Is Adonis Stevenson being criticised unfairly by fight fans?

[Enlightened-One]

Earlier on today, the WBC published a highly-detailed chronological background of all the facts that have led to the current status of the light heavyweight division, which appears to vindicate Adonis Stevenson for his inability to perform a mandatory defence of his world title for the last 4½ years.

Here’s a summary of the key events that have enabled Adonis Stevenson to continually engage in voluntary defences:

• Jean Pascal and Sergey Kovalev both withdrew from their mandatory challenger position, so they rejected a guaranteed opportunity face Adonis Stevenson.

• Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all withdrawn from final eliminators.

• Eleider Alvarez defeated Jean Pascal, Isaac Chilemba and Lucian Bute in final eliminators, rejected an opportunity to engage in a fourth so-called "final eliminator" and also agreed to step-aside twice.

FFS! What can the WBC do? How can they strip Adonis Stevenson of his WBC world title when the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all rejected opportunities to challenge for their world championship?

Thoughts?

[jamamb]

hes been unfairly criticized for years.

kovslevs side blatantly ducked going ahead with a fight, yet that gets almost totally ignired while ppl go on about stevenson being a chicken. alvarez doesnt seem to really want the fight at all either. maybe not so confident? i assume living near each other theyve probably sparred and may know what each other brings....

if stevenson werent pbc he wouldnt get nearly the same negativity for his career. but ppl love to hate on non euro haymon fighters

[Enlightened-One]

hes been unfairly criticized for years.

kovslevs side blatantly ducked going ahead with a fight, yet that gets almost totally ignired while ppl go on about stevenson being a chicken. alvarez doesnt seem to really want the fight at all either. maybe not so confident? i assume living near each other theyve probably sparred and may know what each other brings....

if stevenson werent pbc he wouldnt get nearly the same negativity for his career. but ppl love to hate on non euro haymon fighters

I suspect that this thread won’t receive many comments from those that have previously criticised Adonis Stevenson, since the objective truths of the situation do not adhere to their preferred perception of reality, coupled with the fact that they are clearly powerless to refute any of the WBC’s factually-accurate chronological sequence of events.

For sure, everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts, but this doesn’t prevent certain intellectually-challenged individuals from ignoring any sort of evidence that contradicts and undermines their existing beliefs and theories!

[Tomasino]

Who has Adonis actually fought? I think that answers all questions posed here.

[Enlightened-One]

Who has Adonis actually fought? I think that answers all questions posed here.

This is a strawman debating tactic. Create another thread if you want to discuss a completely separate topic, such as the quality of his resume.

This thread is about Stevenson’s inability to engage in mandatory defences of his WBC world title and he should not be held personally accountable if the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez all refuse to exploit opportunities to challenge for his belt.

For instance: Main Events withdrew Sullivan Barrera and Sergey Kovalev from purse bids that were ordered by the WBC. Are they completely blameless or is this purely Adonis' fault... or do you not want to discuss this, because the truth makes you feel uncomfortable, as it forces you to concede a real-world fact that doesn't adhere to your preferred narrative?

[Tomasino]

Uncomfortable

[Enlightened-One]

Earlier on today, the WBC published a highly-detailed chronological background of all the facts that have led to the current status of the light heavyweight division, which appears to vindicate Adonis Stevenson for his inability to perform a mandatory defence of his world title for the last 4½ years.

Here’s a summary of the key events that have enabled Adonis Stevenson to continually engage in voluntary defences:

• Jean Pascal and Sergey Kovalev both withdrew from their mandatory challenger position, so they rejected a guaranteed opportunity face Adonis Stevenson.

• Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all withdrawn from final eliminators.

• Eleider Alvarez defeated Jean Pascal, Isaac Chilemba and Lucian Bute in final eliminators, rejected an opportunity to engage in a fourth so-called "final eliminator" and also agreed to step-aside twice.

FFS! What can the WBC do? How can they strip Adonis Stevenson of his WBC world title when the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all rejected opportunities to challenge for their world championship?

Thoughts?

[greg]

...I guess WBC made its case clear..with 5 to 6 names being involved, why would anyone underline the name of Kovalev twice? ..any hidden agenda that we should be aware of?

[Enlightened-One]

...I guess WBC made its case clear..with 5 to 6 names being involved, why would anyone underline the name of Kovalev twice? ..any hidden agenda that we should be aware of?

The “hidden agenda” relates to the point about Sergey Kovalev declining a guaranteed opportunity to face Adonis Stevenson, when he refused to participate in the WBC’s purse bid, shortly after Kathy Duva had aggressively lobbied the WBC to make Krusher their mandatory challenger, which they did almost immediately.

An awful lot of Sergey Kovalev’s fans either choose to ignore this fact or they pretend I’m lying.

So I thought it was pertinent to provide the WBC’s own take on this situation, as it highlights a double-standard that people refuse to concede.

The very same people that lavish a great deal of unconditional praise upon Kovalev, also aggressively attack Stevenson continuously, whilst conveniently forgetting the rather simple fact that Sergey actually refused to fight Adonis.

Basically, the fighter garnering the most praise and respect from fight fans actually refused to face the most ridiculed boxer in the 175lbs division... and it seems that they choose to conveniently ignore this fact!

[Roars Like Me]

Nope

[Heretic]

Who has Adonis actually fought? I think that answers all questions posed here.

This is a strawman debating tactic. Create another thread if you want to discuss a completely separate topic, such as the quality of his resume.

This thread is about Stevenson’s inability to engage in mandatory defences of his WBC world title.

No this topic is quite literally about the question "is Adonis Stevenson being criticised unfairly by fight fans?"

And the answer is... No it is not unfair to criticise guy who has been "champion" for long long time for not fighting against anyone relevant.

If you can find a way to squirm out of the fights against mandatory opponents then you could go for a unification bout. Or at least take on someone on your own level. No need to go for bum of the month run

[Enlightened-One]

Who has Adonis actually fought? I think that answers all questions posed here.

This is a strawman debating tactic. Create another thread if you want to discuss a completely separate topic, such as the quality of his resume.

This thread is about Stevenson’s inability to engage in mandatory defences of his WBC world title.

No this topic is quite literally about the question "is Adonis Stevenson being criticised unfairly by fight fans?"

And the answer is... No it is not unfair to criticise guy who has been "champion" for long long time for not fighting against anyone relevant.

If you can find a way to squirm out of the fights against mandatory opponents then you could go for a unification bout. Or at least take on someone on your own level. No need to go for bum of the month run

As I've already previously stated twice on this thread, why should the WBC strip Adonis Stevenson of his world title when the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all rejected opportunities to challenge for his belt?

Adonis Stevenson was not involved in the vast majority of these situations, so he cannot be deemed solely responsible for some of these fights not materialising, since it takes two to tango.

Are you ignoring this, since you’ve refrained from commenting on any of these specific situations, because your sweeping generalisations don’t accurately reflect reality?

Here's a gentle reminder that summarises the key events that have enabled Adonis Stevenson to continually engage in voluntary defences:

• Jean Pascal and Sergey Kovalev both withdrew from their mandatory challenger position, so they rejected a guaranteed opportunity face Adonis Stevenson.

• Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all withdrawn from final eliminators.

• Eleider Alvarez defeated Jean Pascal, Isaac Chilemba and Lucian Bute in final eliminators, rejected an opportunity to engage in a fourth so-called "final eliminator" and also agreed to step-aside twice.

I’m not suggesting that Adonis Stevenson should be deemed immune to criticism, but I am saying that the severity of the ridicule he’s received has been unfair and usually expressed by people that are utterly clueless about the facts.

[Heretic]

This is a strawman debating tactic. Create another thread if you want to discuss a completely separate topic, such as the quality of his resume.

This thread is about Stevenson’s inability to engage in mandatory defences of his WBC world title.

No this topic is quite literally about the question "is Adonis Stevenson being criticised unfairly by fight fans?"

And the answer is... No it is not unfair to criticise guy who has been "champion" for long long time for not fighting against anyone relevant.

If you can find a way to squirm out of the fights against mandatory opponents then you could go for a unification bout. Or at least take on someone on your own level. No need to go for bum of the month run

As I've already previously stated twice on this thread, why should the WBC strip Adonis Stevenson of his world title when the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all rejected opportunities to challenge for his belt?

Adonis Stevenson was not involved in the vast majority of these situations, so he cannot be deemed solely responsible for some of these fights not materialising, since it takes two to tango.

Are you ignoring this, since you’ve refrained from commenting on any of these specific situations, because your sweeping generalisations don’t accurately reflect reality?

Here's a gentle reminder that summarises the key events that have enabled Adonis Stevenson to continually engage in voluntary defences:

• Jean Pascal and Sergey Kovalev both withdrew from their mandatory challenger position, so they rejected a guaranteed opportunity face Adonis Stevenson.

• Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all withdrawn from final eliminators.

• Eleider Alvarez defeated Jean Pascal, Isaac Chilemba and Lucian Bute in final eliminators, rejected an opportunity to engage in a fourth so-called "final eliminator" and also agreed to step-aside twice.

No. What I am saying is... Adonis is taking shit for not fighting anyone. And very rightfully so.

Boxing would be lot better if there was some actual boxing going on. Best fighting the best as it should be.

Instead we have this cherry picking, protecting fighters and beating up taxi drivers.

Fans deserve better and they rightfully demand it.

Or are you saying it would have been impossible for Adonis to found one decent opponent in the last 4 and half years?

[Enlightened-One]

No this topic is quite literally about the question "is Adonis Stevenson being criticised unfairly by fight fans?"

And the answer is... No it is not unfair to criticise guy who has been "champion" for long long time for not fighting against anyone relevant.

If you can find a way to squirm out of the fights against mandatory opponents then you could go for a unification bout. Or at least take on someone on your own level. No need to go for bum of the month run

As I've already previously stated twice on this thread, why should the WBC strip Adonis Stevenson of his world title when the likes of Jean Pascal, Sergey Kovalev, Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all rejected opportunities to challenge for his belt?

Adonis Stevenson was not involved in the vast majority of these situations, so he cannot be deemed solely responsible for some of these fights not materialising, since it takes two to tango.

Are you ignoring this, since you’ve refrained from commenting on any of these specific situations, because your sweeping generalisations don’t accurately reflect reality?

Here's a gentle reminder that summarises the key events that have enabled Adonis Stevenson to continually engage in voluntary defences:

• Jean Pascal and Sergey Kovalev both withdrew from their mandatory challenger position, so they rejected a guaranteed opportunity face Adonis Stevenson.

• Marcus Browne, Sullivan Barrera, Andrzej Fonfara and Eleider Alvarez have all withdrawn from final eliminators.

• Eleider Alvarez defeated Jean Pascal, Isaac Chilemba and Lucian Bute in final eliminators, rejected an opportunity to engage in a fourth so-called "final eliminator" and also agreed to step-aside twice.

No. What I am saying is... Adonis is taking poo for not fighting anyone. And very rightfully so.

Boxing would be lot better if there was some actual boxing going on. Best fighting the best as it should be.

Instead we have this cherry picking, protecting fighters and beating up taxi drivers.

Fans deserve better and they rightfully demand it.

Or are you saying it would have been impossible for Adonis to found one decent opponent in the last 4 and half years?

Is he solely responsible for Sergey Kovalev refraining from participating in the WBC's purse bid? What about the other guys I've mentioned?

Is it Adonis Stevenson’s fault that Sergey Kovalev and Andre Ward had exclusive contracts with HBO (with that network usually refraining from working with Showtime)? Alternatively, is it his fault that Bernard Hopkins took the Kovalev fight instead of facing him on Showtime, due to GBP’s desire to get Kathy Duva to drop her lawsuit against them?

It doesn’t seem as though you’re willing to consider the possibility that he’s not solely responsible for the situation he’s in, since you won’t discuss the actions of other fighters that declined to exploit opportunities to face him and it takes two to tango.

Do you approve of Adonis Stevenson's next opponent, Badou Jack?

Like I said before, Adonis Stevenson deserves to receive a certain amount of criticism, but the severity of the ridicule he’s received has been unfair and usually expressed by people that are utterly clueless about the facts.

[SenorPipino]

Yeah, I always wonder why so many badmouth and hate Superman.

All he does is win.

Of course so many had the same negative reactions to another light heavy champ who recently retired.

All he ever did was win too. Must be a trend. Or jealousy.

[boxing_rocks]

Yeah, I always wonder why so many badmouth and hate Superman.

All he does is win.

Of course so many had the same negative reactions to another light heavy champ who recently retired.

All he ever did was win too. Must be a trend. Or jealousy.

All he does is ducks and cherry picks. Stevenson and Wilder are Haymon identical twins who get what they deserve.

[Stuarty]

No. Criticism of Stevenson is more than merited.

[jewboypgh]

Stevenson aint a real fighter. He's ducked Kovalev for years. He aint really faced no one. He's got power but its easy to look good against all these bums.

[KiwiRider]

I have two beefs with Adonis Stevenson.
1, He doesn't fight often enough, once a year for a champion dosent cut it for me.
2, His level of opponent is too low in his voluntary defences, and he has not had a mandatory for too long.

I know there have been problems on all sides, not just Stevensons'. I've read the timeline etc.
But one fight a year, and Fonfara twice?
Not good enough. If your a champion, fight your mandatory once a year like your supposed to, and do your voluntary fights as well as your obligations and not instead of them. I'm over Stevenson, the sooner he hands over his belt, or gets beaten, the better..

[Lackeos]

The criticism of his matchmaking has been largely unfair, as it has been good, but not great. If Gvozdyk, Bivol, or Beterbiev had Stevenson's record, then said fighter's nuthuggers would act like he was the second coming of Jesus. Like, if you combine Gvozdyk's, Bivol's, and Beterbiev's resume into a single uber-resume, then their best opponents had boxrec ratings of 156, 151, 135, and 134. Whereas Stevenson's best opponents had boxrec ratings of 488, 267, 236, 224, 195, 181, and 162. No contest; Stevenson easily trumps 3 of the hypiest hype trains in the division combined.

As far as ability, Stevenson has further been judged unfairly. But people do not sell his ability as far short as they do his matchmaking. Although, at age 40, he's probably about to start going downhill soon, he is more or less the rightful #1 fighter in the division, and the Slavic-biased fans usually don't even mention his name when they're discussing good fighters in the division. It's pretty weird to skip over the #1 guy and go straight to naming people who are ranked #10, 15, or 20.

[jamamb]

agree wth most of that but sergey certainly has a very good argument for still beng above hm. sergeys far far more proven than the other 3 east euros lets be honest. ill rate a super close lose to a great such as ward over stoppages of guys such as thomas wllams and tommy arpency and i cant see why that shouldnt be the case . adons has been unfaurly crtczed but hs opposton has defnetly dropped off over last few years. not all his fault though as hes been avoided.

The criticism of his matchmaking has been largely unfair, as it has been good, but not great. If Gvozdyk, Bivol, or Beterbiev had Stevenson's record, then said fighter's nuthuggers would act like he was the second coming of Jesus. Like, if you combine Gvozdyk's, Bivol's, and Beterbiev's resume into a single uber-resume, then their best opponents had boxrec ratings of 156, 151, 135, and 134. Whereas Stevenson's best opponents had boxrec ratings of 488, 267, 236, 224, 195, 181, and 162. No contest; Stevenson easily trumps 3 of the hypiest hype trains in the division combined.

As far as ability, Stevenson has further been judged unfairly. But people do not sell his ability as far short as they do his matchmaking. Although, at age 40, he's probably about to start going downhill soon, he is more or less the rightful #1 fighter in the division, and the Slavic-biased fans usually don't even mention his name when they're discussing good fighters in the division. It's pretty weird to skip over the #1 guy and go straight to naming people who are ranked #10, 15, or 20.

[marvelous marv]

Criticism is justified. He avoids fighters that are able to fight him with no political issues for no reason in particular.

Under Haymon advisement Haymon makes the final decision but the fighter and his team have a say in the direction they want to go in.

Alvarez is and are Browne are angry and want a shot this year.

[Kalan]

WBC published a highly-detailed chronological background of all the facts

THEIR facts... Which are totally BS...

Chickenson's team made it so it was impossible for these guys to get a fight with him and get compensated fairly.... They KNEW the fights couldn't happen.... Chicken only wanted to fight super weak challengers which is what happened... HIs list of title opponents is the most ridiculous anybody has ever seen -- enabling Al Haymon to continue getting his cut like clockwork... If Chicken fought anyone good he'd be knocked out again... He's a piece of dung.

[caldo2025]

The same idiots rapid firing boring OP's about the same stuff. Then they cry about no one putting comments well here's one. Unplug your computer for a a little while and give us all a break.

[Enlightened-One]

WBC published a highly-detailed chronological background of all the facts

THEIR facts... Which are totally BS...

Chickenson's team made it so it was impossible for these guys to get a fight with him and get compensated fairly.... They KNEW the fights couldn't happen.... Chicken only wanted to fight super weak challengers which is what happened... HIs list of title opponents is the most ridiculous anybody has ever seen -- enabling Al Haymon to continue getting his cut like clockwork... If Chicken fought anyone good he'd be knocked out again... He's a piece of dung.

Can you please review each bullet-pointed claim articulated by the WBC in their factually-correct chronological list of events and provide some evidence of their inaccuracy, because I can’t?

Issuing sweeping statements, such as the WBC’s list of events “are totally BS”, isn’t something that you should convey if you’re unable to support this stance with your own set of irrefutable facts, so I hope you’re able to substantiate your claim.