Roy Jones winning a HW title.

[VG_Addict]

How significant would you say Roy Jones going up from MW to winning a title at HW is? Sure, it's a good accomplishment, but look at who he beat to get it. He beat Ruiz, a relatively small, feather-fisted HW. He also won the trinket WBA belt, and not the lineal HW championship, like Fitzsimmons and Spinks did against Corbett and Holmes, respectively.

[witherspoon]

The record will show that Jones won the WBA heavyweight title, and he deserves respect for that, more so than a bona fide heavyweight accomplishing the same.

But I would never compare that achievement with what Corbett and Spinks did. For me it's all about the opposition. If Jones had taken on a true quality champion like Lewis or Tyson and put up a gutsy, skillful but ultimately losing effort he would probably come away with more credibility as a heavyweight than he gets for beating up John Ruiz.

Even if, by some quirk of fate, John Ruiz had become lineal champion, I imagine beating him would be seen as an opportunistic grab. As it is, Jones is just one of many alphabet champs to have come and gone in heavyweight.

Nobody would consider Tim Witherspoons two championships as comparable to what Ali and Patterson achieved before him, in the same way Jones doesn't compare with Fitz and Jinx.

[littlepug]

Not very significant just another trinket for his collection, would've been more impressed if he had beaten tua/mercer/moorer in a nontitle fight

[HomicideHenry]

The problem or issue I have with the significance of Jones winning the WBA version of the world title, is the quality of opponent he defeated. I can list you off over a dozen names or better, of welterweights, middleweights, light heavies, who came up in weight and defeated opponents who were just as good as Ruiz or better--- yet they are never given the time of day on this forum, or really anywhere else.

The real question, to me, ought to be, could Jones of duplicated the feat had he been in any other era than his own? In my opinion, if he was in the same era as Harold Johnson and others who were kayoing or decisioning real power hitting monsters, he would be hard pressed to stand out in that era because he would just be "average" in the sense that everybody was doing it. Ezzard Charles ffs fought Elmer Ray two-three times, and many would say that Louis outright ducked Ray. Mickey Walker for crying out loud gave up thirty-forty pounds in weight and was fighting wars with guys like Jack Sharkey (who he was robbed blind against).

I'm not saying Jones wouldn't of hand the talent to of made his own mark in an earlier era--- but what he would of done, if he could of pulled it off, wouldn't of been as spectacular or celebrated as it is in our era. Too many people were doing the same thing--- even low-mid level journeyman were facing larger men on a regular basis.

[klompton]

The real question, to me, ought to be, could Jones of duplicated the feat had he been in any other era than his own?

And could he have done it in his era or any other without being roided up to his eyeballs. I say no.

[dempseyfire]

It was a meaningless paper belt. I give Mickey Walker more credit for beating Uzcudun.

[Ezzard]

It was a meaningless paper belt. I give Mickey Walker more credit for beating Uzcudun.

100%

[Crease]

I gave respect to Roy for beating Ruiz, he won that fight convincingly and as such became the rightful WBA World Heavyweight Champion. But, it's important to acknowledge that being a "World Champion" is secondary to being The Number One in the weight division. Roy was never the number one in the Heavyweight division.

[Broomhall]

I am not a Jones fan but I think the moving up from Middle to Heavy and winning is a very significant achievement in the era of big more athletic heavyweights.

Fitzimmons was nearly as big as Corbett and much more experienced, when Harold Johnson etc were fighting the difference between light heavy and heavy was much less pronounced with fewer really big men about so I dont think Jones achievement should be underestimated.

[Senya13]

I give Mickey Walker more credit for beating Uzcudun.

A fight Walker was expected to win easily, but barely squeaked past the skilless Spaniard, by using a foul punch at the end of the 8th, and where a lot of people disagreed with the verdict, scoring a victory for Uzcudun?

[Ambling Alp II]

Yes.

[Bodyshot3]

It remains an outstanding achievement.....but Ruiz was handpicked for the job and although he was pretty effective in certain types of fights and always rugged and determined, John was a a notably poor champion by any era's standards.

Certainly a rung down the ladder in terms of what Mike Spinks achieved against Holmes (twice) and you could argue that whilst Bob Foster was unsuccessful, going 8 rounds with Ali was an accomplishment equal to getting the nod and the belt against Ruiz.

By the way....the more I like at Foster's record the more I think that this guy was an incredible champion and should always figure in any ATG ranking you care to mention. The mind kind of boggles as to how tough and professional this guy must have been to have fought someone like Pierre Fourie in Johannesburg in 1973, talk about stepping into the lion's den!

A black American fighter taking on a dangerous white South African in a massive stadium fight during the heart of Apartheid. That must have taken some big cojones to put it mildly.

[dempseyfire]

I am not a Jones fan but I think the moving up from Middle to Heavy and winning is a very significant achievement in the era of big more athletic heavyweights.

Fitzimmons was nearly as big as Corbett and much more experienced, when Harold Johnson etc were fighting the difference between light heavy and heavy was much less pronounced with fewer really big men about so I dont think Jones achievement should be underestimated.

Johnson beat Nino Valdez, Clarence Henry, Jimmy Bivins, Eddie Machen. Any of those wins far surpass Ruiz, and Valdez would've dwarfed him. (Johnson also beat the forgotten but very dangerous monster puncher Sid "StraightJacket" Peaks, who was a very big guy)

Ruiz wasn't big or athletic . . a natural cruiser who carried excess luggage like most modern HWs. only around 6 ft in height, with basic skills.

[The Great John L]

Ruiz wasn't big or athletic . . a natural cruiser who carried excess luggage like most modern HWs. only around 6 ft in height, with basic skills.

Exactly. How could anyone use the term athletic in a discussion of Ruiz. And does anyone believe that “modern” HWs are, in general, more “athletic” than HWs from prior eras?

[drunkenpiper36]

I think any time a fighter moves up in weight and beats a ranked opponent who has frequented that division for some time deserves merit. It wasn't a great win by any means, but a nice scalp. As for the "title" part of it? Looks nice on paper but not really much of a legacy booster unless he was in there with the lineal champ, which he wasn't.

[misterpunch]

my Siamese cat once outpointed john ruiz in an unauthorized bout over 12 rounds. he also won the return by stopping him in 6

[Nile4000]

How significant would you say Roy Jones going up from MW to winning a title at HW is? Sure, it's a good accomplishment, but look at who he beat to get it. He beat Ruiz, a relatively small, feather-fisted HW. He also won the trinket WBA belt, and not the lineal HW championship, like Fitzsimmons and Spinks did against Corbett and Holmes, respectively.

Not that significant.Let him try that crap with a real heavyweight like Larry Holmes, he wouldn't even last 50 seconds.And put him in with a speedy heavy, like Page, or Dokes, he wouldn't make it past 25.