Bernard Hopkins: Historically, where does he belong?

[caldo2025]

Let me start by saying that I was never a big fan of Bernard Hopkins and his style. Early on, my rooting interests were always in the opposite corner when it came to watching his fights. I didn't care for his criminal past or his clinching filled low punch output in fights but in time, he won me over. The arch of his life's story is unlike anything we'll probably ever see in our lifetimes.

But where would you place Bhop in the greatest of all time discussion? Please not only consider what he did inside the ring for the sport of Boxing but also consider what he continues to do for it outside the ring as a promoter and part owner of Golden Boy. I personally think that he belongs in the top 25 list of greatest boxers of all time.

[Tony1244]

I do too. Great Middleweight. I'm not doing a scientific list right now, but top 25 all time and top 10 middleweight all time sounds about right.

[caldo2025]

I do too. Great Middleweight. I'm not doing a scientific list right now, but top 25 all time and top 10 middleweight all time sounds about right.

I agree with you, Tony. ATG rankings have always been difficult for me because I tend to slight the older boxers that I didn't have a chance to see or experience in favor for the boxers I've lived through and watched. But I'm able to squeeze Bhop in that top 25 while including some of these boxers from the past. Bhop has had some enormous victories.

[PredatorHayds]

He makes my top 10 post war middleweight list.

Very dominant reign as champion.

His legacy though will surely be how old he was when world champion. Absolute great achievement.

[Undefeated49-0]

Let me start by saying that I was never a big fan of Bernard Hopkins and his style. Early on, my rooting interests were always in the opposite corner when it came to watching his fights. I didn't care for his criminal past or his clinching filled low punch output in fights but in time, he won me over. The arch of his life's story is unlike anything we'll probably ever see in our lifetimes.

But where would you place Bhop in the greatest of all time discussion? Please not only consider what he did inside the ring for the sport of Boxing but also consider what he continues to do for it outside the ring as a promoter and part owner of Golden Boy. I personally think that he belongs in the top 25 list of greatest boxers of all time.

What does that have to do with what he achieved in the ring? Why not focus on the fact that he was a young man when he went in and came out to be quite a good role model becoming a legend and never going back?

Or just try and focus on your own topic in regards to "where does he belong"? He is arguably one of the greatest MW (maybe the greatest in some eyes) and is the fighter who captured the title being the oldest Champion.

The fact that he moved up and captured the LHW championship and even the Lineal Title should further bolster his status ahead of MMH imho (MMH never moved up and his best wins were against smaller men).

Historically it will prove unpopular to move him ahead of MMH or other MWs because many people dislike him for his "never lose to a whiteboy" comment (which is why most people dislike him).

He didn't always fight in the same fashion as he did when he got older, he was always more of a technician. I thought many of his fights were a lot more exciting than people try to label him with their title of being "boring".

He had many exciting fights but of course negative people only focus on those they dislike instead of looking at the better ones.

[stevedoc]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

[squiggy]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

[ImranSarwar]

Oh yeah! Amazing personality and accomplishment!

[ImranSarwar]

Let me start by saying that I was never a big fan of Bernard Hopkins and his style. Early on, my rooting interests were always in the opposite corner when it came to watching his fights. I didn't care for his criminal past or his clinching filled low punch output in fights but in time, he won me over. The arch of his life's story is unlike anything we'll probably ever see in our lifetimes.

But where would you place Bhop in the greatest of all time discussion? Please not only consider what he did inside the ring for the sport of Boxing but also consider what he continues to do for it outside the ring as a promoter and part owner of Golden Boy. I personally think that he belongs in the top 25 list of greatest boxers of all time.

What does that have to do with what he achieved in the ring? Why not focus on the fact that he was a young man when he went in and came out to be quite a good role model becoming a legend and never going back?

Or just try and focus on your own topic in regards to "where does he belong"? He is arguably one of the greatest MW (maybe the greatest in some eyes) and is the fighter who captured the title being the oldest Champion.

The fact that he moved up and captured the LHW championship and even the Lineal Title should further bolster his status ahead of MMH imho (MMH never moved up and his best wins were against smaller men).

Historically it will prove unpopular to move him ahead of MMH or other MWs because many people dislike him for his "never lose to a whiteboy" comment (which is why most people dislike him).

He didn't always fight in the same fashion as he did when he got older, he was always more of a technician. I thought many of his fights were a lot more exciting than people try to label him with their title of being "boring".

He had many exciting fights but of course negative people only focus on those they dislike instead of looking at the better ones.

Both of you are brilliant here, but....I don't get it the connection. The point of counter critisizum.

[ImranSarwar]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

Squiggy you are right.

[Baby Face Finster]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

A rematch with Roy Jones Jr. before Roy's skills started deteriorating. Also fights with Joe Calzaghe several years earlier than when they fought and a fight with James Toney at 168. Other than that there is no one. Bernard is a Top 15 all time middleweight in my book.

[Chepppaaa]

historically one of the most important boxers ever. no boxer ever looked as good in shape as he did at 50 years old.

p4p around top 25 ever, considering only his skills & athletiscm

historically around 15 ever, considering his record & what he achieved in boxing

[stevedoc]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

I'm saying that Hopkins never beat a top middle weight , I've heard that argument said about Chavez,calzaghe, Klitschko the same is true of Hopkins

[Chepppaaa]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

I'm saying that Hopkins never beat a top middle weight , I've heard that argument said about Chavez,calzaghe, Klitschko the same is true of Hopkins

so eubank and prime kessler push overs?

x beat ronald wright and kelly pavlik at super midd., sure no atg at sm, but good quailty opponents.

[stevedoc]

I'm not sure who else someone could even want B-Hop to have fought. Hacine Cherifi?

I'm saying that Hopkins never beat a top middle weight , I've heard that argument said about Chavez,calzaghe, Klitschko the same is true of Hopkins

so eubank and prime kessler push overs?

x beat ronald wright and kelly pavlik at super midd., sure no atg at sm, but good quailty opponents.

What has Kessler and Eubanks got to do with Hopkins?
And winky was 2 weights past his peak and the ghost was overrated

[Chepppaaa]

I'm saying that Hopkins never beat a top middle weight , I've heard that argument said about Chavez,calzaghe, Klitschko the same is true of Hopkins

so eubank and prime kessler push overs?

x beat ronald wright and kelly pavlik at super midd., sure no atg at sm, but good quailty opponents.

What has Kessler and Eubanks got to do with Hopkins?
And winky was 2 weights past his peak and the ghost was overrated

I've heard that argument said about Chavez,calzaghe, Klitschko the same is true of Hopkins

[stevedoc]

I really don't get what you're trying to get at I used calzaghe as an example of people saying they haven't beat an elite fighter which is often said about Joe, I think Kessler is better than anyone Hopkins beat ....

[MachoTime]

Let me start by saying that I was never a big fan of Bernard Hopkins and his style. Early on, my rooting interests were always in the opposite corner when it came to watching his fights. I didn't care for his criminal past or his clinching filled low punch output in fights but in time, he won me over. The arch of his life's story is unlike anything we'll probably ever see in our lifetimes.

But where would you place Bhop in the greatest of all time discussion? Please not only consider what he did inside the ring for the sport of Boxing but also consider what he continues to do for it outside the ring as a promoter and part owner of Golden Boy. I personally think that he belongs in the top 25 list of greatest boxers of all time.

What does that have to do with what he achieved in the ring? Why not focus on the fact that he was a young man when he went in and came out to be quite a good role model becoming a legend and never going back?

Or just try and focus on your own topic in regards to "where does he belong"? He is arguably one of the greatest MW (maybe the greatest in some eyes) and is the fighter who captured the title being the oldest Champion.

The fact that he moved up and captured the LHW championship and even the Lineal Title should further bolster his status ahead of MMH imho (MMH never moved up and his best wins were against smaller men).

Historically it will prove unpopular to move him ahead of MMH or other MWs because many people dislike him for his "never lose to a whiteboy" comment (which is why most people dislike him).

He didn't always fight in the same fashion as he did when he got older, he was always more of a technician. I thought many of his fights were a lot more exciting than people try to label him with their title of being "boring".

He had many exciting fights but of course negative people only focus on those they dislike instead of looking at the better ones.

About six months ago Hopkins was scheduled to be a guest on a Sport's Radio AM station. Don't recall which one actually. However the audience had a chance to vote to have him on the show. The audience voted against Hopkins. They didn't want to hear from him. So based on Hopkins comment directed at Calzaghe what your saying might have some truth to it. I don't know.

If it was as you say why people hate Hopkins do you blame the audience from not wanting to hear from him?

[Chepppaaa]

I really don't get what you're trying to get at I used calzaghe as an example of people saying they haven't beat an elite fighter which is often said about Joe, I think Kessler is better than anyone Hopkins beat ....

so you dont have same oppinion about cal, like others have?

hopkins beat no atg at super midd. yet, he was a hell of a fighter at that weight. some atg sm would have had a tough time with x, x beats collin, eubank, benn and ottke.

[caldo2025]

Let me start by saying that I was never a big fan of Bernard Hopkins and his style. Early on, my rooting interests were always in the opposite corner when it came to watching his fights. I didn't care for his criminal past or his clinching filled low punch output in fights but in time, he won me over. The arch of his life's story is unlike anything we'll probably ever see in our lifetimes.

But where would you place Bhop in the greatest of all time discussion? Please not only consider what he did inside the ring for the sport of Boxing but also consider what he continues to do for it outside the ring as a promoter and part owner of Golden Boy. I personally think that he belongs in the top 25 list of greatest boxers of all time.

What does that have to do with what he achieved in the ring? Why not focus on the fact that he was a young man when he went in and came out to be quite a good role model becoming a legend and never going back?

Or just try and focus on your own topic in regards to "where does he belong"? He is arguably one of the greatest MW (maybe the greatest in some eyes) and is the fighter who captured the title being the oldest Champion.

The fact that he moved up and captured the LHW championship and even the Lineal Title should further bolster his status ahead of MMH imho (MMH never moved up and his best wins were against smaller men).

Historically it will prove unpopular to move him ahead of MMH or other MWs because many people dislike him for his "never lose to a whiteboy" comment (which is why most people dislike him).

He didn't always fight in the same fashion as he did when he got older, he was always more of a technician. I thought many of his fights were a lot more exciting than people try to label him with their title of being "boring".

He had many exciting fights but of course negative people only focus on those they dislike instead of looking at the better ones.

Both of you are brilliant here, but....I don't get it the connection. The point of counter critisizum.

The problem with 49-0 is that he only reads the first few words of the post he's commenting on so he has no idea that my comment was a favorable discourse for Bhop. And of course, he has to work racism of some kind into this one as well. Somebody really needs to ban him again.

[Tanzio]

What does that have to do with what he achieved in the ring? Why not focus on the fact that he was a young man when he went in and came out to be quite a good role model becoming a legend and never going back?

Or just try and focus on your own topic in regards to "where does he belong"? He is arguably one of the greatest MW (maybe the greatest in some eyes) and is the fighter who captured the title being the oldest Champion.

The fact that he moved up and captured the LHW championship and even the Lineal Title should further bolster his status ahead of MMH imho (MMH never moved up and his best wins were against smaller men).

Historically it will prove unpopular to move him ahead of MMH or other MWs because many people dislike him for his "never lose to a whiteboy" comment (which is why most people dislike him).

He didn't always fight in the same fashion as he did when he got older, he was always more of a technician. I thought many of his fights were a lot more exciting than people try to label him with their title of being "boring".

He had many exciting fights but of course negative people only focus on those they dislike instead of looking at the better ones.

Both of you are brilliant here, but....I don't get it the connection. The point of counter critisizum.

The problem with 49-0 is that he only reads the first few words of the post he's commenting on so he has no idea that my comment was a favorable discourse for Bhop. And of course, he has to work racism of some kind into this one as well. Somebody really needs to ban him again.

I can't fault turB here. He brings up a pertinent aspect of the subject matter that you implored us not to ignore, BHop's activity related to boxing outside of the ring.

I pretty much agree with turB on this one.

[caldo2025]

Both of you are brilliant here, but....I don't get it the connection. The point of counter critisizum.

The problem with 49-0 is that he only reads the first few words of the post he's commenting on so he has no idea that my comment was a favorable discourse for Bhop. And of course, he has to work racism of some kind into this one as well. Somebody really needs to ban him again.

I can't fault turB here. He brings up a pertinent aspect of the subject matter that you implored us not to ignore, BHop's activity related to boxing outside of the ring.

I pretty much agree with turB on this one.

Well, that's not surprising. But my OP explains how Bhop won me over after preliminary disliking him for beating up old ladies and stealing their purses as he freely admits to doing. White, Brown or Purple, most reasonable people wouldn't be rooting for a guy like that initially. But he did his time and turned his life around and in time won me and most of boxing over with his actions in and outside the ring. Now I consider him one of the most important boxers in the last 20 years. And, I really feel like he's going to do more for boxing outside of the ring now. He's improved so much as a commentator and he and Golden Boy are trying to make the fights we all want to see and really seem to be the only ones doing it.

I didn't implore anyone to consider his past when considering his position in history. I merely gave reasoning behind my change of heart and why he ended up being one of my favorites. So maybe you both should read a little bit closer before commenting as we all seem to have the same opinion on the matter.

[Undefeated49-0]

as good as hopkins was i don't think he has one win over a top level middle weight or light heavy ,he made his name fighting old welterweights

I didn't realize that Tito, Joppy, Echols, Holmes weren't "TOP" MWs and that the same Tarver who had just KO'd Jones was not a TOP LHW.

The ignorance and hate is just dripping from this post.

[man]

p4p within ATG10 most difficult boxers to beat.

[jockpunk]

Unfortunately for Bhop he fought in an era where middleweight was not particularly strong. That said, he fought everyone he could have and dominated the division for years. He also had some decsions go against him that were somewhat questionable.

I rank him around 5th all time at MW. Maybe not top 25 p4p but he is up there. An all time great who would have held his own against the best in any era.