Joe Frazier vs Denis Lebedev

[Cojimar 1946]

How do people see this one going?

[Kalan]

Frazier would make a good Cruiserweight... He weighed in at 204 or 205 at his best... and he was a bit chubby.

But I wouldn't do that fight... I'd rather see him versus the James Toney who beat Holyfield at Heavyweight.

He loses that one by brutal one-sided decision.

[Tony1244]

Frazier would make a good Cruiserweight... He weighed in at 204 or 205 at his best... and he was a bit chubby.

But I wouldn't do that fight... I'd rather see him versus the James Toney who beat Holyfield at Heavyweight.

He loses that one by brutal one-sided decision.

[BoxBuzz]

I had proposed this fight, and thought it to be at least competitive as a hypothetical. I still do. However the idea that Toney is a slam dunk to win seems odd to me. The best I had the courage to propose was that these guys would likely be standing at fights end. But almost everyone thought that Toney's guts would be pulped.

I favor Frazier in a good fight.........Most think it's no contest and Frazier obliterates James, ..you think Toney wins in a walk?


That's diversity!

Let's all embrace it
!

[Kalan]

I had proposed this fight, and thought it to be at least competitive as a hypothetical. I still do. However the idea that Toney is a slam dunk to win seems odd to me. The best I had the courage to propose was that these guys would likely be standing at fights end. But almost everyone thought that Toney's guts would be pulped.

You know doubt thought Joe Frazier was going to beat George Foreman as well... He was a big favorite right???

Holyfield was noted to be a good body puncher.... But it was HIS guts that were pulped... NOBODY ever pulped Toney's

Toney was one of the greatest defenders ever and never stopped... Frazier was super hittable and got murdered.

[Tony1244]

You can't compare Foreman's power to James Toney's. Toney had a lot of talent, no doubt, but Frazier would beat Toney easier than he beat Mathis. Remember Mathis was much bigger than Toney and also massively talented. Frazier would also walk thru Lebedev,

[Kalan]

Mathis wasn't massively talented -- and he wasn't very bright... Buster wasn't dedicated and let his weight fluctuate from 220 (he was still fat at 220) to 280.. He was VERY fat for Frazier and Joe just beat on his fat until he couldn’t take it.

Toney was also very lax with his training -- but unlike Mathis he was super talented and one of the greatest defenders of all time -- when he was in shape to fight like he was for Holyfield at only 217.. At 250 he looked ridiculous.. But he was a solid Heavyweight for Evander, and as he said “UNDESTRUCTABLE” meaning he could take it.. When Frazier weighed 214 for Foreman he was so fat that it jiggled like Jello every time he was knocked down.... Joe was so easy to hit it was laughable.

[gilgamesh]

Well since I like to respond to thread titles, and not the weird road that threads sometimes veer off on I'm gonna answer the Frazier vs Lebedev question.

Joe was notoriously a slow starter, so I wouldn't be too shocked if Denis took the first round or two, but I figure Joe would quickly prove to be too powerful and too strong for Lebedev. Breaking him down with heavy hooks to the head and body if not just knocking him flat outright.

I figure Frazier would win by KO between the 4th and 6th against Lebedev and it'd start getting pretty damn rough for Denis by the end of the 3rd.

[gilgamesh]

Mathis wasn't massively talented -- and he wasn't very bright... Buster wasn't dedicated and let his weight fluctuate from 220 (he was still fat at 220) to 280.. He was VERY fat for Frazier and Joe just beat on his fat until he couldn’t take it.

Toney was also very lax with his training -- but unlike Mathis he was super talented and one of the greatest defenders of all time -- when he was in shape to fight like he was for Holyfield at only 217.. At 250 he looked ridiculous.. But he was a solid Heavyweight for Evander, and as he said “UNDESTRUCTABLE” meaning he could take it.. When Frazier weighed 214 for Foreman he was so fat that it jiggled like Jello every time he was knocked down.... Joe was so easy to hit it was laughable.

Newsflash: Fighters age!

How a Boxing fan can be completely unable to grasp the concept that fighters get older and don't forever retain their skills is insane to me, but you always point out victories that guys have over older fighters as if it's indicative that they're simply better than said fighter. No. That's not reality and that's not how it works. A man in his late 30's or early 40's is not the same fighter he was in his Prime. He's just not. I'm not trying to insult you Kalan or drag this down into the mud I'm just pointing this out to you for the 60th time.

The Evander Holyfield that Toney beat was not a Prime Evander Holyfield. Prime Evander Holyfield defeats James Toney by Unanimous Decision or late TKO 10 times out of 10 at Heavyweight.

Frazier beats Toney 10 times out of 10 as well. I LOVE James Toney, and he's an all time great fighter. He's not however an All Time Great Heavyweight.

Toney was a slick counter puncher, but he always picked his shots, and while he'd certainly find the opportunity to land good, clean punches on Frazier, I can't imagine that Frazier wouldn't land more...and heavier blows. Knowing that Toney is the more skillful of the two Joe would be using his greater size an strength to be hammering away at Toney's body early, and I think by the 4th he'd be outworking Toney and winning the rounds handily.

Toney was always tough as granite so Joe may not stop him, but he'd win a Unanimous Decision and it wouldn't be close or controversial in the slightest.

[SenorPipino]

Lebedev? Lebedev?

Joe Frazier vs Denis Lebedev?

It makes Frazier vs Terry Daniels sound like a scintillating matchup.

[Kalan]

Right... Just like they thought George Foreman would be a walk in the park for Joe.