BoxRec & ESPN have dropped Andre Ward out of their rankings

[Freedom2013]

I wonder if The Ring and Transnational will will do the same this week?

[Freedom2013]

I wonder if The Ring and Transnational will will do the same this week?

According to Ring Magazine’s own rules, he’s unlikely to be dropped until May next year (due to 18 months of inactivity).

I see that, but they've dropped many other people out after a year of inactivity. For example, Vitali Klitschko was dropped by the Ring after less than a year of not fighting.

And to hold a Championship Ring belt, he has to beat a top 5 in his division within 18 months. Rodriguez wasn't in the top 5 at super middleweight, so Ward has gone far past that time.

[Bard of Boxrec]

Has he been stripped of whatever belts he held?

[Andrew]

And rightfully so as he is not fighting

[Andrew]

Has he been stripped of whatever belts he held?

WBA are a joke with title Shumenov kept the WBa belt without fighting for 18 months

Drug cheating Guillermo Jones kept his for not fighting for 2 years

richar Abril kept his not fighting for 18 months

[crusader]

Froch should take a picture in one of the "I'm #1 shirts."

[crusader]

The Ring's 'rules' pertaining to their title are largely useless if I'm recalling them correctly. Basically they just list a bunch of scenarios in which a fighter could lose their belt, and that language is consistent with the fighter remaining champion even if they sit around for 3 years doing nothing.

[Bard of Boxrec]

Froch should take a picture in one of the "I'm #1 shirts."

[Rodian]

drop Floyd as well and we got something legit going on. Fighting Maidana twice for a P4P king is an embarrassment.

[Bobbyptsd]

Has he been stripped of whatever belts he held?

According to the WBA’s official site, Ward is still their “Super” champion. However, Andre was stripped of his WBC title last year.

The thing is… how much credibility does the WBA really carry nowadays? They rate Carl Froch as their WBA-IBF unified champion. They also have “undisputed”, “regular” and interim “world champions” in other weight classes as well.

How many world champions does the WBA need? I suppose enough to maximise the revenue received from sanctioning fees!

I’m not sure how Ward loses his lineal belt?

He can't, since it doesn't, you know, actually exist.

[Bobbyptsd]

Who did he win the lineal title against then?

Look, he's one of my favorite fighters, and I think he's probably the best fighter in the word today. But the whole "lineal" thing is pretty much just imaginary. You can't really "lose" something that's a matter of opinion.

[Bobbyptsd]

Who did he win the lineal title against then?

Look, he's one of my favorite fighters, and I think he's probably the best fighter in the word today. But the whole "lineal" thing is pretty much just imaginary. You can't really "lose" something that's a matter of opinion.

The "lineal champion" isn't a matter of opinion.

Joe Calzaghe held the lineal super middleweight championship, but vacated it when he moved up to the 175lb division to face Bernard Hopkins.

Andre Ward subsequently captured the vacant mythical belt in 2011 when he defeated Carl Froch.

I have previously questioned the value of the so-called "lineal championship", which is frequently cited by the media and fight fans, but I was lambasted by many Boxrec forum members for doing so, despite listing multiple bizarre anomalies with the delegated champions that no one with an ounce of intellect could defend!

Anyway, facts are facts, so make your own mind up!

Of course it is. You said yourself the belt is mythical.

And who did Calzaghe win that lineal title against, again? Who cares who cites it? Again, Calzaghe was also one of my favorite fighters. But I can't think of a moment where he could say he completely cleaned up the division, or beat someone who had.

[zorndeslammes]

Cyberboxingzone controls the linear title?

He was given the Ring Magazine title for beating Lacy. So what? That was an era where the Ring was handing out all sorts of ridiculous belts. They gave Vitali Klitschko one for beating Corrie Sanders.

I just went and saw they had Zsolt Erdei "vacating" the linear title. This is hilarious.

[Freedom2013]

Looks like The Ring is leaving him in their rankings.

Doesn't mean much though, the ESPN and Transnational rankings have more credibility these days anyway.

I’m not sure how Ward loses his lineal belt?

Like Zsolt Erdei lost his lineal status?

[ttornado]

I have previously questioned the value of the so-called "lineal championship", which is frequently cited by the media and fight fans, but I was lambasted by many Boxrec forum members for doing so, despite listing multiple bizarre anomalies with the delegated champions that no one with an ounce of intellect could defend!

Just because something is flawed doesn't make it worthless

[Bard of Boxrec]

no one with an ounce of intellect could defend!

Intellect isn't measured in ounces. Anyone with a kilogram of intellect would know that!

Facts are facts!

[ikorolev]

There are scenarios when lineal championship is worth less than ABC belts. Let's take a look at MW, for example. If shot Martinez fought his mandatory, Rubio, then Rubio would have become a lineal champ. Then, he could have lost to juiced Heiland. Nice lineal champs we would have had !

[Horse]

drop Floyd as well and we got something legit going on. Fighting Maidana twice for a P4P king is an embarrassment.

No.

[KBB]

I wonder if The Ring and Transnational will will do the same this week?

I bet that made you really happy. :!:

[expe]

Who did he win the lineal title against then?

Look, he's one of my favorite fighters, and I think he's probably the best fighter in the word today. But the whole "lineal" thing is pretty much just imaginary. You can't really "lose" something that's a matter of opinion.

The "lineal champion" isn't a matter of opinion.

Joe Calzaghe held the lineal super middleweight championship, but vacated it when he moved up to the 175lb division to face Bernard Hopkins.

Andre Ward subsequently captured the vacant mythical belt in 2011 when he defeated Carl Froch.

I have previously questioned the value of the so-called "lineal championship", which is frequently cited by the media and fight fans, but I was lambasted by many Boxrec forum members for doing so, despite listing multiple bizarre anomalies with the delegated champions that no one with an ounce of intellect could defend!

Anyway, facts are facts, so make your own mind up!

Of course it is. You said yourself the belt is mythical.

And who did Calzaghe win that lineal title against, again? Who cares who cites it? Again, Calzaghe was also one of my favorite fighters. But I can't think of a moment where he could say he completely cleaned up the division, or beat someone who had.

After he beat Kessler he'd cleaned up the division, there was no doubt at that stage who the best at super middleweight was, if it wasn't for the IBF trying to shove Stieglitz on him as a mandatory he'd have had all 4 belts at the time too.

[Cholo_cws]

"The Champion does not schedule a fight with a Top-5 contender from any weight class for two years."

This is the Ring's own ruling that Ward has fallen foul off. They have not enforced it so they're no better than the alphabets and can hardly criticize them.

(For the record, I don't agree with the ruling.)

[Freedom2013]

The fact that you posted this on the very same day that Ward was dropped because of inactivity only proves how you obsess over black fighters, especially American ones.

Why do you always need to bring race into every discussion?

I might obsess about boxing in general, but not about black fighters in particular.

You're the one who is "obsessed with black fighters, especially American ones" not me.

[Tarkus]

I wonder if The Ring and Transnational will will do the same this week?

Transitional has. Its unfortunate but its about the time. Since super 6 Ward has not done nothing notable in super middle.

[HyacinthusTurnipseed]

The difference between Vitali and Ward in this case is that at the 12 month mark since vs Charr most of us thought he would never fight again (as seems to be the case now) whereas most of us (most of us?) think Ward'll be back in the ring sooner or later. He's clearly the best super-middle in the world currently even if he isn't ranked #1 anymore, technically. Just as Vitali was clearly the second best heavyweight in the world at the end of 2013 even though he wasn't ranked.

If Ward doesn't come back and Froch retires, does that make Abraham #1 at 168? For whatever faults it had, the Super Six (and Froch crushing Bute straight afterwards) really established a solid hierarchy at the weight and it'd be a shame to see it all dismantled over a few months.

[Perseus]

There are scenarios when lineal championship is worth less than ABC belts. Let's take a look at MW, for example. If shot Martinez fought his mandatory, Rubio, then Rubio would have become a lineal champ. Then, he could have lost to juiced Heiland. Nice lineal champs we would have had !

Lineal doesn't mean "best", it's just the whole "man who beat the man" thing. A line that can be traced and nothing more.

I think the middleweight lineage might have the longest continuity at the moment??

How did Kellerman say it?
"Cotto beat Martinez who beat Pavlik who beat Taylor who beat Hopkins who beat everybody"
That line goes back to 2001.