Could Groves or Degale beat Abraham in Germany?

[Manchester Massive]

Be very difficult to get a decision over there

[Finn]

Be very difficult to get a decision over there

I think considering both absolutely destroyed Paul Smith when they were relative novices its very likely degale would box rings around AA. I think even with dodgy scoring the fight wouldnt be close enough to end up in AA's favour.

As for Groves i think he would win comfortably too if he boxes clever however if he chose to stand toe to toe he could quite easily be taken out in the later rounds himself. AA is still a beast of a puncher.

[JimJim2009]

Depends what the question is. Groves and Degale would - with fair judges - beat Abraham anywhere. In Germany, I honestly don't think they give a flying xxxx about the controversies. In the absolute worst case scenario, there would be a rematch - that would be it. Otherwise, everyone moves on and earns from the next title defence - the boxer, promoter, manager, etc etc. Fans come and buy more tickets, the TV channels pays the promoter for the rights to televise, and so on, and so on. Nothing will change. Stylewise, I think Groves and Degale would be better suited to winning rounds more clearly as they're both busy fighters compared to Abraham. We will never see those fights happen though, the model of modern boxing is based upon providing the ability for a fighter to win and keep hold of a world title, without necessarily facing the most dangerous opponents. Hence 4 or more world champs per division. If Abraham could have still made 160 and hadn't joined the super six, he would have been making defence number 45 by now against Brian Rose.

[lefty]

Be very difficult to get a decision over there

I think considering both absolutely destroyed Paul Smith when they were relative novices its very likely degale would box rings around AA. I think even with dodgy scoring the fight wouldnt be close enough to end up in AA's favour.

As for Groves i think he would win comfortably too if he boxes clever however if he chose to stand toe to toe he could quite easily be taken out in the later rounds himself. AA is still a beast of a puncher.

I dont think he is mate. The Abraham of old, particularily at middleweight would of stopped Smith last night. He never really hurt Smith that much in the fight either.

[Finn]

Be very difficult to get a decision over there

I think considering both absolutely destroyed Paul Smith when they were relative novices its very likely degale would box rings around AA. I think even with dodgy scoring the fight wouldnt be close enough to end up in AA's favour.

As for Groves i think he would win comfortably too if he boxes clever however if he chose to stand toe to toe he could quite easily be taken out in the later rounds himself. AA is still a beast of a puncher.

I dont think he is mate. The Abraham of old, particularily at middleweight would of stopped Smith last night. He never really hurt Smith that much in the fight either.

i've just looked at his record i didnt realise he's fought so many times recently with such a massive drought of stoppages.

[sharpei_louis]

Yeah I was saying in CS that Abraham still lives off a very old reputation as a big puncher - there's no evidence of this at all these days.
Groves was criticised for his European title win last week but was head and shoulders better than Abraham.
I think he or Degale could stop Abraham late if things went their way, and if not the robbery would be absolutely transparent.

[lefty]

Yeah I was saying in CS that Abraham still lives off a very old reputation as a big puncher - there's no evidence of this at all these days.
Groves was criticised for his European title win last week but was head and shoulders better than Abraham.
I think he or Degale could stop Abraham late if things went their way, and if not the robbery would be absolutely transparent.

Could do but I dunno. I struggle to see anyone stopping Abraham as he's a grizzly tough bastard even if he's not the most talented.

[Tykemania]

Groves would need to take him out, as I fear AA would catch up to him in the last four rounds. DeGale would need to be willing to work for 12 rounds, which he isn't always...

[crusader]

Groves is a Saurerland fighter and seems to have a bigger upside at this point than AA does. If judges are catering to the interests of the promoters who stage the cards, it seems like Abraham would be far less likely to benefit from unfair scoring against Groves than he would against someone like Paul Smith.

The scoring of AA's recent bouts generally hasn't been as questionable as it was for the Smith encounter anyway, so I'm not sure that people should be thinking that one must batter him to have any chance of decisioning him at home.

[whiskey]

Styles.

Wilczewski gave Degale a really torrid night, getting a draw on one card, but he couldn't do anything at all with Abraham, couldn't make any dent in him at all.

Arthur turned up that night, whereas last night I don't think he did at all -and quite clearly thought he'd just have to glove up and easily beat Smith, whom by return had trained to absolute best that he could do.

Watt/Halling were saying he's this that and the other, he's old, he's blowing, he's worried etc etc - nope, he just didn't take the challenger serious enough.

I'd like to think I've watched more Abraham fights than anyone, starting with Howard Eastman about ten years ago when he was about 25 or so and the IBF 160 champion.

And if GG or Degale think they can compare their respective performances against Smith and conclude they'd easily beat him, then fair enough but I don't think it's as clear cut as that because for a start he'd treat them with far more respect.

Don't get me wrong, he respect's Smith now - but he didn't in camp.

[crusader]

I get the point about styles.

I think AA is most susceptible to someone who maintains a high workrate to capitalize on his bouts of inactivity. Groves and Degale, while being better overall than Smith, aren't usually as busy and Degale in particular goes through periods in which he does little. I'd still favor each of the Brits over AA but they shouldn't expect to have it their way just because someone they dominated gave him a go.

[187]

No chance.

They're both better than AA but they'd have to knock him out to win and that ain't happening

[coneye]

Looked to like Smith actually hurt him and backed him up a couple of times . Groves i think could do the same easier .

[TopGun]

Both would probably beat Abraham, mainly from work rate.

[ILikeBeer]

If it went to points in Germany, either of them would have to absolutely kill him to get a decision. They could probably knock him over in every round, and lose on points if he was still standing at the end.

[tobyh5]

AA is a hugely overrated Super Middle. Period

[GPTM1403]

As others have said, don't think either of those guys is going to leave it close enough for a decision for Abraham to look anything other than a fix if they outboxed him. Both are better boxers than Smith, more accurate and a bit quicker. Groves certainly bangs harder than Smith and once, just once, late on Smith did make Abraham stop and take stock. The other thing is I think Smith just showed everyone how to beat Abraham and he didn't execute the plan properly. His corner were rightly berating him for not working the body as much as they wanted. I do think DeGale and Groves would hit the body more, harder and quicker and either force Abraham to work at a rate he can't sustain or wear him down. A stoppage could be achieved by either if they followed the plan better and worked hard. But I would back both to win on points. Which probably just reflects more than Abraham is a top 10 but not top 3-4 super middle these days. I would also agree he looked like he thought he could just walk Smith down, but I don't think taking the other 2 more seriously actually means he can take anything away from their speed, accuracy and dig.