UFC now holds three of the top ten combat pay-per-views of all time

[Ruthless-RKO]

May 2, 2015
Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs. Manny Pacquiao - HBO/Showtime (4,600,000)

May 5, 2007
Oscar De La Hoya vs. Floyd Mayweather Jr. - HBO (2,400,000)

Sep 14, 2013
Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs. Canelo Álvarez - Showtime (2,200,000)

Jun 28, 1997
Evander Holyfield vs. Mike Tyson II – Showtime (1,990,000)

Jun 8, 2002
Lennox Lewis vs. Mike Tyson - HBO/Showtime (1,970,000)

Aug 20, 2016
UFC 202: Diaz vs. McGregor 2 (1,650,000)

Jul 11, 2009
UFC 100: Lesnar vs. Mir 2 (1,600,000)

Mar 5, 2016
UFC 196: McGregor vs. Diaz (1,600,000)

Nov 9, 1996
Mike Tyson vs. Evander Holyfield – Showtime (1,590,000)

Aug 19, 1995
Mike Tyson vs. Peter McNeeley – Showtime (1,550,000)

[Crease]

UFC now holds three of the top ten combat pay-per-views of all time

And I think that will grow and keep on happening. The one truly great thing about the UFC (not that I'm in to MMA that much) is that Dana White consistently promises to bring the best talent in the world to the UFC and forces them to fight each other, in the hopes of becoming the one true World Champion.

And, in my opinion he delivers this year in, year out... And they keep doing it...

Now compare that to boxing. We have four World Championships and Champions consistently refusing to fight each other and sometimes litigation and paperwork getting in the way, we need to put on the big fights to keep up with the growth of the UFC - or else we could be overtaken in the end and be a sport of the past.

[darkstar81]

There should be some mandatory version of the super six in every division every few years to determine the division champion

[lazboy]

Conor's gone for 8 months or longer. Rouseys gone, just gone for good. Who do they have now? We have AJ, Golovkin, Canelo and other prospects. Boxing Resurgence 2017.

[Impractical Poster]

Conor's gone for 8 months or longer. Rouseys gone, just gone for good. Who do they have now? We have AJ, Golovkin, Canelo and other prospects. Boxing Resurgence 2017.

Conor and Rousey are UFC's biggest sellers. They have plenty of other top fighters and potential stars. While you mentioned some good names, Canelo is the only real seller there. And it's not like he is extremely active. Other than Conor's current hiatus, he is much more active than Canelo.

People said similar things when Liddell and GSP retired. The best is yet to come for the UFC.

[tiny_acres]

Or you could make the headline
IT TAKES UFC's 3 best ppvs to top boxings number 1 ppv.


It's all perspective

[lazboy]

Conor's gone for 8 months or longer. Rouseys gone, just gone for good. Who do they have now? We have AJ, Golovkin, Canelo and other prospects. Boxing Resurgence 2017.

Conor and Rousey are UFC's biggest sellers. They have plenty of other top fighters and potential stars. While you mentioned some good names, Canelo is the only real seller there. And it's not like he is extremely active. Other than Conor's current hiatus, he is much more active than Canelo.

People said similar things when Liddell and GSP retired. The best is yet to come for the UFC.

I appreciate UFC's not going to die without them and there are rising starts, (who I personally don't know) but boxing has the bigger names that are active right now and names that are building in popularity (those I mentioned).

[Impractical Poster]

Conor's gone for 8 months or longer. Rouseys gone, just gone for good. Who do they have now? We have AJ, Golovkin, Canelo and other prospects. Boxing Resurgence 2017.

Conor and Rousey are UFC's biggest sellers. They have plenty of other top fighters and potential stars. While you mentioned some good names, Canelo is the only real seller there. And it's not like he is extremely active. Other than Conor's current hiatus, he is much more active than Canelo.

People said similar things when Liddell and GSP retired. The best is yet to come for the UFC.

I appreciate UFC's not going to die without them and there are rising starts, (who I personally don't know) but boxing has the bigger names that are active right now and names that are building in popularity (those I mentioned).

Conor is a bigger name than any active boxer.

[lazboy]

Conor and Rousey are UFC's biggest sellers. They have plenty of other top fighters and potential stars. While you mentioned some good names, Canelo is the only real seller there. And it's not like he is extremely active. Other than Conor's current hiatus, he is much more active than Canelo.

People said similar things when Liddell and GSP retired. The best is yet to come for the UFC.

I appreciate UFC's not going to die without them and there are rising starts, (who I personally don't know) but boxing has the bigger names that are active right now and names that are building in popularity (those I mentioned).

Conor is a bigger name than any active boxer.

Yea just read what I'm saying. Conor's off for 8 months or so. It's going to be a slow 8 months for them. Boxing has the bigger names active right now.

[Impractical Poster]

I appreciate UFC's not going to die without them and there are rising starts, (who I personally don't know) but boxing has the bigger names that are active right now and names that are building in popularity (those I mentioned).

Conor is a bigger name than any active boxer.

Yea just read what I'm saying. Conor's off for 8 months or so. It's going to be a slow 8 months for them. Boxing has the bigger names active right now.

Who cares about 8 months. That's a projected time frame anyhow. There are active boxers who fight with longer lay offs than that. I don't consider Conor an inactive fighter even if it is 8 months. He is not the only draw in the UFC. There are plenty of other fighters and match ups who will draw more than what boxing will be putting together within the next 8 months. Granted, the next month does look relatively dull, but not as common place as boxing has been lately. When was Canelo's last meaningful challenge? And when will his next one be? One thing for certain, it ain't 8 months apart.

[dirk2686]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.

He's a major star, but with Rousey now finished it seems that everything relating to the whole business side of the sport is centered around one man. If you look at the highest PPV buy rates in MMA in the history of the sport, there is a significant gap between 2009/10 (essentially Lesnar selling fights) and the emergence of McGregor. If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

[Crease]

There should be some mandatory version of the super six in every division every few years to determine the division champion

I'd love to see a return of The Super Six - bringing in the absolute best fighters of a weight division and forcing them to fight the other 5. It would be incredible.

[Crease]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.
If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

The UFC isn't going anywhere mate. And anyone who think that it's going to blow over overnight are just kidding themselves. The UFC is unapologetically on the march and it does bite in to boxing's income.

MMA will never replace boxing for me, I love our sport too much. But for the young fans - a lot of them are looking to the UFC and spending money.

[IKSRTFO]

Conor is a bigger name than any active boxer.

Yea just read what I'm saying. Conor's off for 8 months or so. It's going to be a slow 8 months for them. Boxing has the bigger names active right now.

Who cares about 8 months. That's a projected time frame anyhow. There are active boxers who fight with longer lay offs than that. I don't consider Conor an inactive fighter even if it is 8 months. He is not the only draw in the UFC. There are plenty of other fighters and match ups who will draw more than what boxing will be putting together within the next 8 months. Granted, the next month does look relatively dull, but not as common place as boxing has been lately. When was Canelo's last meaningful challenge? And when will his next one be? One thing for certain, it ain't 8 months apart.

Isn't Manny Pacquiao still active? Miguel Cotto? Pacquiao may not be as big a seller in the US anymore but disregarding his international numbers would be a mistake.

[Impractical Poster]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.

He's a major star, but with Rousey now finished it seems that everything relating to the whole business side of the sport is centered around one man. If you look at the highest PPV buy rates in MMA in the history of the sport, there is a significant gap between 2009/10 (essentially Lesnar selling fights) and the emergence of McGregor. If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

UFC 200 did not feature Rousey or McGregor and did significant numbers. Nunes is pretty much a star now. The stars will continue to emerge as others fall out. It's pretty consistent with the UFC. And the PPVs are becoming much more consistent than boxing within the past couple years. Boxing needs to do something to turn this around.

[Impractical Poster]

Yea just read what I'm saying. Conor's off for 8 months or so. It's going to be a slow 8 months for them. Boxing has the bigger names active right now.

Who cares about 8 months. That's a projected time frame anyhow. There are active boxers who fight with longer lay offs than that. I don't consider Conor an inactive fighter even if it is 8 months. He is not the only draw in the UFC. There are plenty of other fighters and match ups who will draw more than what boxing will be putting together within the next 8 months. Granted, the next month does look relatively dull, but not as common place as boxing has been lately. When was Canelo's last meaningful challenge? And when will his next one be? One thing for certain, it ain't 8 months apart.

Isn't Manny Pacquiao still active? Miguel Cotto? Pacquiao may not be as big a seller in the US anymore but disregarding his international numbers would be a mistake.

I figured Manny was pretty much done. If he fights again, sweet. What were his last PPV numbers? Cotto has been extremely inactive. But yeah, he is a draw for sure. Not sure how much longer he is in as well.

[IKSRTFO]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.

He's a major star, but with Rousey now finished it seems that everything relating to the whole business side of the sport is centered around one man. If you look at the highest PPV buy rates in MMA in the history of the sport, there is a significant gap between 2009/10 (essentially Lesnar selling fights) and the emergence of McGregor. If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

UFC 200 did not feature Rousey or McGregor and did significant numbers. Nunes is pretty much a star now. The stars will continue to emerge as others fall out. It's pretty consistent with the UFC. And the PPVs are becoming much more consistent than boxing within the past couple years. Boxing needs to do something to turn this around.

It does...but it often is overlooked that boxing is still HUGE outside of US. Especially in Conor's own home country. Boxing is rising in Eastern Europe and parts of Asia. I agree UFC still bigger and is run better but to think that boxing stars can't hold their own internationally is mostly and American view.

[IKSRTFO]

Who cares about 8 months. That's a projected time frame anyhow. There are active boxers who fight with longer lay offs than that. I don't consider Conor an inactive fighter even if it is 8 months. He is not the only draw in the UFC. There are plenty of other fighters and match ups who will draw more than what boxing will be putting together within the next 8 months. Granted, the next month does look relatively dull, but not as common place as boxing has been lately. When was Canelo's last meaningful challenge? And when will his next one be? One thing for certain, it ain't 8 months apart.

Isn't Manny Pacquiao still active? Miguel Cotto? Pacquiao may not be as big a seller in the US anymore but disregarding his international numbers would be a mistake.

I figured Manny was pretty much done. If he fights again, sweet. What were his last PPV numbers? Cotto has been extremely inactive. But yeah, he is a draw for sure. Not sure how much longer he is in as well.

PPV numbers vs tickets sold. He still can sell tickets and when you match him with Canelo, they're probably now similar in what they can generate based on the name level of opponents. Canelo vs Khan sold around 300K and Pacquiao could likely do better numbers in a fight with Khan.

[dirk2686]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.
If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

The UFC isn't going anywhere mate. And anyone who think that it's going to blow over overnight are just kidding themselves. The UFC is unapologetically on the march and it does bite in to boxing's income.

MMA will never replace boxing for me, I love our sport too much. But for the young fans - a lot of them are looking to the UFC and spending money.

Not sure I agree with all of this. MMA won't go anywhere - it's too embedded now for the whole thing to just die off, but with greater exposure comes more exposure to people who just don't like it. Ten years ago there was a myth that MMA would take over from boxing as an old man's game was found and replaced by something fresh and modern. It hasn't worked out that way, precisely because a lot of what people like about boxing (stand up fighting) isn't replicated by MMA all the time. Yes, I know it's skillful but that still doesn't make submissions, chokes and armlocks exciting for everyone, myself included.

Therefore, what we have now is an acceptance that both will continue to exist. In the UK, we have fighters like Anthony Joshua and Carl Froch who can sell out the national stadium to crowds not too far short of a hundred thousand. We also have our first UFC world champion, who would still largely go unrecognised.

And the reason I have referred to MMA is because UFC is just a brand, but it's one brand of many that has, in the minds of many, effectively become the sport. To a casual fan MMA is UFC. Now what happens when fighters want more money? What happens when a rival promotion offers the big names a big wage packet to join with someone else? A big selling point of MMA is that the big fights always, always happen. Not true is it? Brock v Fedor anyone?

And to go back to the point I was making, if MMA really was growing the way that some have suggested, surely we would have seen a bigger push since Lesnar left six or seven years back? Whilst I accept McGregor is legitimately massive, he's genuinely close to being a sole household name in a sport that hasn't pushed on in the way some claimed.

[jujigatame]

The UFC still needs stars like McGregor do to huge (1m+) PPV sales, but their baseline is much higher than boxing's now. A decent UFC card without any big stars will do around 300K buys. A decent boxing card without any big stars will do like 50K buys.

[Impractical Poster]

Looking at the stats relating to MMA suggests that the growth in relation to PPV sales without McGregor being factored in are fairly limited.

He's a major star, but with Rousey now finished it seems that everything relating to the whole business side of the sport is centered around one man. If you look at the highest PPV buy rates in MMA in the history of the sport, there is a significant gap between 2009/10 (essentially Lesnar selling fights) and the emergence of McGregor. If anything, it looks like the sport hasn't truly grown that significantly when you consider that of the top twenty events it has ever put on, half of them are seven years old or more.

UFC 200 did not feature Rousey or McGregor and did significant numbers. Nunes is pretty much a star now. The stars will continue to emerge as others fall out. It's pretty consistent with the UFC. And the PPVs are becoming much more consistent than boxing within the past couple years. Boxing needs to do something to turn this around.

It does...but it often is overlooked that boxing is still HUGE outside of US. Especially in Conor's own home country. Boxing is rising in Eastern Europe and parts of Asia. I agree UFC still bigger and is run better but to think that boxing stars can't hold their own internationally is mostly and American view.

I never said they can't. I was defending the UFC's success w/o Conor and Rousey. And that Conor is really not inactive. Rousey may not be done yet either. And there are other stars emerging.

[dirk2686]

The UFC still needs stars like McGregor do to huge (1m+) PPV sales, but their baseline is much higher than boxing's now. A decent UFC card without any big stars will do around 300K buys. A decent boxing card without any big stars will do like 50K buys.

Depends on how we're defining big stars in fairness. Rousey Correia and Jones Cormier did numbers pretty similar to Canelo Cotto and Pacquiao Bradley. Obviously McGregor does massive numbers but he's never getting close to Floyd numbers yet.

Plus we're looking at this hugely from a US-centric angle. Lets not forget that in the UK the last UFC event did 16k tickets - a fifth of what Froch Groves II did and almost certainly even less than what Joshua Wlad will do.

[Crease]

Now what happens when fighters want more money? What happens when a rival promotion offers the big names a big wage packet to join with someone else?

They can't. No-one offers mixed martial artists more money than the UFC. That's exactly why they are able to attract the best talent from lesser organisations. It really does all come down to MONEY. The UFC brings in the biggest stars of Strikeforce, Bellator, Cage Rage and Bamma - in much the same way that they bought over World Extreme Cagefighting and added all their best fighters.
The honest truth is, if you want to see the elite MMA guys in the world - they are at the UFC.

A quick example of this is Tom "Kong Watson" was very successful in Bamma, became a World Champion in that organization - was beating all sorts of boys in that organization and proved himself to be the clear Number One that they had.
So he was invited in to the UFC and he ended up losing something like 5 fights out 7 then he was released from the UFC and returned to fighting in the lesser organisations and trying to fight his way back up again.
And you hear stories like this all the time about guys who look good, then go to the UFC and struggle against the top tier of competition.

A big selling point of MMA is that the big fights always, always happen. Not true is it? Brock v Fedor anyone?

That's true and even before that the UFC negotiating team were busting their chops to sign a Fedor vas Randy Couture fight. The truth is Fedor wanted MILLIONS of pounds before even stepping in to the ring with any UFC Heavyweight, he completely priced himself out of fighting in the organization.
Yet then was willing to fight in lesser organisations for less money. It was definitely a strange one.

To be fair, I think that Fedor and Cris Cyborg are the two names that the UFC have missed out on. But looking at that from a 20 year standpoint...
That's actually a pretty good record.

[jujigatame]

The UFC still needs stars like McGregor do to huge (1m+) PPV sales, but their baseline is much higher than boxing's now. A decent UFC card without any big stars will do around 300K buys. A decent boxing card without any big stars will do like 50K buys.

Depends on how we're defining big stars in fairness. Rousey Correia and Jones Cormier did numbers pretty similar to Canelo Cotto and Pacquiao Bradley. Obviously McGregor does massive numbers but he's never getting close to Floyd numbers yet.

Plus we're looking at this hugely from a US-centric angle. Lets not forget that in the UK the last UFC event did 16k tickets - a fifth of what Froch Groves II did and almost certainly even less than what Joshua Wlad will do.

Yes, I'm certainly not denying that boxing is still a far more global sport. The PPV market is a largely American thing.

Canelo and Cotto are 2 of the biggest stars in boxing. Meanwhile Crawford is a P4P elite, and his fight with the best challenger in his division did 55k buys. Mighty Mouse vs. Fringe Contender does twice that.

[dirk2686]

I know nobody offers MMA fighters more money than the UFC, but you can't deny there are major issues about just how much money is being offered to MMA fighters across the board. There has been plenty of discontent from fighters feeling they are not being paid what they believe they should be. My point is for all the harmonious talk of unification fights under one umbrella organisation, all it takes is one very wealthy backer to set up a rival, wave some money and tempt some of the bigger names away, and then you'll have the same old problems that happened in the days of UFC/Bellator fighters not meeting.

In the last year several big names, including the biggest of them all in the shape of McGregor but also GSP, Couture, Velasquez and others, have voiced concerns about finances within the organisation. It was bought for billions not too long ago and at 205 Alvarez was paid about half a million dollars. That doesn't seem right.