Thoughts From Last Night

[koolkc107]

Crawford answered two questions for me last night.

1) Is he effective at the higher weight?

Absolutely. I don't know how much of a puncher he is going to turn out to be at 140 (or 147?) but it seems clear to me that he hits hard enough to get respect from anyone at jr. welter.

2) Is he elite?

I am going to say yes. To do what Crawford has done across weight classes and against some of the best out there, to beat high level competition so convincingly, yes he is elite. Some think he had a hard time last night. I am not among them. I saw a guy relaxed, who took his time and was NEVER in doubt as to how the fight would end. He was being cautious, and understandably so because of the move up. And, although he did not win every round, there was no doubt he was in control throughout.

The Provodnikov/Matthysse fight is frontrunner for FOTY, but neither guy is a slam dunk in the division

Both guys clearly have enough to put anyone to sleep.

But will that be enough against Garcia the second time around?

And yes, I know Lucas punched Peterson's lights out when they met, but how many think there isn't a good chance things might turn out a little different in a rematch given his showing against Swift?

For the record, I had Provodnikov winning 7-5, but a draw on one card or what happened on the other two (115-113 Lucas) makes complete sense and should to anyone who saw the fight.

It was close.

The silver lining for Lucas is that he did show some skill last night, not an easy thing to do against a guy like Provo.

But is that skill level going to be enough against a motivated Swift, a more cautious Peterson, or even the new kid on the block, Crawford, who might turn out to be better than all of them?

We'll see.

I don't think JCC jr is a complete joke, but he looked like one last night.

Short version? Jr has NO busines at 175. Especially if he continues to think he can prepare half-assed for big fights.

It is clear that he doesn't hit hard enough to phase the big guys.

And he doesn't work hard enough at his craft to outbox them.

Someone needs to tell Jr. that his name means something, that he cannot continue to embarrass what that name means to true fans of the sport.

Either he takes the sport seriously or he goes back to starving himself to make 160- at least at middleweight his flaws are a little less visible.

Ideally tho, he'd do both. Re-dedicate himself and get back in good enough shape to do 160.

It's the only chance I see him having of coming close to a legacy of his own.

And someone tell Jr that 170 is not a weight class...and if Fonfara obliged him and actually went down, he'd still kick Jr's ass.

[FloydtheDuck]

Neither guy a slam dunk?

Either guy gives Crawford trouble. matthysse more so

Matthysse barely lost to Garcia with his eye closed for the majority - and the knockdown in the ropes I thought was a joke as I found him trying to get out of the ropes while he was getting hit. Changed the round from 10-9 his to 10-8 Garcia
Which by the cards would have changed the fight. Garcia has looked worse than Lucas since their fight happened- so I don't see a rematch anything but 50/50

You had Ruslan winning? Is you last name lampley?

Giving him the Benefit of every close round at best it's a draw ( which lederman was doing. 2 of the rounds were far stretch on his card) and that barely made it a draw


The fight was 116-112 easy. HBO bias was in. Full effect

And yes JcCjr is a joke. Has always been one

Thinking he was winning and complaining about weight. Fully illustrates it
He quit. Bye bye

The weight was his only strength at middleweight

Fight versus Andy lee. He looked like a monster on fight night

[Trooper 1]

If the fight were to go 3 rounds more Provo would have won all 3 of them convincingly as the tide had changed....well that is if his eye lid stayed on his face, Provo is a tuff cookie!

[benion]

I thought Dulorme was putting in good work and winning by a round. Crawford did a good job of turning up the pressure in the 6th and showing he's the superior fighter. Crawford has always started a lil slow before turning it on but those overhand rights by Dilorme were easily finding a home. Good showing by Crawford tho. Needs too tighten a couple things up on the defensive end. I'll settle for one more tune up fight at 140 before he fights MMatthysse.

[klitoris]

Chavez Jr is a clown who quit from his stool. He actually said he thought he won the fight LOL. He should retire before he destroys the Chavez name more than he has already.

[ikorolev]

Junior keeps repeating that he was winning every round on twitter. He has brain damage. He may also lose many of his Mexican fans who hate quitters.

[caldo2025]

Can't disagree with any of those reflections from last night.

We saw two blue chip prospects fighting for the first time in a heavier weight class against quality opponents last night. One guy, clearly prepared and performed, paved the way for a prosperous future fighting superstars under the brightest lights. The other guy, will have a hard time showing his face in public again and will never be the same IMO.

I've had Bud Crawford in my top P4P list prior to the fight so I know how special he is and will be so I wasn't surprised he won the fight but I was VERY impressed that he did it with a KO. Dulorme is a really good fighter and has suffered from fatigue late in fight but never had chin issues. IMPRESSIVE.

I was excited to see Chavez Jr in the ring again and at a more comfortable weight. His struggles to make weight have really affected his performances thus far so I was all for the move up. I stopped being a Chavez Jr Fan in about the 3rd round. His complaining to the Ref inside the ring was pathetic. There, in front of our eyes, was all the evidence we needed to prove the rumors true about this guy. Here's a kid leading with his head, shoulder and elbow, hitting below the belt at least ten times, complaining non stop. Like a spoiled rich kid in a candy store. At one point he even demanded Fonfara adjust his trunks after he was warned for a 4TH time for low blow. We saw Chavez Jr between rounds paying no attention to Joe Goossen's directions and it gave you an idea what the 32day training camp must have been like. By the 5th round, I began yelling at the TV for Fonfara when I started the fight a Jr Fan.

When Fonfara landed that beautiful left hand that finally shut the little brat up, I couldn't help but think of the LARGE number of people jumping up and down at the sight of it like I was. The former trainers that Jr. threw out of camp and the sparring partners that he's treated like dirt were already set to sleep with a smile on their face when the career killer happened...CHAVEZ JR. QUITS ON HIS STOOL WITH THE WORLD LISTENING IN. No way anyone can dispute it or say it was misinterpreted, he quit. His post fight interview was just the cream on top as he not only thought he won the fight or was winning but demanded a rematch at a lower weight. What a tool this kid is and he's all done IMO.

Btw, I am not for fans throwing things into the ring but good job Stub Hub Center. There's a reason why it's the best fight spot in the world and it's because those intelligent fans out there do not stand for cowards in the ring. They don't show up to watch spoiled brats not finish a fight he committed to. Good Job West Coast fans.

[benion]

I've had Bud Crawford in my top P4P list prior to the fight so I know how special he is and will be so I wasn't surprised he won the fight but I was VERY impressed that he did it with a KO.

In no particular order
Wlad
Floyd
Pac
GGG
Bradley
Rigo
Gonzalez
Kovalev
Canelo
Stevenson
JMM

These are just a couple off the top of my head. Where is Bud on your list and who does he replace?

[Chepppaaa]

my thoughts are.

provodnikov - matthysse was a good fight, but could have been better, i was dissapointed

crawford will bring an good mix to light welterweight, with broner, provod, matt, rances and danny it is a good, but overrated division, because for me, no one of them is p4p top 10 material, even not terence

chavez jr against fonfara should never have been made. chavez is a middleweight, at best a super midd., he has 0,0 business against top level LH.

[ikorolev]

I've had Bud Crawford in my top P4P list prior to the fight so I know how special he is and will be so I wasn't surprised he won the fight but I was VERY impressed that he did it with a KO.

In no particular order
Wlad
Floyd
Pac
GGG
Bradley
Rigo
Gonzalez
Kovalev
Canelo
Stevenson
JMM

These are just a couple off the top of my head. Where is Bud on your list and who does he replace?

He deserves to replace Canelo, Bradley, Marquez and Stevenson.

[ikorolev]

We saw two blue chip prospects fighting for the first time in a heavier weight class against quality opponents last night. One guy, clearly prepared and performed, paved the way for a prosperous future fighting superstars under the brightest lights. The other guy, will have a hard time showing his face in public again and will never be the same IMO.

Junior is too spoiled to even blame himself or feel any shame. Compare him to Provo who gave himself all and was then apologizing to his fans that he let them down.

[caldo2025]

I've had Bud Crawford in my top P4P list prior to the fight so I know how special he is and will be so I wasn't surprised he won the fight but I was VERY impressed that he did it with a KO.

In no particular order
Wlad
Floyd
Pac
GGG
Bradley
Rigo
Gonzalez
Kovalev
Canelo
Stevenson
JMM

These are just a couple off the top of my head. Where is Bud on your list and who does he replace?

First off, i'd rip JMM, Stevenson, Canelo, Bradley, Rigo and Gonzalez off any P4P list because they don't belong near one. I'd also take Wlad off MY list but I can definitely see why people include him. I can't say that i've ever seen a P4P list that i've agreed with. They all seem to include people way past their prime or they give boxers credit for something they did many years ago (check ESPN's list if you want to chuckle).

Here's how Boxing's P4P List should be made:
I take an inventory of the current boxing scene as it appears this very minute, not 10 years ago, but this very second. I do not consider any Title Belts, past or present, into my decision . I then imagine that there are no weight classes and every Boxer is the same exact weight to the ounce (THIS is what P4P means). If everyone was on the same level playing field, I decide which boxers would be the toughest to beat this very second? Who are today's MOST dominant fighters in the ring with power, skill and technique? Are these guys fighting(or trying to fight) the best out there or avoiding them? They also have to have a crowd pleasing style that gives fans their money worth (PPV fighters already or will be). These boxers must be good for the sport and it's growth. So this list consists of the most courageous, skillful fighters today that are not only the most dominating inside the ring but do it in a fan friendly style that fans pay or will pay to see:

My P4P list
1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. GGG
3. Kovalev
4. Terrance Crawford
5. Keith Thurman

Honorable Mention: Wlad, Lomachenko, Andre Ward, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, David Lemieux, Nicholas Walters, Amir Khan, Kell Brook.

PS- The list is obvious subjective so there's always going to be disagreement but these are the five boxers that I feel, this very minute, are the most dominant boxers in the sport. These 5 boxers are great for the sport of Boxing and their performances this year will determine how the sport of Boxing does in 2015. And that's what this list should be about.

Thoughts?

[Boxing Prospect]

For what it's worth I though Afolabi Vs Ramirez and Salido Vs Martinez were better fights than the Provodnikov Vs Matthysse one....but we've had a trio of really good fights recently.

[Chepppaaa]

I've had Bud Crawford in my top P4P list prior to the fight so I know how special he is and will be so I wasn't surprised he won the fight but I was VERY impressed that he did it with a KO.

In no particular order
Wlad
Floyd
Pac
GGG
Bradley
Rigo
Gonzalez
Kovalev
Canelo
Stevenson
JMM

These are just a couple off the top of my head. Where is Bud on your list and who does he replace?

First off, i'd rip JMM, Stevenson, Canelo, Bradley, Rigo and Gonzalez off any P4P list because they don't belong near one. I'd also take Wlad off MY list but I can definitely see why people include him. I can't say that i've ever seen a P4P list that i've agreed with. They all seem to include people way past their prime or they give boxers credit for something they did many years ago (check ESPN's list if you want to chuckle).

Here's how Boxing's P4P List should be made:
I take an inventory of the current boxing scene as it appears this very minute, not 10 years ago, but this very second. I do not consider any Title Belts, past or present, into my decision . I then imagine that there are no weight classes and every Boxer is the same exact weight to the ounce (THIS is what P4P means). If everyone was on the same level playing field, I decide which boxers would be the toughest to beat this very second? Who are today's MOST dominant fighters in the ring with power, skill and technique? Are these guys fighting(or trying to fight) the best out there or avoiding them? They also have to have a crowd pleasing style that gives fans their money worth (PPV fighters already or will be). These boxers must be good for the sport and it's growth. So this list consists of the most courageous, skillful fighters today that are not only the most dominating inside the ring but do it in a fan friendly style that fans pay or will pay to see:

My P4P list
1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. GGG
3. Kovalev
4. Terrance Crawford
5. Keith Thurman

Honorable Mention: Wlad, Lomachenko, Andre Ward, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, David Lemieux, Nicholas Walters, Amir Khan, Kell Brook.

PS- The list is obvious subjective so there's always going to be disagreement but these are the five boxers that I feel, this very minute, are the most dominant boxers in the sport. These 5 boxers are great for the sport of Boxing and their performances this year will determine how the sport of Boxing does in 2015. And that's what this list should be about.

Thoughts?

honorable mention lemiaux and khan hahahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahaahaha

[koolkc107]

Neither guy a slam dunk?

Either guy gives Crawford trouble. matthysse more so

Matthysse barely lost to Garcia with his eye closed for the majority - and the knockdown in the ropes I thought was a joke as I found him trying to get out of the ropes while he was getting hit. Changed the round from 10-9 his to 10-8 Garcia
Which by the cards would have changed the fight. Garcia has looked worse than Lucas since their fight happened- so I don't see a rematch anything but 50/50

You had Ruslan winning? Is you last name lampley?

Giving him the Benefit of every close round at best it's a draw ( which lederman was doing. 2 of the rounds were far stretch on his card) and that barely made it a draw


The fight was 116-112 easy. HBO bias was in. Full effect

And yes JcCjr is a joke. Has always been one

Thinking he was winning and complaining about weight. Fully illustrates it
He quit. Bye bye

The weight was his only strength at middleweight

Fight versus Andy lee. He looked like a monster on fight night

I agree that Provo and Matthysse are not walkovers for Crawford.

But I think Bud handles either guy.

We disagree about Lucas/Swift. I saw it as not very close and definitely a boxing lesson.

And I thought Danny hurt him on several occasions. It was perhaps the best performance of his career.

I will admit that he hasn't looked quite as good since.

Yes, I had Ruslan winning. And my score was a one round difference to what the judges saw. I can live with that.

And it had nothing to do with any bias, it was a very close fight, with Provo more effective at what he was trying to do the last half of the fight than Matthysse was.

And yeah, I have no idea WTF Jr was talking about. It's like he has a reverse compubox in his head, counting huge punches he eats as being in his favor.

[Impractical Poster]

First off, i'd rip JMM, Stevenson, Canelo, Bradley, Rigo and Gonzalez off any P4P list because they don't belong near one.

My P4P list
1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. GGG
3. Kovalev
4. Terrance Crawford
5. Keith Thurman

Honorable Mention: Wlad, Lomachenko, Andre Ward, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, David Lemieux, Nicholas Walters, Amir Khan, Kell Brook.

PS- The list is obvious subjective so there's always going to be disagreement but these are the five boxers that I feel, this very minute, are the most dominant boxers in the sport. These 5 boxers are great for the sport of Boxing and their performances this year will determine how the sport of Boxing does in 2015. And that's what this list should be about.

Thoughts?

You don't think Gonzalez has accomplished more than GGG, Kovalev, Crawford, and Thurman? Gonzalez has been extremely dominate for quite some time now. He just hasn't gotten the exposure that these guys have, thus why I believe you don't rate him that high. However, that is all about to change as he will be introduced to the masses on the GGG card next month.

[caldo2025]

First off, i'd rip JMM, Stevenson, Canelo, Bradley, Rigo and Gonzalez off any P4P list because they don't belong near one.

My P4P list
1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. GGG
3. Kovalev
4. Terrance Crawford
5. Keith Thurman

Honorable Mention: Wlad, Lomachenko, Andre Ward, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, David Lemieux, Nicholas Walters, Amir Khan, Kell Brook.

PS- The list is obvious subjective so there's always going to be disagreement but these are the five boxers that I feel, this very minute, are the most dominant boxers in the sport. These 5 boxers are great for the sport of Boxing and their performances this year will determine how the sport of Boxing does in 2015. And that's what this list should be about.

Thoughts?

You don't think Gonzalez has accomplished more than GGG, Kovalev, Crawford, and Thurman? Gonzalez has been extremely dominate for quite some time now. He just hasn't gotten the exposure that these guys have, thus why I believe you don't rate him that high. However, that is all about to change as he will be introduced to the masses on the GGG card next month.

If your biggest accomplishment is finally getting on TV and its on an undercard than no, you don't belong on any P4P list yet. The people on my list are the people putting fans in seats and bringing to new fans to the sport because of their dominance in the ring with styles fans py to see. Gonzalez could never fight again and not many would care much.

[Boxing Prospect]

First off, i'd rip JMM, Stevenson, Canelo, Bradley, Rigo and Gonzalez off any P4P list because they don't belong near one.

My P4P list
1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. GGG
3. Kovalev
4. Terrance Crawford
5. Keith Thurman

Honorable Mention: Wlad, Lomachenko, Andre Ward, Danny Garcia, Mikey Garcia, David Lemieux, Nicholas Walters, Amir Khan, Kell Brook.

PS- The list is obvious subjective so there's always going to be disagreement but these are the five boxers that I feel, this very minute, are the most dominant boxers in the sport. These 5 boxers are great for the sport of Boxing and their performances this year will determine how the sport of Boxing does in 2015. And that's what this list should be about.

Thoughts?

You don't think Gonzalez has accomplished more than GGG, Kovalev, Crawford, and Thurman? Gonzalez has been extremely dominate for quite some time now. He just hasn't gotten the exposure that these guys have, thus why I believe you don't rate him that high. However, that is all about to change as he will be introduced to the masses on the GGG card next month.

If your biggest accomplishment is finally getting on TV and its on an undercard than no, you don't belong on any P4P list yet. The people on my list are the people putting fans in seats and bringing to new fans to the sport because of their dominance in the ring with styles fans py to see. Gonzalez could never fight again and not many would care much.

Gonzalez has been on TV multiple times, just not a regular feature on American TV. He's been putting fans in seats in Nicaragua, Japan and Mexico. He's brought fans in to the sport from his homeland where is widely regarded as their #2 all time.

But then again let's go back to pretending that things only matter if they happen in the US. Life is easier that way.

Oh btw Yamanka got 17,000,000 TV viewers the other day, I guess that sort of puts him at #3 or something, easily above Thurman at the very least.

[KBB]

Great fight for LM and Provo, it probably could've been scored either way but maybe the fact that Matthsye took the majority of the early rounds, cut Provo up and appeared not to be totally hurt by any of Ruslan's shots so that is likely what gave him the slight edge. Ruslan really needs someone to work on him regarding his defense, dude takes way too much punishment and has been getting cut or swollen up more in each bout.

The bruising that Provo receives in each bout will make him look like a bloody mess in future bouts, dude needs a serious education in the art of defense.

I'd love to see a rematch or either guy fight Crawford.

I love how Chavez got owned last night by Fonfara and I love how Fon showed much cohones in immediately calling out Adonis for a rematch, you gotta luv and respect that no matter if you like him or not.

Crawford showed mastery of his opponent although it took him a few rounds to unleash his fury, I was speaking to my wife (Puerto Rican) about what I was seeing in the fight because she was pulling for Dulorme (obviously both are PR) and I was telling her long before Jones and the rest of them mentioned that Crawford was measuring Dulorme and had already had him timed so it was a matter of time before he exploded on him.

Of course a woman doesn't always know much about boxing so her response was "yeah, yeah but your boy is getting beaten" and no sooner she said it what I had just told her happened. Talking about the ultimate "tee-hee-hee" moment, my wife was in shock. lol.

Crawford is the real deal and he is learning to become a master boxer, he is timing his opponents early, measuring them and he is even using his elbows to create space while always trying to control his opponent's head (master boxers do all these things). I still think he needs to work a little more on his defense but he showed great ability to avoid, dodge, duck or slip the big punches whenever he had to for the most part.

[kidbazooka1]

Matthysse beats Garcia who i believe has peaked.

Imo Matthysse is the uncrowned top dog at 140 especially after Dannys horrible performance two weeks ago.

Ruslan is still must see tv.

Crawford may be the top guy in a few yrs but i see him as a tough sell outside of his hometown.

[Datsue]

Gonzalez has been on TV multiple times, just not a regular feature on American TV. He's been putting fans in seats in Nicaragua, Japan and Mexico. He's brought fans in to the sport from his homeland where is widely regarded as their #2 all time.

But then again let's go back to pretending that things only matter if they happen in the US. Life is easier that way.

Oh btw Yamanka got 17,000,000 TV viewers the other day, I guess that sort of puts him at #3 or something, easily above Thurman at the very least.

Nicely put. It always astonishes me just how blinkered & ignorant you have to be to think, say, that Keith Thurman is some sort of dominant superstar, when as you said, someone like Yamanaka can draw seventeen million on TV.

Fvcking braindead jingoistic pudenda.

[Ian1973]

Gonzalez has been on TV multiple times, just not a regular feature on American TV. He's been putting fans in seats in Nicaragua, Japan and Mexico. He's brought fans in to the sport from his homeland where is widely regarded as their #2 all time.

But then again let's go back to pretending that things only matter if they happen in the US. Life is easier that way.

Oh btw Yamanka got 17,000,000 TV viewers the other day, I guess that sort of puts him at #3 or something, easily above Thurman at the very least.

Nicely put. It always astonishes me just how blinkered & ignorant you have to be to think, say, that Keith Thurman is some sort of dominant superstar, when as you said, someone like Yamanaka can draw seventeen million on TV.

Fvcking braindead jingoistic pudenda.

Lol. Don't hold back will you?

[Datsue]

Lol. Don't hold back will you?

I am incredibly self-effacing & non-combative, they're two of my best traits.

[Boxing Prospect]

Juiki Tatsuyoshi's got several million viewers on Yonimuri for his debut as well, though that's similar to the JCC effect with Jr

[ikorolev]

Matthysse beats Garcia who i believe has peaked.

Garcia is done at 140. Matthysse would have to face him at 147.