Ranking B-Level heavyweights of the 90s

[James9753]

With fighters like Tyson, Holyfield, Bowe (albeit a short reign) and Lewis being the dominant forces of heavyweight boxing in the 90s, I wanted to know your opinions on the levels of those fighters just that tier below.

Between Frank Bruno, Buster Douglas, Oliver McCall, Razor Ruddock, Ray Mercer and Tommy Morrison; where do you rank these fighters in order and why?

Also, as an interesting side question, how does the 'Big George' Foreman that battled Holyfield, Briggs and Moorer in the 90s, stack up against 'Big Daddy' Bowe in a fantasy match up too?

[DrDuke]

1. Michael Moorer - 3-time World champ, once unified, biggest win - Holyfield.
2. Oliver McCall - defeated Lewis for the major belt, defended vs Holmes. Lewis win was kinda lucky, but still he did it. Holmes was old, but still the big name. Also stopped Seldon. So McCall is here.
3. Frank Bruno - took major belt away from McCall.
4. Ray Mercer - WBO champ, defeated rising Morrison, troubled Lewis, close win of Witherspoon, close loss to Holyfield.
5. Tommy Morrison - WBO champ, defeated former and future World champion Foreman, knocked out Carl Williams, Ruddock, old Pinklon Thomas.
6. George Foreman - had some good scraps against tough dudes, not without some controversies, captured a major belt vs Moorer, made history by proving that old fukks can win World championships.
7. Donovan Ruddock - never was a champion, but started the 90s with KTFO of Dokes, was at the top in the early 90s, gave Tyson 2 tough fights.
8. Andrew Golota - never was a champion, but beat Bowe up twice blowing the fights with being DQed, when Bowe was arguably the best guy there. Had decent scalps of Corey Sanders, old Witherspoon.
9. Buster Douglas - yes, he outclassed and knocked out Tyson, but that's was in the 1990, in the next fight he lost the belts, then won some journeymen, then retired, he wasn't a big name on the 90s scene overall, that's why he's so low in my rating.
10. Shannon Briggs - arguably won Foreman, rocked Lewis before being KTFOed, still something.
11. Larry Holmes - outclassed Mercer, unseccessfully challenged major belts twice.
12. Bruce Seldon - captured major belt against old Tucker.
13. David Tua - never was a champion, but stopped Ruiz, Izon, Maskaev, Rahman (actually sounds fukking awesome, but they were prospects).
14. Tim Witherspoon - was an aging former champ from the 80s, still won Carl Williams, Jorge Luis Gonzalez, arguably lost to Mercer.
15. Herbie Hide - biggest win was past prime Tucker, captured WBO belt twice though.
16. Michael Grant - had some decent scalps with the biggest one of Golota.
17. Henry Akinwande - had the scalps of Schulz, Tucker, Norris, possessed WBO belt.
18. Ike Ibeabuchi - scalps of Byrd, Tua..
19. Axel Schulz - had 3 close title fight losses.
20. Vitali Klitschko - made a statement late on the scene knocking out Hide for WBO belt.

Some other guys, who've been aroung the top: Tony Tucker, Oleg Maskayev, Chris Byrd, Corrie Sanders, Hasim Rahman, Bert Cooper.

[ElJefe]

Good era for B level heavyweights. We're nearing the end of the 2010's. Imagine some of the names that would sit at 15-20 of a B-level list of this decade!

[Boxing Writer]

1. Michael Moorer - 3-time World champ, once unified, biggest win - Holyfield.
2. Oliver McCall - defeated Lewis for the major belt, defended vs Holmes. Lewis win was kinda lucky, but still he did it. Holmes was old, but still the big name. Also stopped Seldon. So McCall is here.
3. Frank Bruno - took major belt away from McCall.
4. Ray Mercer - WBO champ, defeated rising Morrison, troubled Lewis, close win of Witherspoon, close loss to Holyfield.
5. Tommy Morrison - WBO champ, defeated former and future World champion Foreman, knocked out Carl Williams, Ruddock, old Pinklon Thomas.
6. George Foreman - had some good scraps against tough dudes, not without some controversies, captured a major belt vs Moorer, made history by proving that old fukks can win World championships.
7. Donovan Ruddock - never was a champion, but started the 90s with KTFO of Dokes, was at the top in the early 90s, gave Tyson 2 tough fights.
8. Andrew Golota - never was a champion, but beat Bowe up twice blowing the fights with being DQed, when Bowe was arguably the best guy there. Had decent scalps of Corey Sanders, old Witherspoon.
9. Buster Douglas - yes, he outclassed and knocked out Tyson, but that's was in the 1990, in the next fight he lost the belts, then won some journeymen, then retired, he wasn't a big name on the 90s scene overall, that's why he's so low in my rating.
10. Shannon Briggs - arguably won Foreman, rocked Lewis before being KTFOed, still something.
11. Larry Holmes - outclassed Mercer, unseccessfully challenged major belts twice.
12. Bruce Seldon - captured major belt against old Tucker.
13. David Tua - never was a champion, but stopped Ruiz, Izon, Maskaev, Rahman (actually sounds fukking awesome, but they were prospects).
14. Tim Witherspoon - was an aging former champ from the 80s, still won Carl Williams, Jorge Luis Gonzalez, arguably lost to Mercer.
15. Herbie Hide - biggest win was past prime Tucker, captured WBO belt twice though.
16. Michael Grant - had some decent scalps with the biggest one of Golota.
17. Henry Akinwande - had the scalps of Schulz, Tucker, Norris, possessed WBO belt.
18. Ike Ibeabuchi - scalps of Byrd, Tua..
19. Axel Schulz - had 3 close title fight losses.
20. Vitali Klitschko - made a statement late on the scene knocking out Hide for WBO belt.

Some other guys, who've been aroung the top: Tony Tucker, Oleg Maskayev, Chris Byrd, Corrie Sanders, Hasim Rahman, Bert Cooper.

I would call it an awful ranking, but as far as I understand you are not taking into consideration anything that happened before January 1, 1990 and after December 31, 1999, right? Because Douglas, who beat McCall, should have been ranked higher than Oliver if it wasn't the case.

But I still completely disagree with some places on your list.

1) Holmes clear-cut win over prime undefeated Ray Mercer easily is much bigger achievement than Briggs' highly questionable winn over 49-years-old Gearrge Foreman. And yes, Briggs rocked Lewis, but still lost by TKO in 5, while Holmes went the distance against Holyfield and arguably beat Oliver McCall (i had it a draw 114-114).

2) Grant can't be ranked ahead of Ibeabuchi. Byrd and Tua are better scalps than anyone in Grant's resume, and against Golota Grant was battered from pillar to post and barely survived the firts round.

[scorpio83]

I wonder if "The Boogieman" Jesse Ferguson and "Smokin" Bert Cooper are C-level heavyweights, but they were both spoilers and dangerous in the 90s as well. What is your opinion?

[DrDuke]

as far as I understand you are not taking into consideration anything that happened before January 1, 1990 and after December 31, 1999, right?

Sure. With counting the 80s it all would have been completely different.

1) Holmes clear-cut win over prime undefeated Ray Mercer easily is much bigger achievement than Briggs' highly questionable winn over 49-years-old Gearrge Foreman. And yes, Briggs rocked Lewis, but still lost by TKO in 5, while Holmes went the distance against Holyfield and arguably beat Oliver McCall (i had it a draw 114-114).

This has some sense, but I ranked Briggs higher, cause despite the fact of arguable decision he won the lineal champion, while Holmes won a title eliminator.

2) Grant can't be ranked ahead of Ibeabuchi. Byrd and Tua are better scalps than anyone in Grant's resume, and against Golota Grant was battered from pillar to post and barely survived the firts round.

Here I disagree more. Golota already had a status of the top fighter, who had beaten Bowe twice, if we look on those fights rationally, not only on the outcome. And Byrd with Tua were rising yet. However, we can debate about how Grant had won Golota, cause he was losing to Andrew and Golota just surrendered.

[DrDuke]

I wonder if "The Boogieman" Jesse Ferguson and "Smokin" Bert Cooper are C-level heavyweights, but they were both spoilers and dangerous in the 90s as well. What is your opinion?

Ferguson was a clear journeyman in the 90s, he was losing to almost everybody, he just was lucky to have Mercer unprepared. However, the rematch was still close, I'd say.

Cooper was also a journeyman, but he was a special one. Yes, he lost a lot too, but he made some statements. He stopped rising Norris, whose biggest success was in the cruisers though. He gave some couneraction to Mercer. He battled prime reigning champion Holyfield with knocking him down. He almost stopped Moorer.

[ron4972]

Between Frank Bruno, Buster Douglas, Oliver McCall, Razor Ruddock, Ray Mercer and Tommy Morrison; where do you rank these fighters in order and why?

I hate to sound like I'm splitting hairs, but I would regard all these fighters as A level boxers in the 1990s. Some of them you could call A minus. But still, I'd rate them above the B level.

In my mind, all legitimate top ten contenders qualify as A level, especially if they've put on world class performances win or lose. I think of B level as being fringe-contenders, or semi-world class boxers. My B level rankings include 'everyone from 11th worldwide down to maybe 20th in the world.

[DrDuke]

Between Frank Bruno, Buster Douglas, Oliver McCall, Razor Ruddock, Ray Mercer and Tommy Morrison; where do you rank these fighters in order and why?

I hate to sound like I'm splitting hairs, but I would regard all these fighters as A level boxers in the 1990s. Some of them you could call A minus. But still, I'd rate them above the B level.

In my mind, all legitimate top ten contenders qualify as A level, especially if they've put on world class performances win or lose. I think of B level as being fringe-contenders, or semi-world class boxers. My B level rankings include 'everyone from 11th worldwide down to maybe 20th in the world.

That's actually right. And "the big four" of Holyfield, Lewis, Bowe and Tyson was just a group of A+ fighters. In their primes they were ahead of everybody, but that doesn't decrease the value of the others, it increase the value of them four.

[James9753]

Between Frank Bruno, Buster Douglas, Oliver McCall, Razor Ruddock, Ray Mercer and Tommy Morrison; where do you rank these fighters in order and why?

I hate to sound like I'm splitting hairs, but I would regard all these fighters as A level boxers in the 1990s. Some of them you could call A minus. But still, I'd rate them above the B level.

In my mind, all legitimate top ten contenders qualify as A level, especially if they've put on world class performances win or lose. I think of B level as being fringe-contenders, or semi-world class boxers. My B level rankings include 'everyone from 11th worldwide down to maybe 20th in the world.

That's totally fair. Which boxers would have been B-Level for you in that case, ranking them from 11-20 or so?

[ron4972]

That's totally fair. Which boxers would have been B-Level for you in that case, ranking them from 11-20 or so?

It's been a while (20 years already?!) and my memory is dusty. But here are the names that come to mind right now. This list is incomplete. Also, some of the fighters on this list, to me at least, are hybrid A/B level guys, or hybrid B/C level guys. But generally speaking, they are the bonafide B level heavyweights of the 1990s. At different points in the 1990s, the 11th to 20th ranking slots would have been held by different assortments of these names (and others):

This list is not ranked in any order:

Alex Zolkin (fell just a little shy of an A- rating. I'd give a B+)
Jeremy Williams (A- to B+)
Mike "Bounty" Hunter
Jimmy Thunder
David Izon
Franz Botha (A-/B+)
Axel Schulz (practically an A-/B+ fighter)
Kevin McBride
Herbie Hide (had A level billing, but he was really a B+ fighter)
Obed Sullivan
Ross Purrity (a hell of a lot better than his record showed)
Vaughn Bean (he had a top ten rating, but I think he was just an advanced B+ guy)
Timo Hoffman (high B+ ranking)
Orlin Norris (an A leaguer as cruiserweight, but a B level guy as a heavyweight)
Jose Ribalta (had slipped by the 1990s, maybe he was B to B- to C+ by then)
Dannel Nicholson
James Tillis (former A level guy from 1980s on the downside, but by 1990s, just a good B level dude)
Tony Tubbs (once a true A level fighter, but slipped to B+ level during the 1990s)
Bert Cooper (an uneven, over-the-hill dude by the 1990s, but his punching power kept him in the B leagues)
Elieser Castillo
Buster Mathis Jr.
Lou Savarese (solid, B+ level)
Ray Anis (B- level)
Craig Peterson
Maurice Harris (very top of the B+ category)
Mel Foster (B- level)
Michael Bentt (his KO over Morrison puts him in at B or B+)

[ron4972]

Just so everyone knows, when I categorize fighters by levels or leagues, I've been influenced by the old Ring Magazine system that was used in the 1970s. Remember that, at the end of each year Ring would rate every active fighter? Ring's system was to give an A, B, C, or D grade to each boxer worldwide.

[HomicideHenry]

I always viewed the 90s Champions (WBA/WBC/IBF) as being the A side and WBO title holders as the B side, along with losing challengers. C level guys are on the fringe of the top 15-25.

(In no particular order)

#1- Ray Mercer
#2- Tommy Morrison
#3- Francisco Damiani
#4- Bert Cooper
#5- Andrew Golota
#6- Joe Hipp
#7- Axel Schulz
#8- Zev
#9- Jose Ribalta

I don't add Bruno, Seldon, etc because they were A level fighters, but there's a world of difference between A- and A+ fighters.

[Ambling Alp II]

That's totally fair. Which boxers would have been B-Level for you in that case, ranking them from 11-20 or so?

It's been a while (20 years already?!) and my memory is dusty. But here are the names that come to mind right now. This list is incomplete. Also, some of the fighters on this list, to me at least, are hybrid A/B level guys, or hybrid B/C level guys. But generally speaking, they are the bonafide B level heavyweights of the 1990s. At different points in the 1990s, the 11th to 20th ranking slots would have been held by different assortments of these names (and others):

This list is not ranked in any order:

Alex Zolkin (fell just a little shy of an A- rating. I'd give a B+)
Jeremy Williams (A- to B+)
Mike "Bounty" Hunter
Jimmy Thunder
David Izon
Franz Botha (A-/B+)
Axel Schulz (practically an A-/B+ fighter)
Kevin McBride
Herbie Hide (had A level billing, but he was really a B+ fighter)
Obed Sullivan
Ross Purrity (a hell of a lot better than his record showed)
Vaughn Bean (he had a top ten rating, but I think he was just an advanced B+ guy)
Timo Hoffman (high B+ ranking)
Orlin Norris (an A leaguer as cruiserweight, but a B level guy as a heavyweight)
Jose Ribalta (had slipped by the 1990s, maybe he was B to B- to C+ by then)
Dannel Nicholson
James Tillis (former A level guy from 1980s on the downside, but by 1990s, just a good B level dude)
Tony Tubbs (once a true A level fighter, but slipped to B+ level during the 1990s)
Bert Cooper (an uneven, over-the-hill dude by the 1990s, but his punching power kept him in the B leagues)
Elieser Castillo
Buster Mathis Jr.
Lou Savarese (solid, B+ level)
Ray Anis (B- level)
Craig Peterson
Maurice Harris (very top of the B+ category)
Mel Foster (B- level)
Michael Bentt (his KO over Morrison puts him in at B or B+)

Interesting take. Pretty much agree with this; these guys all had their ups and downs.
Would only rate Peterson a C, Castillo a D, and McBride not even a D. Never knew what to make of Jeremy Williams. I have never even heard of Ray Anis. Looking at his record, don't see any reason to rate him even a D.
Bowe, Lewis, Holyfield and Tyson were the A + fighters. There was a bit of a gap after them. At this best Mercer was probably #5 and would certainly be an A.