Has anyone ever held four world titles?

Pengelly · Post by **Pengelly** » 18 Aug 2003, 06:31

I am the editor of a magazine and recently had the following question posed to me:

I must advise you that Lennox Lewis and Bob Fitzsimmons were not the only ones to win three world boxing titles. An American, who's name escapes me, won FOUR. He was around in the "Marvellous Marvin" Hagler, Thomas "Hitman" Hearns era and indeed might have been one of them. Can you put the matter right?

Is this man right?
Thanks

Dutch Windmill · Post by **Dutch Windmill** » 18 Aug 2003, 08:03

SUGAR RAY LEONARD

and in fact you could say he won five

welter, light-middle, middle, super-middle and a part of light-heavy

God damn what am i doing in this forum.

I believe Henry Armstrong also deserves a mention, he held 3 world championship belts, feather, light and welter AT THE SAME TIME.

Dutch Windmill · Post by **Dutch Windmill** » 18 Aug 2003, 08:08

BTW, what you mean? Four different weight classes or four different sanctioning bodies.

Anyway, you can't mean the same for Lennox Lewis and Bob Fitzsimmons.
Fitzsimmons only held middle, light-heavy and heavy to my knowledge.

If you mean how many times one won the same world title, Evander Holyfield is the king. He held a portion of the heavyweight world title 4 times.

So, please rephrase your question? What do you mean exactly?

Dave1armedTua · Post by **Dave1armedTua** » 18 Aug 2003, 19:11

And let's not overlook everyone's favorite bastard Roy Jones Jr.

He has held 9 titles in 4 different weight classes.

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 19 Aug 2003, 01:21

Once again.....only two men have held three legitimate world titles....Bob Fitzimmons and Henry Armstrong. No one has ever held more LEGITMATE WORLD TITLES.

Once again...Fitzimmons held the middleweight title first, then the heavyweight and then dropped down to win the light heavyweight title.

once again, Henry Armstrong won the featherweight title, the welterweight title and the lightweight title and held them all at the same time.

all other claims are specious....half division titles, titles split among various sanctioining bodies, title like Sugar Ray Leonard's in which the holder of the title had to agree to come in UNDER that title's legitimate weight...listing all the phony titles would be an exercise in tedium.

Tomato-Can · Post by **Tomato-Can** » 19 Aug 2003, 06:30

Jaclem wrote:Once again.....only two men have held three legitimate world titles....Bob Fitzimmons and Henry Armstrong. No one has ever held more LEGITMATE WORLD TITLES.

Once again...Fitzimmons held the middleweight title first, then the heavyweight and then dropped down to win the light heavyweight title.

once again, Henry Armstrong won the featherweight title, the welterweight title and the lightweight title and held them all at the same time.

all other claims are specious....half division titles, titles split among various sanctioining bodies, title like Sugar Ray Leonard's in which the holder of the title had to agree to come in UNDER that title's legitimate weight...listing all the phony titles would be an exercise in tedium.

Jaclem....I feel your pain. Unfortunately only people 40 years old and older (like myself) spent over a decade as fans with the understanding that there is only one world therefore there can only be one world champion per division.

This is not meant as a put down of anybody who posted before me. In fact it is quite understandable when all you have ever heard are sanctioning body titlist's being called world champions. I have even argued with some who say that lineal titles are imaginary and therefore irrelevant and that the sanctioning bodies titles are the only ones that count.

You can also blame the boxers themselves for taking advantage of the fact that there are 68 "world championships" to be had instead of the legitimate 8 and use this fact to go division hopping, piling up meaningless titles and belts.

Marco Antonio Barrera and Lennox Lewis have recently told the sancioning bodies to go piss up a rope because everybody knows they are the real champions in their divisions and there is no reason for them to pay extortion money (sanctioning fees). Hopefully this will start a trend but I wont be holding my breath.

tolstoy · Post by **tolstoy** » 19 Aug 2003, 08:04

For what it's worth, Tommy Hearns held 6 (versions of) world titles: welterweight, light middleweight, middleweight, super-middleweight, light heavyweight and cruiserweight.

Not as impressive as Roy Jones Jr's jump from middleweight to heavyweight but, nevertheless, spanning around 40 pounds of a weight increase over a few years.

Tyson KTFO 3 Times · Post by **Tyson KTFO 3 Times** » 19 Aug 2003, 11:42

tolstoy wrote:For what it's worth, Tommy Hearns held 6 (versions of) world titles: welterweight, light middleweight, middleweight, super-middleweight, light heavyweight and cruiserweight.

Not as impressive as Roy Jones Jr's jump from middleweight to heavyweight but, nevertheless, spanning around 40 pounds of a weight increase over a few years.

I dont know, i think that hearns achievements could be just as impressive as Jones Jnr, i guess it depends on how you rate these things.

jsc1973 · Post by **jsc1973** » 20 Aug 2003, 01:28

Hearns' achievements are far superior to Jones', because Hearns always fought the best available opponents. He ducked nobody.

He could have done what Jones has done, never fighting Leonard, Hagler, Duran or any of the other greats, and selectively picked opponents in different weight classes that he knew he could beat. He didn't do that. He went through the best, or they went through him. Roy's been ducking his best opponents since he fought Toney and Hopkins a decade ago.

I don't know why Hearns couldn't beat Iran Barkley, but Roy would have taken one look at Barkley's power and moved up a weight class instead of fighting him.

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 20 Aug 2003, 11:38

why do posts keep appearing on this thread? the question was "has anyone ever held four world titles" and the answer is no.

Tyson KTFO 3 Times · Post by **Tyson KTFO 3 Times** » 20 Aug 2003, 12:15

Jaclem wrote:why do posts keep appearing on this thread? the question was "has anyone ever held four world titles" and the answer is no.

Calm down...

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 20 Aug 2003, 17:39

okay...i'll say it calmly..no...no...no...no...no...no...no...no....no....no....no....no....no....no....no...no....no....no....etc.

Tomato-Can · Post by **Tomato-Can** » 20 Aug 2003, 18:11

Jaclem wrote:why do posts keep appearing on this thread? the question was "has anyone ever held four world titles" and the answer is no.

Now let me get this straight Jaclem. You're saying only Fitzsimmons and Armstrong held 3 World Titles? What about Thanomchit Sukhotai? He held:

1.) The Upper Bangkok Jr. Pissweight Title

2.) The OPBF Super Skinnyweight Title

3.) The Thailand Overfed flyweight Title

Would'nt that make him a 3 time champion?

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 20 Aug 2003, 20:56

tomato puss...your gender pronoun is wrong....she was a woman fighter and not eleigible for this thread.

jsc1973 · Post by **jsc1973** » 21 Aug 2003, 04:38

bollocks wrote:It's hard to believe Barkely himself won titles in 3 divisions. Tough SOB but........

Well, part of that was because Hearns lost to him twice in title fights, once at 160 and again at 175. But Barkley, on any given day in his prime, could fight as well as anyone in the world. He was super against Hearns both times, he lost one belt in a slugfest with Michael Nunn that I actually scored for him, and he lost one to Duran in Roberto's last great fight, in 1989. He just wasn't consistent.

Barkley actually claims to have won titles at four weight classes, because he won some crappy title at heavyweight late in his career. If I were him, I'd just as soon people forgot those fights.

Terp · Post by **Terp** » 26 Aug 2003, 04:44

Jaclem wrote:
all other claims are specious....half division titles, titles split among various sanctioining bodies, title like Sugar Ray Leonard's in which the holder of the title had to agree to come in UNDER that title's legitimate weight...listing all the phony titles would be an exercise in tedium.

I'm afraid you're going to have to accept these "half division" titles old man. It's not like they just popped up in the last couple of weeks. I agree on Leonard tho.

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 26 Aug 2003, 12:15

okay terp....i'll accept the half divisions....if everyone will decide who the undisputed legitimate ttitle holders are.

...but I can't accept a three pound difference with those tiny guys as legit...a guy could eat a bowl of chili and weight 118 and then....ahh...pass wind is the delicate way to put it ..and come in at 115 and hold that title too....and do as fitzimmons and armstrong did....drop down in weight and add a title.

Terp · Post by **Terp** » 01 Sep 2003, 12:28

Jaclem wrote:okay terp....i'll accept the half divisions....if everyone will decide who the undisputed legitimate ttitle holders are.

...but I can't accept a three pound difference with those tiny guys as legit...a guy could eat a bowl of chili and weight 118 and then....ahh...pass wind is the delicate way to put it ..and come in at 115 and hold that title too....and do as fitzimmons and armstrong did....drop down in weight and add a title.

If you accept 140 and 147 you have to accept, 115 and 118. Rafael Marquez certainly couldn't just fart and drop down to 115. They're smaller, so each pound is more to them. With fighters today just making weight, every pound is signifigant. Take a look at Keitaro Hoshino and Eric Morel and tell me they should only be a division apart.