BoxRec

Oh I know plenty, and have seen him fight just as much as you have lol. It just stings these bruhs when these facts are brought up.

You should really like Wlad a lot more, he fought just like huggy Jack

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑29 Jun 2020, 08:55

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Jun 2020, 22:26

It's just the constant "uhhh huhh yeah, he fought Middleweights" bullsh*t. It's f*cking stupid.

He fought the guys of his era. That's it. That's all anyone can do.

And he does it when nobody is even talking about Johnson. Criticize one of his guys and it's always some BS about along the line of "well at least he wasn't just fighting middleweights."

He brings up Johnson more often than everyone else combined, and he knows almost nothing about him.

Clearly

Am I wrong about the style? That he was a prolific hugger and pawer, often doing so over much smaller opponents (just like Wlad!? You should love some Klit alpy my boi )

Am I wrong that he regularly fought dudes size of middleweights today, including winning the HW title vs one?

Am I wrong that he beat one of his most notable opponents when that dude was just a teenager (then never fought him again), and another who hadnt fought in 6 years?


Not sure where the lack of knowledge comes in. These are all facts, obviously you bruhs don't like them, but unfortunetly they are still true. Anyway, I still don't have hate in my heart for the man like gilly did for big Tyson , and I'm probably a bigger fan of JJ than alpy is of any current hw tbh

It that you left out a awful lot about him. For starters, he was a lot more than a "hugger and a pawer." He knew how to fight. He beat many fighters who were bigger than him. He overcame a lot more to get a title shot than most heavyweight champions had to.
Try reading a book about him instead of being on Boxrec every waking hour of the day.

Also, there is no need to bring him up constantly when he had little to nothing to do with what we are talking about.

Hug, paw, jab, parry, hug, paw paw jab. Nullify usually smaller opponents and wear them down gradually then open up a bit more to finish them. This was basically his style. Very very similar to your much loved Wlad Klit, who btw also lost his title to a larger man

Dudes record is just loaded with the type of opponents I've mentioned, take them out and you take out like 3/4 of his notable opposition. I'm sure we've all read that he was unforgettably black btw.

I bring him up and will continue, especially when people have double standards or just blindly buy into his name and story without critically looking at his career , easily one of the most overrated in history

You bring him when one of your guys gets criticized, even when the criticism has little or nothing to do with Johnson.
That's just stupid. Your obsession with him (whom you know little about) is way overboard.
You have to look at everything when evaluating someone. The good and the bad. You simply ignore what is inconvenient for you.

Johnson should have defended his title against Langford, McVey, and Jeannette. Myself and others had said this before. That's a fair criticism.
You that he fought whoever would fight him before he won the title.

Langford was the best of the three. Had he defended it against Langford, You would have took one look at Langford's weight and ripped him for fighting him.

You rip for winning the title against a small guy. (Burns) What was he supposed to do? Johnson had been fighting for 11 years before finally getting a title shot. Should have just passed on his one chance to get a title shot?

You dismiss his win over Jeffries because Jeffries was off for 6 years. I agree. However, you then rip Johnson for losing to Willard when Johnson was old and over the hill. He was winning after 25 rounds. That means nothing to you. You say Willard won because he was big, not because Johnson was old. That's just stupid.

You also ignore that Jeffries would not defend the title against Johnson. Did it ever occur to you that Jeffries thought it was a too much of a risk, because he knew that Johnson was a great fighter?

Your criticism of Johnson for hugging and pawing? Guess what, he threw punches. The wind didn't knock out his opponents. If you really knew what to look for, you would see subtle things that Johnson does that makes him hard to hit.

If you don't want to give credit for beating a guy who was too small, too old, etc. fine. However, that doesn't make him worse for fighting those guys. Simply ignore those fights. Look at the guy who were near their prime that were good. Do some research. He beat several legitimate heavyweights.

Lol, Wlad aint my guy bruh, not at all. I bring up JJ just when people massively overrate him, or show double standards.

It's true he didn't just hug and paw. Him and Wlad were like style twins. Paw, paw, jab, hug, paw paw, paw, jab, right , hug. They neutralized their opponents and eventually wore them down and finished them--look at how many KOs Wlad has too. Effective boxing, but pretty much the same thing. Let's not slag the one but worship the other.

Ya, sure, a lot of that was just JJ's time, just like it was some fighter's time that their division was weak and nothing they could do. Tough luck. But that sucks for them, it's stupid to give them some sort of boost to make up for their own weak era. Fact is, it would belaughed at hard if Fury won a HW title vs Bryan Castano, yet JJ beats a bunch of guys that size, beats on guy retired 6 years, beats on teenagers, and then gets worshipped for it.

Let's just be consistent here. The people who treat JJ like some boxing gawd, atg top 3-5 or so really shouldn't be nearly as negative about other fighters at they are.

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑29 Jun 2020, 16:52 Hug, paw, jab, parry, hug, paw paw jab. Nullify usually smaller opponents and wear them down gradually then open up a bit more to finish them. This was basically his style. Very very similar to your much loved Wlad Klit, who btw also lost his title to a larger man

Dudes record is just loaded with the type of opponents I've mentioned, take them out and you take out like 3/4 of his notable opposition. I'm sure we've all read that he was unforgettably black btw.

I bring him up and will continue, especially when people have double standards or just blindly buy into his name and story without critically looking at his career , easily one of the most overrated in history

The 8mm footage of those fights doesn't allow you to break down their styles all that well. The little bits of footage we get from guys of that era, leaves a lot to be desired.

Sure, but I don't see how it interfered much with being able to see what JJ's style was, plus it can be read about. The paw paw jab, hug, paw jab paw right hug routine is pretty apparent. What are we missing? He gets described as a master boxer by people today for it, but it's really just the same thing the much maligned Wlad did.

What was his true style then?

He was very good at moving slightly to avoid getting hit. Very few guys can do this. He was also very good at what is called "parrying". He would actually block his opponent's punches with his glove. You can see some of this, even on the old films. Klitschko did not do either of these Yes, he clinched some; so did many other fighters throughout the years.

The "maligned" Klitschko had glaring weaknesses: a glass jaw and poor stamina. Johnson did not have either of these weaknesses. There is little in common between Klitschko and Johnson. Johnson was not perfect; nobody is. However, if you know what to look for, you can tell Johnson was a great fighter.

Lol, Wlad's quick step back was a huge part of his game in the second half of his career, it is visible in pretty much all his fights, did you even watch them? It was his main defense as much as hugging was--when a guy rushed him, quick step back, guy swings and misses, then gets hit or hugged. He also parried regulary---it's just batting down punches basically and a good parry is very sutble. He even would use it offensively and bat down his opponents glove and then punch the cleared target.

They basically had the same style and it's just silly to criticize one guy for it while worshipping the other. Though Wlad was a much bigger puncher than JJ and not tremendous with stamina, that's true

lol yourself. Klitschko was not in Johnson's league defensively. Like the Elusive One, it's not hard to look good defensively when your opponents don't throw punches. That was quite a defensive battle those two had against each other, wasn't?

You would hard pressed to find many more heavyweight champions more different than Johnson than Klitschko.
Ya.

Paw, jab, paw, paw, jab, step back, jab, paw, paw, right hand......and so on and so on. Usually smaller opponents nullified, smothered, and worn down.

Very very similar styles. The fact that you don't even know of Wlad doing slight movements back suggests you actually didn't watch too much of him, same with the pawing and parrying. Wlad's like a much bigger , white JJ

Whatever.

Truth hurts, we all like to have our double standards in tact

The glass jaw criticism seems pretty silly. Wladimir was able to go years without being stopped or even dropped while fighting numerous highly ranked opponents. If he had a glass chin he became pretty adept at protecting it.

His title reign was also far and away better than Johnson's in terms of fighting the best opponents available.

The competition argument also seems to rely a lot on circular logic. People seem to be dismissing Wladimir's opposition simply because he beat them.