Frampton vs the Mcguigans

[Yes We Can]

I don't know how to add photos on here but just been reading about this saga in an article.

It was long suggested that Barry and Co. Were taking more than there fair share but it often got dismissed that they went above and beyond looking out for Carl. Carl has now stated he wasn't paid in good time for the quigg fight and also alleges Barry and his wife were using business accounts for personal expenses. Added to that they also had Carl's parents transfer money from ticket sales into Barry's own private account. It seems the final straw was when the taxman rocked up at Carl's door over a near 400k unpaid vat bill.

Will wait until the final hearing before making to many comments but was there to much smoke?

[BigRed]

http://www.irish-boxing.com/carl-frampt ... sed-trust/

[Counter-puncher]

. Carl has now stated he wasn't paid in good time for the quigg fight and also alleges Barry and his wife were using business accounts for personal expenses. Added to that they also had Carl's parents transfer money from ticket sales into Barry's own private account. It seems the final straw was when the taxman rocked up at Carl's door over a near 400k unpaid vat bill.

All of the above are easy to prove or disprove and of the four separate charges three are likely to be pretty damaging in terms of the way Cyclone was run. Using business accounts for private expenditure would be fine as long as the expenditure was counted as a personal drawing, I'm guessing it may not have been if it's appearing in this context. I'm not sure how this affects the breach of contract issue though- Carl proved by these and similar allegations that he had cause
to break the contract as his interests were not being properly represented? The VATman door stepping someone for £400k shows there were serious issues if true but I thought Frampton was a director of Cyclone himself? I can't imagine the VATman doorstepping him otherwise.

[Counter-puncher]

Ah ok just read the link, Frampton saying withheld earnings therefore Cyclone breached the contract I suppose

[Yes We Can]

http://www.irish-boxing.com/carl-frampt ... sed-trust/

Thank you!

[Yes We Can]

Ah ok just read the link, Frampton saying withheld earnings therefore Cyclone breached the contract I suppose

Sorry I'm a technologically dim.

How damaging will this be for cyclone long term? They have Taylor obviously but is all there stock in him reaching world level?

[Counter-puncher]

Ah ok just read the link, Frampton saying withheld earnings therefore Cyclone breached the contract I suppose

Sorry I'm a technologically dim.

How damaging will this be for cyclone long term?

Well if the allegations are true, with what they suggest about how the company has been run, you'd imagine they may struggle to get any other fighters to join, and Taylor will leave as soon as either his contract allows or a decent lawyer can extricate him from said contract. I'd imagine Taylor's manager may be making contact with whoever is advising Frampton legally speaking? Unless of course Taylor is managed by Mcguigan as well, IIRC the Mcguigans were wearing manager and promoter hats for Frampton, same with Taylor?

[Counter-puncher]

I'd love to know a lot more about the financial background. Hopefully as more details come out someone like Loynesy- actually not someone *like*him, him- can clear some of the legal ramifications up.

[Yes We Can]

Ah ok just read the link, Frampton saying withheld earnings therefore Cyclone breached the contract I suppose

Sorry I'm a technologically dim.

How damaging will this be for cyclone long term?

Well if the allegations are true, with what they suggest about how the company has been run, you'd imagine they may struggle to get any other fighters to join, and Taylor will leave as soon as either his contract allows or a decent lawyer can extricate him from said contract. I'd imagine Taylor's manager may be making contact with whoever is advising Frampton legally speaking? Unless of course Taylor is managed by Mcguigan as well, IIRC the Mcguigans were wearing manager and promoter hats for Frampton, same with Taylor?

Yeah they had the monopoly on Frampton though I'm unsure on Taylor, either way my guess is he is making contingency plans for whenever his contract expires.

The shame is they guided his career perfectly, couldn't have done any better really.

[Coco]

There are other well known promoters and managers who have got themselves bad reputations for non payment etc.
Nevertheless if they have tv deals and can give their fighters opportunities they can still push forward.
Essentially if McGuican still has a tv deal, he will be ok

[lillywhite14]

Old Barry is a slippery bastard. He was, and possibly still is, business partners with a local bloke to me.

Dodgy as fvck the pair of them

[TopGun]

Old Barry is a slippery bastard. He was, and possibly still is, business partners with a local bloke to me.

Dodgy as fvck the pair of them

Go on, say more on the bloke you know about....

[bripez]

Barry cant really complain - Frampton only did to him what he did to Barney Eastwood 25 years ago.

Boxers don't mind giving a % when they don't earn much, but as soon as the big purses come along they don't like it and fook off their old trainers/managers/promoters and pay family members instead - just like Naz, Hatton etc.

Interestingly in all the above cases, it ended in tears as it turned out that their brother didn't know as much as their previous trainer/manager/promoter and they ended up losing their titles.

[mickey1975]

Barry cant really complain - Frampton only did to him what he did to Barney Eastwood 25 years ago.

Boxers don't mind giving a % when they don't earn much, but as soon as the big purses come along they don't like it and fook off their old trainers/managers/promoters and pay family members instead - just like Naz, Hatton etc.

Interestingly in all the above cases, it ended in tears as it turned out that their brother didn't know as much as their previous trainer/manager/promoter and they ended up losing their titles.

It didn't end up doing Naz harm financially.

[Coco]

Barry cant really complain - Frampton only did to him what he did to Barney Eastwood 25 years ago.

Boxers don't mind giving a % when they don't earn much, but as soon as the big purses come along they don't like it and fook off their old trainers/managers/promoters and pay family members instead - just like Naz, Hatton etc.

Interestingly in all the above cases, it ended in tears as it turned out that their brother didn't know as much as their previous trainer/manager/promoter and they ended up losing their titles.

It didn't end up doing Naz harm financially.

And Hatton made big bucks too

[Sklar]

Falling out with your family is crap irrespective of how much money you’ve got. Way better to fall out with someone who isn’t blood.

[whiskey]

I don't think you need to be a rocket surgeon to deduce that an entire family paying themselves wages off the back of one fighter was always going to end badly. Whether it was 100% justified or not.

Unless I'm mistaken, was Barry, his wife, his daughter, his two sons all on the Cyclone wage bill in one capacity or another ?

Money really does dig out whether a person is legit or not. Whether the issue was Barry, Carl or both of them - the culprit is always money at the end of the day.

[JamieM]

The only mcguigan I liked was Jake. Really clued up guy who was respectful. The rest I found very strange. Blain I think enjoyed the marching powder and his job seemed to be to go in the ring and be the name on the books. He was an ignorant idiot we were running late for press confrence and he was on phone argueing, needless to say we just banged him on speaker and had a good laugh at him.

I amnt sold on Shane as a trainer after the haye fight and worry when trainers can be dictated to by a fighter.

I also worry that Barry is the big name in the family and he refuses to be the main figure in it preferring to fade in the background. Why ?

I hope they keep it together for Josh cause that boy is special and is going to bring big time boxing to Scotland. Although I do see him signing we hearn when his deal runs out. In regards to training Terry McCormack is the man behind Josh not Shane.

[bripez]

Barry cant really complain - Frampton only did to him what he did to Barney Eastwood 25 years ago.

Boxers don't mind giving a % when they don't earn much, but as soon as the big purses come along they don't like it and fook off their old trainers/managers/promoters and pay family members instead - just like Naz, Hatton etc.

Interestingly in all the above cases, it ended in tears as it turned out that their brother didn't know as much as their previous trainer/manager/promoter and they ended up losing their titles.

It didn't end up doing Naz harm financially.

And Hatton made big bucks too

So you think that Naz and Hatton jibbing their established teams and employing family members worked out for them?

[mickey1975]

Financially, yes. Less so for Rick because his dad was pocketing half of it. Definitely for Hamed. His brother was investing in property constantly for him.

[dalcumly]

I don't see anything wrong with a business employing family members in crucial roles. MP's do exactly the same. It usually means they can trust one another, at least that's how most families work. There are exceptions obviously.
I don't go for the Josh Taylor leaving scenario. Is there any evidence he's unhappy with the current arrangements? His career has been managed well up until now.
I'm no expert but when a top flight amateur turns professional they go on to what is virtually a wage. Expenses are paid by the manager and these can be considerable. Towards the third year of the contract it's hoped that the big fights are starting to appear and this is when the manager and trainer take their 25% and 10% cut from the purses. Difficulties sometimes emerge when the boxer realises that the 'considerable' expenses come off the top before the percentages are taken. But they've got to realise that the manager has to recover the outlay. The three year point is crucial because that is when the manager/boxer contract is up for renewal.
My own guess is that Taylor will stay with Cyclone.

[JimJim2009]

I don't see anything wrong with a business employing family members in crucial roles. MP's do exactly the same.


I'm veering off topic here but my issue with the above - for MPs - is they preside over a myriad of employment laws preventing companies from hiring who they like - it has to the "the best candidate" and our country is drowning in equality legislation which makes hiring anyone a minefield. At the same time, MPs routinely hire their own spouses. Dispicable double standards.

Nowt to do with the McGuigans but its something I find appalling. If an MP needs an office manager or whatever, they should have to jump through the same red tape as the people they preside over and make laws for.

[jameswilson]

I can remember a lot on here around the time of the Quigg fight making out like there was no possible issue that could come from the relationship and no issue with the promoter also being the manager. They have a close relationship and he's guided him for a long time etc.

[Oiky]

See when people mess you about with money and try an be sly an greedy with it its time to f*ck them off and put them going

Best thing for Carl to not put up with that sh*t

[watsupdoc87]

The only mcguigan I liked was Jake. Really clued up guy who was respectful. The rest I found very strange. Blain I think enjoyed the marching powder and his job seemed to be to go in the ring and be the name on the books. He was an ignorant idiot we were running late for press confrence and he was on phone argueing, needless to say we just banged him on speaker and had a good laugh at him.

I amnt sold on Shane as a trainer after the haye fight and worry when trainers can be dictated to by a fighter.

I also worry that Barry is the big name in the family and he refuses to be the main figure in it preferring to fade in the background. Why ?

I hope they keep it together for Josh cause that boy is special and is going to bring big time boxing to Scotland. Although I do see him signing we hearn when his deal runs out. In regards to training Terry McCormack is the man behind Josh not Shane.

Hey, how's the training going for Frampton upcoming fight? Do you think he will stop donair or out outbox him over 12? I'm hoping a nice ko to start off a big year for the little man. Then ko that whingebag santa cruz. Good luck