the rankings

Nice job Shelley. It's hard to place Usyk who is obviously an elite fighter. Witherspoon wasn't good enough to give any clues as to how he'll cope at heavyweight, hopefully the Chisora fight will give us a little more idea.

My ranking of him was influenced by his masterful display against Joe Joyce in the WSB, but then Joyce is way slower than someone like Joshua who is just as big as Joyce. Usyk can beat someone huge and he can beat someone who's athletic but can he beat an elite fighter who's both huge and athletic?

It's similar to Miller's situation. We know pharmaceutically enhanced Miller to be a fearsome proposition but how is he going to perform without his turbo-charger? Nobody really knows, it's like he's starting over.

I was a boxing fanatic throughout the seventies, with a special affinity for the heavyweights, but I think it's true to say I'm as excited, or very nearly as excited, by the state of the heavyweight division going into the twenties.

Tevfik1907 wrote: ↑08 Mar 2020, 19:19

jezzamundo wrote: ↑08 Mar 2020, 19:05 Champ - Joshua
1. Fury
2. Wilder
3. Whyte
4. Ruiz
5. Parker
6. Usyk
7. Pulev
8. Ortiz
9. Povetkin
10. Hunter

Others are obviously debatable, and I won't argue on that.

But Fury > Joshua is debatable too?

I mean, if Fury doesn't lose to Wilder in the third fight, Joshua has nothing on Fury right now.

Fury beat 2015 Klitschko in Germany
Joshua beat 2017 Klitschko in England

Fighting 2015 Klitschko in neutral territory > fighting 2017 Klitschko in home.

Fury beat Wilder twice, one by points and the other by TKO
AJ got KOed by Andy Ruiz Jr., and won the second round by points.

And it's obvious that Wilder > Andy Ruiz Jr.

I want to hear your arguments on why you think Joshua > Fury?

Sorry for the belated reply!

I agree with all of your points - I think Fury has the more impressive resume AND I think he beats Joshua in a fight. The only reason I have Joshua as champion is because in my view, Fury vacated the title when he fell off the wagon and failed to rematch Klitschko. Joshua then became champ when he beat Wlad for the vacant title, then Ruiz, now Joshua again. If there's no belt involved, I rate Fury ahead of Joshua, but as of now, I consider Joshua 'the champ'.

I'm not arguing I put Fury ahead of Joshua by virtue of his undefeated record and his crushing of a fellow member of the big three.

Playing Devil's advocate though, Wilder is the only opponent of Fury's who features in our current top 15 aside from the oft beaten Dereck Chisora. I like and respect my compatriot, Chisora but he doesn't make my own top 15.

Now look at Joshua's record. You can't beat someone if they won't fight you and it's on record that both of his biggest rivals turned down huge offers to face him. So although he hasn't faced numbers 1 or 3 he has in fact only lost to number 5 and has beaten numbers 4,5,6,7 and 14. Number 8 pulled out of their fight, he gets a second chance next up. 9 turned down US$ 8m to face him and he's due to fight number 11 later this year. You could easily make a case for Joshua at number 1.

Why Fury's victory over Klitschko was way better than Joshua's :

1) Klitschko was the champion and unbeaten in many years.
2) It was on Klitschko's adopted home turf.
3) It wasn't even close.
4) By the time Joshua got to him he was a 41 year old ex-champ who had been inactive for a couple of years.
5) Klitschko was 2 years older when he fought Joshua.
6) Joshua had home advantage.
7) Joshua came mighty close to losing.

Why Joshua's victory over Klitschko was way better than Fury's:

1) Klitschko was clearly more motivated and up for it than he'd been in years.
2) The fight was ten times more exciting than Fury's.
3) Joshua fought Klitschko to a standstill , he didn't just outdance him.
4) When Fury fought Klitschko he was complacent and overconfident.
5) Stylistically Fury was always going to be Wlad's worst nightmare. AJ didn't have that luxury.
6) Tyson had little to beat. Wlad's punch output was pathetic.
7) Going from the eye-test 2017 Wlad would have annihilated 2015 Wlad .

Verdict: Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice.

Good post but in any other scenario other than this one it would be recognised that taking the title from a long standing active champion is more meaningful than beating the retired, former champion making a comeback at 40 after having 2 years out.

ewenhay wrote: ↑15 Mar 2020, 08:29 Good post but in any other scenario other than this one it would be recognised that taking the title from a long standing active champion is more meaningful than beating the retired, former champion making a comeback at 40 after having 2 years out.

Agree. Klitschko wasn't the champion when AJ fought him. They fought for a vacant belt. That's a different mentality, Klitschko after 20 wins streak losing all of his titles in a neutral territory, and losing it by points? Its definitely a better feat. We've seen that the long reigning champions always gets the benefit of being the champion at the end of a close fight when it comes to decision, and sometimes they get the benefit of it when it's not even close (as it happened in the 1st Wilder fight), it's definitely more impressive to take the title like that.

When AJ fought Klitschko, Klitschko wasn't the champion, and he didn't fight for 1,5 years. Klitschko came to Fury fight by beating Brytant Jennings (an undefeated fighter at the time) only 6 months ago, and 6 months before that he beat a younger and undefeated Pulev (AJ's current opponent) he was definitely in better shape when he first fought Fury, and he had better confidence.

And I am not even sure if AJ could beat that older and rusty Klitschko anywhere outside of England anyway, when Klitschko KD Joshua, the crowd was still on AJ' side, that gives a huge confidence to the fighter, one of the reasons that Andy Ruiz Jr. knocked out his ass down was because the fight was in USA where AJ couldn't get the same confidence from his own countryman during the fight, madison square garden turned against AJ when the moment Ruiz started to beat his ass, against Klitschko, that never happened.

Now look at the irony, if Fury secures his title against Wilder in the third fight, even in a possible unification fight against AJ, he won't get the supporter advantage in England even if they fight in England, because Fury is from the same country with AJ as well.

Finkel wrote: ↑14 Mar 2020, 22:25 So after including 5 more posters ratings, we ended up with:


The (dagilechia memorial) Boxrec Forum Heavyweight Top 15:

1. Tyson Fury - 30(21) 0 1

2. Anthony Joshua - 23(21) 1(1) 0

3. Deontay Wilder - 42(41) 1(1) 1

4. Dillian Whyte - 27(18) 1(1) 0

5. Andy Ruiz Jr - 33(22) 2(0) 0

6. Alexander Povetkin - 35(24) 2(1) 1

7. Joseph Parker - 27(21) 2(0) 0

8. Kubrat Pulev - 28(14) 1(1) 0

9. Luis Ortiz - 31(26) 2(2) 0

10. Michael Hunter - 18(12) 1(0) 1

11. Oleksandr Usyk - 17(13) 0 0

12. Dereck Chisora - 32(23) 9(3) 0

13. Joe Joyce - 10(9) 0 0

14. Charles Martin - 28(25) 2(1) 1

15. Óscar Rivas - 26(18) 1(0) 0


I changed my method for averaging the votes, it was more time consuming, but seems to smooth out for instances of one fighter being voted particularly low or high by one or two posters. My method was the following:

To take a top 30 list from PBO ranking (don't worry no votes fell outside of the top30). I then included everyone's rankings. If people only gave a top 10, I defaulted the remainder to “11”. If people went as far as a top 25, I defaulted the remainder to “26”. Finally, I removed one vote for the highest score and one from the lowest for each fighter (to smooth out any outliers).
I apologise if your vote was an outlier, but it seemed the fairest way to do it. Truth be told I would prefer not to include Usyk until after the Chisora fight, but as I say, this is the outcome the board have voted for.
p.s. If anyone has comments or suggestions for my method please let me know (I'm not a statistician).

Right so now we have a top 15, maybe we can start voting after any fight that could potential effect the rankings

Ratings look good, definitely 1. Fury 2. Josh 3. Wilder is the right order, no matter what the bomb squad says Wilder hasn't done nearly enough to stay ahead of Josh after a total 60-52 route like that . Ironically I think the often totally overrated Ortiz is a bit low lol , but overall good stuff

Josh with wins over 5 ranked of the other 14 fighters and prob soon to be 6, but Fury has the biggest wins. Wilder has neither but imo still above the likes of the others, though tbh if he can't put a good win soon Whyte is creeping in if he beats Pov

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑15 Mar 2020, 12:21

Finkel wrote: ↑14 Mar 2020, 22:25 So after including 5 more posters ratings, we ended up with:


The (dagilechia memorial) Boxrec Forum Heavyweight Top 15:

1. Tyson Fury - 30(21) 0 1

2. Anthony Joshua - 23(21) 1(1) 0

3. Deontay Wilder - 42(41) 1(1) 1

4. Dillian Whyte - 27(18) 1(1) 0

5. Andy Ruiz Jr - 33(22) 2(0) 0

6. Alexander Povetkin - 35(24) 2(1) 1

7. Joseph Parker - 27(21) 2(0) 0

8. Kubrat Pulev - 28(14) 1(1) 0

9. Luis Ortiz - 31(26) 2(2) 0

10. Michael Hunter - 18(12) 1(0) 1

11. Oleksandr Usyk - 17(13) 0 0

12. Dereck Chisora - 32(23) 9(3) 0

13. Joe Joyce - 10(9) 0 0

14. Charles Martin - 28(25) 2(1) 1

15. Óscar Rivas - 26(18) 1(0) 0


I changed my method for averaging the votes, it was more time consuming, but seems to smooth out for instances of one fighter being voted particularly low or high by one or two posters. My method was the following:

To take a top 30 list from PBO ranking (don't worry no votes fell outside of the top30). I then included everyone's rankings. If people only gave a top 10, I defaulted the remainder to “11”. If people went as far as a top 25, I defaulted the remainder to “26”. Finally, I removed one vote for the highest score and one from the lowest for each fighter (to smooth out any outliers).
I apologise if your vote was an outlier, but it seemed the fairest way to do it. Truth be told I would prefer not to include Usyk until after the Chisora fight, but as I say, this is the outcome the board have voted for.
p.s. If anyone has comments or suggestions for my method please let me know (I'm not a statistician).

Right so now we have a top 15, maybe we can start voting after any fight that could potential effect the rankings

Ratings look good, definitely 1. Fury 2. Josh 3. Wilder is the right order, no matter what the bomb squad says Wilder hasn't done nearly enough to stay ahead of Josh after a total 60-52 route like that . Ironically I think the often totally overrated Ortiz is a bit low lol , but overall good stuff

I am not a Wilder fan, but really Wilder - Joshua is debatable now.

Wilder has 10 title defenses
Joshua has 4 title defenses, then get KOed by Ruiz, he avenged that defeat without KOing Ruiz in the rematch. He won by points, by keeping his distance and accepting that Ruiz can replicate the same if he gets close, and it wasn't a fluke.

Wilder lost to Fury,
Joshua lost to Ruiz,

Fury is at least one level ahead of Ruiz as a boxer. Wilder's loss against Fury isn't as bad as Joshua's loss against Ruiz.

lol at title defenses, how about we go by actual quality of opposition? Josh has beat 5 of these ranked fighters, Wilder just 1. Wilder got totally routed his last fight, 60-52, by a guy who hasn't down that beatdown to any good opponent (ie it was a bad loss even considering it was TGK). Josh avenged his loss and was way more competitive the first fight anyway

BTW....where are your title defense numbers from? Josh defended vs Parker, Takam, Molina, Povetkin, Wlad, and Breazeale....that is more than 4


Josh wins: Wlad, Whyte, Parker, Povetkin, Ruiz, Takam, Martin , Breazeale,
Wilder wins: Ortiz, Stiverne, Breazeale, ??

Using title defense numbers is just an attempt to hide what really matters

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑15 Mar 2020, 12:34 lol at title defenses, how about we go by actual quality of opposition? Josh has beat 5 of these ranked fighters, Wilder just 1. Wilder got totally routed his last fight, 60-52, by a guy who hasn't down that beatdown to any good opponent. Josh avenged his loss and was way more competitive the first fight anyway

BTW....where are your title defense numbers from? Josh defended vs Parker, Takam, Molina, Povetkin, Wlad, and Breazeale....that is more than 4

If you count IBF, yes it's around 7.

He didn't have WBA belt against Klitschko, and he didn't have WBO against Parker.

It's still 10 title defenses > 7 title defenses.

Wilder beat Breazeale easier than Joshua did.

lol and why the hell wouldn't you count it? Wilder only had one belt too bruh, I mean should we not count defenses if a fighter challenges himself and puts his belt on the line in a unification? That would be bizarre...so defending vs a shopworn to hell Arreola should count, but fighting Parker shouldn't? that sounds like some bomb squad logic

They both beat the hell out of Breazeale, haha at that being the game changer. You do know that AJ beat Molina way easier than Wilder did too right, without getting hurt? He also stopped their 1 other common opponent faster than Wilder did.

As I said, using title defenses is just an attempt to cover up what matters.

AJ beat: Wlad, Whyte, Parker, Povetkin, Ruiz, Takam, Martin , Breazeale. He has beat 5 of the current top 15.
Wilder beat:Ortiz, Stiverne, Breazeale. He has beat 1 of the current top 15

AJ was competitive in his loss and avenged it one-sidedly
Wilder wasn't, hasn't, and is coming off that bad loss. he needs to bounce back and maybe he can

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑15 Mar 2020, 12:47 lol and why the hell wouldn't you count it? Wilder only had one belt too bruh, I mean should we not count defenses if a fighter challenges himself and puts his belt on the line in a unification? That would be bizarre...so defending vs a shopworn to hell Arreola should count, but fighting Parker shouldn't? that sounds like some bomb squad logic

They both beat the hell out of Breazeale, haha at that being the game changer. You do know that AJ beat Molina way easier than Wilder did too right, without getting hurt? He also stopped their 1 other common opponent faster than Wilder did.

As I said, using title defenses is just an attempt to cover up what matters.

AJ beat: Wlad, Whyte, Parker, Povetkin, Ruiz, Takam, Martin , Breazeale. He has beat 5 of the current top 15.
Wilder beat:Ortiz, Stiverne, Breazeale. He has beat 1 of the current top 15

AJ was competitive in his loss and avenged it one-sidedly
Wilder wasn't, hasn't, and is coming off that bad loss. he needs to bounce back and maybe he can

Well because I think WBC/WBA>other belts. WBO and IBF are made up belts which came after 1980s.

Wilder destroyed Breazeale in the first round, that's not equal to Joshua beating him in the seventh round.

Look at Wilder's second Stiverne fight, that was as impressive as Breazeale fight.

And AJ definitely didn't avenge it ''one-sidely'' lol, he got KOed in the first fight, he won the second by points, and still losing two rounds to Ruiz even when he was trying to win it by keeping his distance in the whole fight, accepting the fact that he can't beat Ruiz by KO, and also accepting the fact that Ruiz can KO him if he gets close to him, that was a terrible way to secure his belts, it was a dull fight and Ruiz definitely deserves a third fight if he gets into shape. Not even mention Ruiz was out of shape, due to being a party boy for months before the fight, AJ got lucky to lose his belts against someone like that so he could take it back not because he was stronger because his opponent got weaker.