BoxRec

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 10:50**

I was just thinking after Leigh Wood’s emphatic victory last night to win the commonwealth title whether the title has lost value. I was very disappointed with Abraham Bono, as I was with Felix Cash’s opponent a few weeks back. These title fights should be a great scrap, not a blowout. The last two on sky sports have been mismatches

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 12:02**

It certainly has over my lifetime but you can probably say that about almost any titles (cruiser and Super-middleweight ones excepted) as the number of titles has proliferated. If you meant over the last few years I couldn't honestly say.

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 12:05**

I just feel that these Africans coming in must be cheap and coming for a payday- bono last night just gave up. The British standard is now way way ahead as we will see when okolie fights Camacho. Opponents for international titles are better

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 12:55**

There can't be any doubt that there are quality fighters from Commonwealth countries eligible to fight for the title, but because they can, it doesn't mean they are going to get the nomination, or whether they'd even be interested.

It's the same with the European: What do these Heavyweights have in common? (A) Tyson Fury, Dillian Whyte, Alexandr Povetkin, Kubrat Pulev, Filip Hrgovic, Sergey Kuzmin, (B) Johann Duhaupas, Carlos Takam, Hughie Fury, Christian Hammer, Manuel Charr, Robert Helenius ?

Answer : They are (A) probably (B) arguably - better than the current EBU Heavyweight Champion Agit Kabayel . In theory the only European who's better than the EBU Champion is the holder of a World Championship belt such as Anthony Joshua but this isn't the case in reality.

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 13:17**

The Commonwealth is, in theory, the next step up from British but in reality the British title is now held in higher regard.

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 13:33**

I don’t think that the European title has reduced in credibility recently though - if you win one you can move onto fringe world level. If you win the commonwealth you have little knowledge on whether you should challenge for a British title because it’s a 1-2 round blowout

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 13:36**

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 13:17 The Commonwealth is, in theory, the next step up from British but in reality the British title is now held in higher regard.

I can’t remember the commonwealth being more credible than British but it’s nowhere near the same level. British title fights are almost always competitive fights.

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 13:36**

candyslim wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 12:55 There can't be any doubt that there are quality fighters from Commonwealth countries eligible to fight for the title, but because they can, it doesn't mean they are going to get the nomination, or whether they'd even be interested.

It's the same with the European: What do these Heavyweights have in common? (A) Tyson Fury, Dillian Whyte, Alexandr Povetkin, Kubrat Pulev, Filip Hrgovic, Sergey Kuzmin, (B) Johann Duhaupas, Carlos Takam, Hughie Fury, Christian Hammer, Manuel Charr, Robert Helenius ?

Answer : They are (A) probably (B) arguably - better than the current EBU Heavyweight Champion Agit Kabayel . In theory the only European who's better than the EBU Champion is the holder of a World Championship belt such as Anthony Joshua but this isn't the case in reality.

^^

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 14:20**

I think we should vote England out of the commonwealth.
And change the commonwealth belt, it's a bit gay. Anything with a rainbow on it suggests your going to get bummed in the changing room if you wear it.

Or perhaps they should make it a gay only belt, hollow out the middle and it can be a personal portable gloy hole

Posted: **03 Mar 2019, 15:48**

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 13:17 The Commonwealth is, in theory, the next step up from British but in reality the British title is now held in higher regard.

yep, british is far higher today, usually a good standard for that but with the commonwealth you get a lot of total patsys brought over

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 10:48**

Joel2 wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 10:50 I was just thinking after Leigh Wood’s emphatic victory last night to win the commonwealth title whether the title has lost value. I was very disappointed with Abraham Bono, as I was with Felix Cash’s opponent a few weeks back. These title fights should be a great scrap, not a blowout. The last two on sky sports have been mismatches

Wen you say lost value, what exactly? money?, fan base?, fans knowledge? reputation?

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 11:14**

KiwiRider wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 14:20 I think we should vote England out of the commonwealth.
And change the commonwealth belt, it's a bit gay. Anything with a rainbow on it suggests your going to get bummed in the changing room if you wear it.

Or perhaps they should make it a gay only belt, hollow out the middle and it can be a personal portable gloy hole

Yes the belt doesn't look very good.
To everything else - don't be such a prick.

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 11:22**

I wasn't even aware of it's existence until a few years ago so it's gained value in my eyes from "Commonwealth title? What the hell are you talking about?" to "Oh yeah one of those British titles right?"

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 11:38**

A lot of excellent fighters captured the commonwealth title before moving onto achieving world honours. It’s never been the sort of championship held by top-ten world-rated contenders.

Look at the careers of Billy Joe Saunders, Anthony Joshua, Tyson Fury, George Groves etc., they all competed for the Commonwealth and British titles around the same time, shortly before they progressed onto European and then world-level.

So there’s no real reason to expect any big names to hold a commonwealth title, since it’s a belt for prospects that are in the midst of learning their trade, rather than experienced world-rated talent.

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 12:29**

It's loss of prestige probably goes hand and hand with the proliferation of belts in modern boxing.

There's just too many belts so they've lost all significance. Belts these days are even invented for particular fights.

No one cares about belts any longer or attach must value. There's no excuse for not having some belt.

I can recall when being the NABF or USBA champion meant something. It was usually reserved for the best American fighter who wasn't a world champion.

But nowadays, it means nada. Just one more belt out of seemingly hundreds

I've said it before: belts no longer make the fighter. It's the fighter who makes the belt.

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 15:41**

Leigh Wood KO2 Abraham Osei Bonsu - Bonsu had lost 3 of his last 6.

Felix Cash KO1 Rasheed Abolaji - Abolaji was coming off a stoppage loss and hadn't fought for over a year.

Phillip Bowes KO2 Benson Nyilawila - Nyilawila was coming off a loss just over 2 months prior.

Lee McGregor KO12 Thomas Essomba - Essomba had been the distance with a couple of good Brits and had stopped Louis Norman but had still lost 3 of his last 4, 1 of them 2 weights below Bantam.

Liam Cameron KO2 Nicky Jenman - Jenman was 20-10-1 and coming off a loss 4 weeks earlier.

Those 5 are all since last April. Been plenty of decent fights for the Commonwealth in that time of course. Davies Jr/Foot, Cordina/Dodd/Coyle, Gill/Doyle/Bellotti. But also far too many mismatches. Shouldn't be happening for a title.

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 16:14**

SenorPipino wrote: ↑04 Mar 2019, 12:29 It's loss of prestige probably goes hand and hand with the proliferation of belts in modern boxing.

There's just too many belts so they've lost all significance. Belts these days are even invented for particular fights.

No one cares about belts any longer or attach must value. There's no excuse for not having some belt.

I can recall when being the NABF or USBA champion meant something. It was usually reserved for the best American fighter who wasn't a world champion.

But nowadays, it means nada. Just one more belt out of seemingly hundreds

I've said it before: belts no longer make the fighter. It's the fighter who makes the belt.

X2

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 16:33**

ERIC GUY wrote: ↑04 Mar 2019, 10:48
Joel2 wrote: ↑03 Mar 2019, 10:50 I was just thinking after Leigh Wood’s emphatic victory last night to win the commonwealth title whether the title has lost value. I was very disappointed with Abraham Bono, as I was with Felix Cash’s opponent a few weeks back. These title fights should be a great scrap, not a blowout. The last two on sky sports have been mismatches
Wen you say lost value, what exactly? money?, fan base?, fans knowledge? reputation?

In terms of how boxers at a higher level ( British champ) view if they are a good test or not and in terms of how they are considered with fans. I don’t think that fans regard it as highly as a few years back. British level boxers won’t know or promoters whether they are ready

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 16:35**

ElJefe wrote: ↑04 Mar 2019, 15:41 Leigh Wood KO2 Abraham Osei Bonsu - Bonsu had lost 3 of his last 6.

Felix Cash KO1 Rasheed Abolaji - Abolaji was coming off a stoppage loss and hadn't fought for over a year.

Phillip Bowes KO2 Benson Nyilawila - Nyilawila was coming off a loss just over 2 months prior.

Lee McGregor KO12 Thomas Essomba - Essomba had been the distance with a couple of good Brits and had stopped Louis Norman but had still lost 3 of his last 4, 1 of them 2 weights below Bantam.

Liam Cameron KO2 Nicky Jenman - Jenman was 20-10-1 and coming off a loss 4 weeks earlier.

Those 5 are all since last April. Been plenty of decent fights for the Commonwealth in that time of course. Davies Jr/Foot, Cordina/Dodd/Coyle, Gill/Doyle/Bellotti. But also far too many mismatches. Shouldn't be happening for a title.

Exactly my point mate people are winning it by blowouts against nobodies

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 16:36**

What’s the the commonwealth title. Lol

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 16:48**

It’s been a while since we’ve had Lewis v Ruddock or Benn v Watson type matches for the commonwealth, I’m pretty sure Azumah Nelson also won it

Posted: **04 Mar 2019, 17:57**

Yeah the match ups are the problem.

In days gone by the likes of Whyte v Parker would have been for the Commonwealth

Posted: **05 Mar 2019, 14:34**

Good point.

Posted: **05 Mar 2019, 14:42**

ewenhay wrote: ↑04 Mar 2019, 17:57 Yeah the match ups are the problem.

In days gone by the likes of Whyte v Parker would have been for the Commonwealth

That was the way it was with say a title like the NABF title in America too. By the 90's or 2000's it was being competed for by mediocre third raters, but in the 1970's it was contested in Ken Norton vs Muhammad Ali 1.

Now you'll actually have so called Major World Title fights that are contested with much lesser fighters involved than that.

Just way too many belts.

I'd like to be able to just snap my fingers, and make at least 80 of 'em disappear, but eh what can you do? Basically it's just up to the fans to look at the talent, and decipher who really is the Champ.

Posted: **05 Mar 2019, 15:04**

Exactly. I still keep a logbook of heavyweights adding newbies as they show they have something about them (latest entry Peter Kadiru at number 304 if anyone gives a sh1t) and I record their results but I never bother to mention whether any title is at stake because I consider it meaningless.

Obviously it's way less comprehensive than BoxRec but the original volume pre-dated BoxRec by many years. I started it in 72 IIRC.

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