Sad but true, public opinion of Calzaghe...

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 21 Oct 2004, 09:08

I'm in the changing room at the gym yesterday and two lads are talking about the cringy JC press conference that had just been shown on Sky Sports News.

Bloke A "Hope he gets hold of that other bloke, whats his name?"
Bloke B "Opkins"
Bloke A "Won't come over ere thought will he? They don't wanna fight Calzaghe"
Bloke B "Maybe next year"

Needless to say I put them right but it's such a shame that guys like this really don't have a clue that Calzaghe's career has become a joke...

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 21 Oct 2004, 09:25

who cares?

bugs · Post by **bugs** » 21 Oct 2004, 09:43

Still the best super middle in the world and has been for a while.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 21 Oct 2004, 09:54

bugs wrote:Still the best super middle in the world and has been for a while.

Then after 7 years he should have unified the titles..

Or fought for one other than the WBO...

bugs · Post by **bugs** » 21 Oct 2004, 09:56

Tough to fight the guy who holds the other three when he refuses to fight for a million quid in his own country. Rotter Ottke!

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:06

Whilst I believe that Calzaghe is probably the best in the division, he has never proven it beyond reasonable doubt.

Funnily enough, the division is probably at it's strongest now since Eubank and co passed on, and Calzaghe is looking elsewhere. The likes of Lacy and Green would make for excellent fights, in a year's time it's also possible that Froch will be ready to have a pop, but will any of these happen, probably not.

If Calzaghe stayed at SM, there are plenty of challenges, he could retire unbeaten having truly cleared out the division, but that won't happen. Instead I fear he will tread water, whilst waiting for a shot at one of the light heavweight belts.

Ottke wouldn't have faced Calzaghe for all the tea in china though. However, there were some others against Lucas and Beyer which could have probably been made.

Calzaghe is the best fighter in the country, and if things were different could be in the p4p lists, but it is seeming more and more likely his career will end without that defining fight.

Neri · Post by **Neri** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:08

he needs to be fighting on US shows, its doing him no good fighting in UK. Warren should realise it will do calzaghe the world of good and sort something with an american promoter. BIG FIGHTS = AMERICA. Hopkins wont come over? why should he, he doesnt need to prove himself.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:25

I can remember writing a piece two years ago urging Calzaghe to go to America. There was a lot of talk then about Joe Conquering America, but it never happened.

This is from an interview I did with Jay Larkin, the Showtime boss, his own words.

"By staying so close to home and not building a worldwide fan base, it is very difficult, if not impossible, to become international stars and command truly big purses in major events. After a while, the local becomes "fished out" and there is nowhere else to go. Some fighters have a hard time understanding why they are not draws in other countries when they are canonized at home."

REAL_DEAL · Post by **REAL_DEAL** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:34

off course ottke would of faced calzaghe. all there promoters wanted was calzaghe to fight on the undercard of a ottke fight so the public know who he was. reid did and got the fight. ask sven promoters.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:38

"ask sven promoters."

lol yeah coz they won't be at all biased will they.

REAL_DEAL · Post by **REAL_DEAL** » 21 Oct 2004, 10:41

Sven Ottke has his sights set on a fight with Bernard Hopkins
Sven Ottke's manager Wilfried Sauerland says a possible meeting between Wales' Joe Calzaghe is "a dead topic".
Ottke retained his IBF and WBA super-middleweight belts on Saturday night in Magdeburg, after out-pointing England's David Starie.
But the German says he has grown frustrated after several negotiations to line up a bout with WBO titleholder Calzaghe - who was awarded a MBE this week - have ended in failure.
That is the exact message that has come out of the Calzaghe camp, with promotor allegedly accusing Ottke of doing his best to avoid a unification fight.
"For us it's just not serious any more," Sauerland said. "Calzaghe is talking about all the people he wants to fight.
"We've been talking about a meeting for three years and all serious approaches have come from us. That's why I say the topic is dead."
The German promoter insisted he has done his best to line up a fight and took the opportunity to aim a jibe at Calzaghe.
"Once (three years ago) the two met at a press conference and announced they would fight each other. But we never heard from Calzaghe or his manager again," said Sauerland.
"Then I travelled to London last year to negotiate with allegedly. We discussed details that we were going to have him fight here in Germany before an Ottke bout.
Ottke's manager Wilfried Sauerland
"He needed to get a little more popular here, but it never happened.
"Sven has done enough for his reputation, while Calzaghe usually fights opponents two years after everyone else."
Sauerland is now eyeing a meeting with America's Bernard Hopkins, a fighter Calzaghe has been chasing for some time.
"There's a chance. I'm going to America next week to negotiate. It's a financial question again," added Sauerland. "With Hopkins we could go to the big stadiums with 20,000 people over here.
"Calzaghe is not a name over here. He comes with a title - WBO - which is not recognised. And then you've got Hopkins, who has got three titles of the three big organisations.
"So you're talking about a Rolls Royce and a Volkswagen."
Ottke, who at the age of 36 has won all of his 31 fights, joked: "I'm an elderly person - it's not that easy any more. But to be honest I don't really know what's up next.
"I think I'll do a few more fights but I don't know against whom. It's all still up in the air. The latest I've heard is that Hopkins might move into cruiserweight."
Starie, who has also been beaten by Calzaghe, said it was impossible to predict the outcome of an unlikely Calzaghe-Ottke bout.
"That's a very difficult question, almost impossible to answer, they are both intelligent boxers. I would go with Joe, but I wouldn't put money on it."
Calzaghe is next in action on 28 June against Byron Mitchell, whom Ottke beat in March to take the American's WBA belt.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:00

REAL_DEAL wrote:off course ottke would of faced calzaghe. all there promoters wanted was calzaghe to fight on the undercard of a ottke fight so the public know who he was. reid did and got the fight. ask sven promoters.

Do me a favour. Look what happened to Reid. He was docked a point for hitting Ottke!! He was constantly badgered by the referee who was blatantly in the employ of the promoter, and even when he knocked Ottke down, the referee simply helped him off the floor and waved the action on.

If that's what Calzaghe had to look forward to, and I believe that is what would have happened, then who can blame him from not going?

I don't give a toss if Wilfried Sauerland wants to sue me, that was the most corrupt refereeing I have ever seen. The whole thing Stank, if Reid had knocked him out, the referee would have found a way to disqualify him. Short of dying from a heart attack, there is no way Ottke was going to leave the ring without his title. There was a lot going on behind the scenes in the runup to that fight too, shenanigans between IBF officials and the referee and Sauerland. They were all tighter than a gnat's chuffbox.

Why else would they appoint a guy with no world title fight experience, and indeed a guy who was a referee by trade and not a judge for a major fight like that? There were plenty of other officials who couldhave been appointed, yet they choose someone with no experience in refereeing, how strange eh? Wonder why that could be? I'll tell you why, so that if he gives a 'dodgy' performance, they can just put it down to lack of experience.

Are you seriously suggesting we take Sauerland's word as gospel on this!!? Leave off.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:00

Trained by Hagler's old foe Mustafa Hamsho in the early part of his career, no wonder he's rough!

Best you can say about this guy is he must be tough, because he hasn't had it easy. In his first year as a pro he was thrown in with fellow prospects Eric Harding and Richard Grant.
And going 12 with Echols shows he can take a punch alright. Joe's fragile hands are going to be tested tomorrow night.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:02

Yeah the performance against big punching Echols was the one I noticed, but Calzaghe is troubled by counterpunchers not rugged come forward types. Probably a wide decision victory.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:04

Yeah sounds about right, or late stopage if his hands hold up.

Apparently Salem is fasting at the moment too - nothing to eat today and tomorrow until the sun goes down.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:20

Christ, that can't help. Mind you, be worse if he was doing it in Egypt.

REAL_DEAL · Post by **REAL_DEAL** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:30

great how easy do they want this opponent to be.

Coconut · Post by **Coconut** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:37

My money's pretty firmly on a DQ win for JC. I can see Dave Parris getting very pissed off and turning maroon before taking off a gazillion points and DQing Salem for headbutts. Especially after what Salem said about wanting to fight clean but realising that it may not be appropriate this fight. He's going to come out head first.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:39

you can bet Joe is fasting too, but not for religious reasons!!!!

Salem as a hard head and isnt afraid to use it... him and echols must have been the dirtiest fight of the modern era

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:44

bugs wrote:Still the best super middle in the world and has been for a while.

best joke of the day

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 21 Oct 2004, 11:47

Who is the best then Bubi?

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 21 Oct 2004, 12:13

he is after Ottkes retirement one of the best in a close division. for me Larsen, Kessler, Beyer, Green, Stieglitz and Tsypko are better. Calzaghes days are counted. Stieglitz is the best talent in the division. he could reign this division in the future.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 21 Oct 2004, 12:18

BubiScholz wrote:he is after Ottkes retirement one of the best in a close division. for me Larsen, Kessler, Beyer, Green, Stieglitz and Tsypko are better. Calzaghes days are counted. Stieglitz is the best talent in the division. he could reign this division in the future.

Are you on drugs? The above guys have beaten no-one, and there's no way you can call them better than Calzaghe.
I reckon he'd blow away the fragile Bayer in a couple of rounds.
Green might be the real test, but he's still pretty raw.

mickeybeard · Post by **mickeybeard** » 21 Oct 2004, 12:24

Until they all start getting in with each other, it's largely guesswork. The likes of Lacy, Green etc to look like they'll fight anyone, anytime, but so they should given that they're still largely up-and-coming prosepects. Barring promotional silly-buggers or fighters moving weight, the supermiddles could be really interesting over the next few years.

dbf · Post by **dbf** » 22 Oct 2004, 06:01

BubiScholz wrote:he is after Ottkes retirement one of the best in a close division. for me Larsen, Kessler, Beyer, Green, Stieglitz and Tsypko are better. Calzaghes days are counted. Stieglitz is the best talent in the division. he could reign this division in the future.

beyer better? now that tales the biscuit. as for tyspko, have you seen the lacy fight? There was only one way that was heading, and its reflected in Tsypkos recent reluctancy to fac jeff again.

As far as supermiddles go, Joes got the beating of them all. But sadly i dont think he will eve prove it. However, Im glad you put green in that list because he certainly looks like he could take over the division.

Green V Lacy, winter 2005. It will be a stormer.