Is this boxing's worst era ever

[Luckybattles]

Can't say when I started following boxing but I must have been a kid. I started following religiously as a teen some 26 years ago now and I can't remember boxing ever being as bad as it is today. Every time I read the headlines on a major boxing site, I read about obscure names I can't even pronounce fighting for major titles. Fighters that have never been on US television and who's previous fights are somewhat difficult to find, even on YouTube. Seems like my only choice these days is to watch ggg and Canelo knock out bum after bum. Fights that were on every other week 20 years ago are now considered "dream fights." Has anyone seen a worse era

[Tony1244]

The fact that the center is Europe and not America cannot be denied. But people complain about the present in every era. And sometimes we glorify the past. I've re-watched some old fights and not every fight from the 60s or 70s was scintillating.

For example, Liston had a great jab but he certainly didn't put everyone away. In Ali's heyday of the 1960s he was certainly great but he did take a lot of rounds off. But we remember the good stuff.

[DrunkenBoxer]

Not sure. But I do think the heavyweight division was kinda dismal after lennox lewis retired for while and Wlad just beat up a lot of mediocre challengers. Now the HW division has some potential and depth.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Yes, by a country mile.

[Kalan]

TOP-30 HEAVYWEIGHTS TODAY...It's UNMATCHED for International Competition for ANY period in HISTORY.. Americans can CRY about it

1. Tyson Fury... 2. Anthony Joshua... 3. Luis Ortiz... 4. Deontay Wilder... 5. Wladimir Klitschko... 6. Alexander Povetkin... 7. David Haye... 8. Andy Ruiz... 9. Joseph Parker... 10. Charles Martin... 11. Bryant Jennings... 12. Erkan Teper... 13. Hughie Fury... 14. Kubrat Pulev... 15. Johann Duhaupas... 16. Ruslan Chagaev... 17. Bermane Stiverne... 18. Lucas Browne... 19. Malik Scott... 20. Carlos Takam... 21. Mike Perez... 22. Alexander Ustinov... 23. Dereck Chisora... 24. Christian Hammer... 25. Robert Helenius... 26. Steve Cunningham... 27. Artur Szpilka... 28. Arnold Gjergjaj... 29. Czar Glazkov... 30. Amir Mansour

A look at some of the PPPBBBLLLLLITT Heavyweight Title Challengers from the 1950’s, 60’s and 70’s...

Don Cockell... Roland LaStarza... Tommy Jackson... Tom McNeely... Pete Rademacher... Brian London... Henry Cooper... Alfredo Evangelista... Chuck Wepner... Jean Pierre Coopman... Leon Stinks... Terry Daniels... Dave Zyglewitz... Manuel Ramos... Ron Stander... Richard Dunn


Malik Scott (#19) would box all of those pathetic 50’s and 60’s challengers to death without even trying -- and probably not lose a round. Gee whiz, Scott is not even a puncher and he would stop a lot of those insidiously poor title challengers from earlier non-competitive eras.

[Butterbean]

greed and lack of respect for sportsmanship and boxing. people arent in this sport because they like it or try to make a livong. they are into it to get rich, not be champion of the world...

[littlepug]

USA has lost control that's all, its thriving worldwide

[Tony1244]

USA has lost control that's all, its thriving worldwide

I'm American and that's true, but there are still very good American boxers.

[Tony1244]

TOP-30 HEAVYWEIGHTS TODAY...It's UNMATCHED for International Competition for ANY period in HISTORY.. Americans can CRY about it

1. Tyson Fury... 2. Anthony Joshua... 3. Luis Ortiz... 4. Deontay Wilder... 5. Wladimir Klitschko... 6. Alexander Povetkin... 7. David Haye... 8. Andy Ruiz... 9. Joseph Parker... 10. Charles Martin... 11. Bryant Jennings... 12. Erkan Teper... 13. Hughie Fury... 14. Kubrat Pulev... 15. Johann Duhaupas... 16. Ruslan Chagaev... 17. Bermane Stiverne... 18. Lucas Browne... 19. Malik Scott... 20. Carlos Takam... 21. Mike Perez... 22. Alexander Ustinov... 23. Dereck Chisora... 24. Christian Hammer... 25. Robert Helenius... 26. Steve Cunningham... 27. Artur Szpilka... 28. Arnold Gjergjaj... 29. Czar Glazkov... 30. Amir Mansour

A look at some of the PPPBBBLLLLLITT Heavyweight Title Challengers from the 1950’s, 60’s and 70’s...

Don Cockell... Roland LaStarza... Tommy Jackson... Tom McNeely... Pete Rademacher... Brian London... Henry Cooper... Alfredo Evangelista... Chuck Wepner... Jean Pierre Coopman... Leon Stinks... Terry Daniels... Dave Zyglewitz... Manuel Ramos... Ron Stander... Richard Dunn


Malik Scott (#19) would box all of those pathetic 50’s and 60’s challengers to death without even trying -- and probably not lose a round. Gee whiz, Scott is not even a puncher and he would stop a lot of those insidiously poor title challengers from earlier non-competitive eras.

Not too much bias here. (sarcastic)

You skipped over Ron Lyle, Jimmy Young, Oscar Bonavena, Ken Norton, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Eddie Machen, Jerry Quarry, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, and a few others. LaStarza had a lot of talent. The others took a lot of research into HWs that weren't in the top echelon.

[Chepppaaa]

the era is good, only the big fights need to happen now

[littlepug]

USA has lost control that's all, its thriving worldwide

I'm American and that's true, but there are still very good American boxers.

Agree, wasn't having a go, just that you guys aren't casting the shadow you once were

[Smokin' Bert]

Regretfully, I believe this is the true nadir of professional boxing. With a few notable exceptions like Roman Gonzalez, GGG, and a few others, the talent pool is barren and the matchmaking is unconscionable.

I have been a die hard fan for over 40 years. Over those 40 years i have defended this continually decaying sport as if it were a member of my family. But, for the first time in my life I find myself not caring at all about most prime time matches.

[Luckybattles]

Regretfully, I believe this is the true nadir of professional boxing. With a few notable exceptions like Roman Gonzalez, GGG, and a few others, the talent pool is barren and the matchmaking is unconscionable.

I have been a die hard fan for over 40 years. Over those 40 years i have defended this continually decaying sport as if it were a member of my family. But, for the first time in my life I find myself not caring at all about most prime time matches.

Another factor is that young talented fighters don't want to fight each other on their way up to test themselves. Instead they focus on amassing a 32-0 record against poor opposition before looking at the easiest way to a title. A great example is Felix Verdejo. Why doesn't he fight Saul Rodriguez. Turns out Rodriguez handlers don't even want that fight. They want to wait till these 2 unproven talents become stars and try to make a big ppv event. How can boxing survive with like this ?

[greg]

... i don't like generalisations like "the best", "the worst"...it is what it is..my problem being that the top guys often avoid each other und don't fight as often as I would like them to...but then why should they?..the paychecks are good enough, so why bother?

[Counter-puncher]

Regretfully, I believe this is the true nadir of professional boxing. With a few notable exceptions like Roman Gonzalez, GGG, and a few others, the talent pool is barren and the matchmaking is unconscionable.
. But, for the first time in my life I find myself not caring at all about most prime time matches.

Thats the worst part, not even being able to get interest in so many matches, its fucken excruciating, great post.

[BitPlayer]

[quote="Luckybattles"]Every time I read the headlines on a major boxing site, I read about obscure names I can't even pronounce fighting for major titles.[world]
You know world titles mean they are contested by people no from the USA? There are some awful paper belts etc. it is a problem, but having more fighters from eastern Europe etc rather than just America adds credibility, it doesn't take it away.

[BitPlayer]

I am a somewhat negative person so here is the bad:

Some of these are a bit ambiguous, but I've tried to interpret them correctly.

1. Boxings #1 potential fight involves a retired fighter vs someone who has never boxed.

Yeah much better than Tyson Fury Vs Wilder.

2. The heavyweight championship is up for grabs soon and nobody is excited about that fight taking place.

Mostly because it's a rematch of an uncompetitive fight.

3. The last big fight that took place had one severely over rated fighter pitted against a fighter who only managed to maintain some name recognition by calling out fighters time and time again that did not want to stoop so low as to fight him.

There's beens lots of big fights recently.

4. A recent fight that people were excited about at heavyweight got cancelled when one fighter failed a bs drugtest and the otherone used it as an excuse to duck him.

Povetkin's had tested clean more than once before, so he must have been taking the stuff.

5. Boxingfans actually waited for a decade for a fight and then took part in hyping it up so the general public would watch it, the fight was simply unwatchable.

It wasn't the best but far from unwatchable, and lets not pretend that there hasn't been some masive let downs in the past.

Boxing is over, it reached its climax and anything from now on will only be downhill.

Because it's not like there's been multiple times where it's been better and worse.

[ElJefe]

I'm not really sure if it's the worst in terms of standard or not. The main difference imo is that less fighters take the risks they need to take to be considered "great" fighters. Too much emphasis on an undefeated record. Boxing would be in a better place if more fighters took a leaf out of Oscar or Holyfield's book. Nobody really cares if they lost a few fights, they're both legends because they fought everyone and have some huge wins.

If boxing stopped right now how many active fighters could say they had legendary careers? Excluding the older, semi-retired fighters (B-Hop, Roy, Floyd, Manny, JMM, Mosley etc) because their legacies weren't cemented in this era. After that, who is there? Wlad? Ward? Cotto? Gonzalez? I'm struggling.

Maybe it's just nostalgia, mismatches and keep busy fights aren't a new thing, but it definitely seems like something is missing in this era.

[diddy]

The talent is still good. It's just that most of the meaningful fights don't happen. It stopped being a sport years ago and is nothing more than a business pretending to be a sport to pry suckers from their hard earned cash. The only way to ever fix this is for people to stop buying PPVs entirely and learn how to stream for free on the Internet. Hit them in their pockets and you'll see things start to change real fast. But if people are gonna tune in to watch and pay to watch crap, crap is what you'll keep getting. If the fight doesn't mean anything - don't watch. And definitely don't pay for it. Don't give them their ratings and don't give them your cash and you will see dudes fly straight in no time. Until then, be happy with what you get. Which is basically nothing. Or 1 somewhat meaningful fight every few months. If you're lucky.

[jas80s]

The talent pool is perhaps not as deep as it once was as fewer people box to begin with. But, there is clearly talent out there.

Having said that, it's really bad now and, to me, at least one of the problems is worth a mention. To a greater degree than ever before, one fight can make a fighter enough money to retire. That is certainly not a terrible thing since, as a fan, I like fighters and want them to be rewarded for their effort. But, an insidious outgrowth of the money is that fighters (and their teams) are greatly encouraged to try to maneuver themselves into that big fight by managing the risk/reward choices well and that often means building a marketable brand, by winning and ideally by knocking guys out. Because boxing is a niche sport, who you knock out is not as improtant money wise as how you do it.

The fighters are fine, but sadly this is the era of PPV and potential 8 figure paydays....and it makes fan pleasing 50/50 fights between top fighters hard to put together, what exactly is in it for those fighters who are on the precipice of a major fight with a PPV star?? Once upon a time a belt brought enough prestige that a fight could be forced, but which one of the 27 world championship belts brings that now?? The only "championship belt" that exists now is money, and the way to the money is to keep winning and keep knocking guys out, who you beat matters....but, just a little.

Still, I'll watch, just won't expect much.

[sucracristo]

obscure names I can't even pronounce...never been on US television...difficult to find, even on YouTube.

lost me on not being able to pronounce names. not being able to pronounce a name is not
anyone else's fault and says nothing about the quality of an era. either they are good or they
aren't good whatever their names. pretty sure youtube has only been around for about 10
years so how can we say not finding someone on youtube makes a boxer worse than
another era (where youtube didn't exist). was it not MUCH harder to get video of boxers
in EVERY previous era? btw, ustream, vimeo, daily motion, and other similar sites have
fight vids on them. youtube is not the be all end all. the worst thing for me about the past
10 years is the 4 belts each with other belts under them that also sound like world titles.
even the biggest promoters are calling that wba title below their real title "world titles".
i don't see how it's worth it for any boxer to even pay the sanction fee for those fake belts.
i look back at the 80's with a sense of nostalgia, but when you actually go through the
top guys in EVERY division, you see strong and weak divisions in every era, and that sense
of temporal frustration and boredom is more a symptom of THIS ADD 5 minute attention
span era. there was always bullshit in boxing from the very beginning. there are good fights
almost every weekend going on around the world that you can stream on your tablet from
the beach. in the next decade, tv channels and media gatekeepers will become obsolete
and direct streaming will takeover. when that happens, i don't see these guys being able to
make decent paydays without direct interest from fans and sponsors, making the fights
people want to see. we are on the verge of a much more democratic meritocracy.

[Tony1244]

the era is good, only the big fights need to happen now

Good point. An era is only as good as its match ups.

[caldo2025]

Can't say when I started following boxing but I must have been a kid. I started following religiously as a teen some 26 years ago now and I can't remember boxing ever being as bad as it is today. Every time I read the headlines on a major boxing site, I read about obscure names I can't even pronounce fighting for major titles. Fighters that have never been on US television and who's previous fights are somewhat difficult to find, even on YouTube. Seems like my only choice these days is to watch ggg and Canelo knock out bum after bum. Fights that were on every other week 20 years ago are now considered "dream fights." Has anyone seen a worse era

Great subject and OP. I must be around the same age as you from the looks of your timeline above and I agree with you. We are in Boxings worst era but it's not because of the talent level. Talent wise? I think this era rules over any previous eras in terms of boxing talent up and down weight classes. The problem is that Floyd created s model that proved that boxers don't have to take beatings twice a year to make life changing money. It's all about promoting and risking the least amount personally for the most money possible.

The problem is the Floyds hit lightening in a bottle with this model. These other fighters are trying but it's falling flat and it's just a matter of time before we all just stop tuning in. Sad but it's just a fad in boxing and soon we will be back to business.

[Kalan]

TOP-30 HEAVYWEIGHTS TODAY...It's UNMATCHED for International Competition for ANY period in HISTORY.. Americans can CRY about it

1. Tyson Fury... 2. Anthony Joshua... 3. Luis Ortiz... 4. Deontay Wilder... 5. Wladimir Klitschko... 6. Alexander Povetkin... 7. David Haye... 8. Andy Ruiz... 9. Joseph Parker... 10. Charles Martin... 11. Bryant Jennings... 12. Erkan Teper... 13. Hughie Fury... 14. Kubrat Pulev... 15. Johann Duhaupas... 16. Ruslan Chagaev... 17. Bermane Stiverne... 18. Lucas Browne... 19. Malik Scott... 20. Carlos Takam... 21. Mike Perez... 22. Alexander Ustinov... 23. Dereck Chisora... 24. Christian Hammer... 25. Robert Helenius... 26. Steve Cunningham... 27. Artur Szpilka... 28. Arnold Gjergjaj... 29. Czar Glazkov... 30. Amir Mansour

A look at some of the PPPBBBLLLLLITT Heavyweight Title Challengers from the 1950’s, 60’s and 70’s...

Don Cockell... Roland LaStarza... Tommy Jackson... Tom McNeely... Pete Rademacher... Brian London... Henry Cooper... Alfredo Evangelista... Chuck Wepner... Jean Pierre Coopman... Leon Stinks... Terry Daniels... Dave Zyglewitz... Manuel Ramos... Ron Stander... Richard Dunn


Malik Scott (#19) would box all of those pathetic 50’s and 60’s challengers to death without even trying -- and probably not lose a round. Gee whiz, Scott is not even a puncher and he would stop a lot of those insidiously poor title challengers from earlier non-competitive eras.

You skipped over Ron Lyle, Jimmy Young, Oscar Bonavena, Ken Norton, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Eddie Machen, Jerry Quarry, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, and a few others. LaStarza had a lot of talent. The others took a lot of research into HWs that weren't in the top echelon.

I didn't skip over them. I was pointing out some of the terrible Heavyweights who got World Title fights in those weak eras... Lets look at your list: Ron Lyle was very slow, hittable, and unskilled. Lyle didn't become a pro boxer until he was 30.... Jimmy Young was 20-5-2 when he outboxed the hittable Foreman, who outweighed him by 16 pounds. Young was a feather hitter with no body attack. After he beat Foreman Young lost 3 of his next 4 fights, 2 of them to a cruiserweight who had 11 fights.... Bonavena was 5'11" X 203 when he fought Ali. He was the slowest and most ungainly Heavyweight ever.... Ken Norton was a poor defender and blooper puncher who was knocked out 4 times - including by a 188-pound neophyte with 12 wins before he upset Ali and shattered Ali's jaw. That loss convinced Ali to fight him.... Sonny Liston spent years in prison getting old. Floyd Patterson avoided him for many years.... When Patterson won the title he weighed 182. In his previous fight to that he weighed 178. Patterson was crushed by 215-pound Liston... Machen was avoided by Patterson in his prime, but was easily outboxed by Light Heavyweight Harold Johnson.... Jerry Quarry lost to an aging Eddie Machen and claimed he hated Boxing and hated to train.... Frazier was a walk-in left hooker who was 5'11" X 205 when he beat Ali. Frazier looked like a punching bag with ears when he fought the much bigger 6'3" X 217 hard punching George Foreman.... LaStarza was a cherry-picking, record padding light hitter with no talent. LaStarza refused to fight black contenders. He lost to cherry-picked neophyte Rocky Jones a couple fights before he got a title shot at Marciano.

[Tony1244]

TOP-30 HEAVYWEIGHTS TODAY...It's UNMATCHED for International Competition for ANY period in HISTORY.. Americans can CRY about it

1. Tyson Fury... 2. Anthony Joshua... 3. Luis Ortiz... 4. Deontay Wilder... 5. Wladimir Klitschko... 6. Alexander Povetkin... 7. David Haye... 8. Andy Ruiz... 9. Joseph Parker... 10. Charles Martin... 11. Bryant Jennings... 12. Erkan Teper... 13. Hughie Fury... 14. Kubrat Pulev... 15. Johann Duhaupas... 16. Ruslan Chagaev... 17. Bermane Stiverne... 18. Lucas Browne... 19. Malik Scott... 20. Carlos Takam... 21. Mike Perez... 22. Alexander Ustinov... 23. Dereck Chisora... 24. Christian Hammer... 25. Robert Helenius... 26. Steve Cunningham... 27. Artur Szpilka... 28. Arnold Gjergjaj... 29. Czar Glazkov... 30. Amir Mansour

A look at some of the PPPBBBLLLLLITT Heavyweight Title Challengers from the 1950’s, 60’s and 70’s...

Don Cockell... Roland LaStarza... Tommy Jackson... Tom McNeely... Pete Rademacher... Brian London... Henry Cooper... Alfredo Evangelista... Chuck Wepner... Jean Pierre Coopman... Leon Stinks... Terry Daniels... Dave Zyglewitz... Manuel Ramos... Ron Stander... Richard Dunn


Malik Scott (#19) would box all of those pathetic 50’s and 60’s challengers to death without even trying -- and probably not lose a round. Gee whiz, Scott is not even a puncher and he would stop a lot of those insidiously poor title challengers from earlier non-competitive eras.

You skipped over Ron Lyle, Jimmy Young, Oscar Bonavena, Ken Norton, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Eddie Machen, Jerry Quarry, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, and a few others. LaStarza had a lot of talent. The others took a lot of research into HWs that weren't in the top echelon.

I didn't skip over them. I was pointing out some of the terrible Heavyweights who got World Title fights in those weak eras... Lets look at your list: Ron Lyle was very slow, hittable, and unskilled. Lyle didn't become a pro boxer until he was 30.... Jimmy Young was 20-5-2 when he outboxed the hittable Foreman, who outweighed him by 16 pounds. Young was a feather hitter with no body attack. After he beat Foreman Young lost 3 of his next 4 fights, 2 of them to a cruiserweight who had 11 fights.... Bonavena was 5'11" X 203 when he fought Ali. He was the slowest and most ungainly Heavyweight ever.... Ken Norton was a poor defender and blooper puncher who was knocked out 4 times - including by a 188-pound neophyte with 12 wins before he upset Ali and shattered Ali's jaw. That loss convinced Ali to fight him.... Sonny Liston spent years in prison getting old. Floyd Patterson avoided him for many years.... When Patterson won the title he weighed 182. In his previous fight to that he weighed 178. Patterson was crushed by 215-pound Liston... Machen was avoided by Patterson in his prime, but was easily outboxed by Light Heavyweight Harold Johnson.... Jerry Quarry lost to an aging Eddie Machen and claimed he hated Boxing and hated to train.... Frazier was a walk-in left hooker who was 5'11" X 205 when he beat Ali. Frazier looked like a punching bag with ears when he fought the much bigger 6'3" X 217 hard punching George Foreman.... LaStarza was a cherry-picking, record padding light hitter with no talent. LaStarza refused to fight black contenders. He lost to cherry-picked neophyte Rocky Jones a couple fights before he got a title shot at Marciano.

You come up with all this yet somehow believe Chamberlain could have beaten Ali?