Tarver - johnson meet up

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 10 Nov 2004, 09:49

They look like something out of the cotton club.

Although Tarver's got a big mouth, you have to respect the fact that
both guys have done it the hard way. Tarver had to work his way through
the LH division to get his shot at Jones, and Glen has done it all.

In fairness to Jones too, he could have stayed at heavyweight and mixed
it with some of the bigger boys, and would probably have done better, but
he came back down to shut Tarver up.

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:05

jamesmcdonnell wrote:They look like something out of the cotton club.

Although Tarver's got a big mouth, you have to respect the fact that
both guys have done it the hard way. Tarver had to work his way through
the LH division to get his shot at Jones, and Glen has done it all.

In fairness to Jones too, he could have stayed at heavyweight and mixed
it with some of the bigger boys, and would probably have done better, but
he came back down to shut Tarver up.

regarding RJJ's chin it was better for his health to stay in Light Heavy.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:14

BubiScholz wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:They look like something out of the cotton club.

Although Tarver's got a big mouth, you have to respect the fact that
both guys have done it the hard way. Tarver had to work his way through
the LH division to get his shot at Jones, and Glen has done it all.

In fairness to Jones too, he could have stayed at heavyweight and mixed
it with some of the bigger boys, and would probably have done better, but
he came back down to shut Tarver up.
regarding RJJ's chin it was better for his health to stay in Light Heavy.

the heavyweight's wouldnt be able to lay a glove on RJJ.... but i shudder to think what would happen if a 250lb lennox or Klit landed a right hand bomb on him

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:36

I don't think he would ever have fought Lennox, knew it was too risky.

However, Jones' health obviously suffered from moving back down to LH, he was never the same fighter again.

I think that a lot of the bigger heavies would have had murders to land a flush shot on him.

Both the shots he got slammed with by Tarver and Johnson, are ones he would have seen coming and ridden the sting out of earlier in his career.

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:42

jamesmcdonnell wrote:I don't think he would ever have fought Lennox, knew it was too risky.

However, Jones' health obviously suffered from moving back down to LH, he was never the same fighter again.

I think that a lot of the bigger heavies would have had murders to land a flush shot on him.

Both the shots he got slammed with by Tarver and Johnson, are ones he would have seen coming and ridden the sting out of earlier in his career.

i think his chin is the reason why he didn´t fight DM some years ago. he took guys where he knew he could outbox them with his powerpunches.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:43

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
Both the shots he got slammed with by Tarver and Johnson, are ones he would have seen coming and ridden the sting out of earlier in his career.

the johnson one was bizzare, he looked like he had ridden it but was just knackered and went down anyway.... 2 years earlier he would have taken that FLUSH and been fine...

His decline has been SO QUICK its still hard to fathom

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:46

He's fucked. The Johnson shot didn't even look that hard, I know it was high on the head, but it looked nowhere hard enough to put him down for 5 minutes.

The Tarver one was brutal, much harder, full blooded, Jones turned into it and never saw it coming, and yet Jones made it to his feet and was ok within about 30 seconds.

Jones is completely fucked, he really needs to quit.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:49

Could well be that Roy was on the juice, he did test positive once after all and if he had been using something like EPO could explain his rapid decline which coincidentally has happened in about the same time the new tests came into play. Mosley also....

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:51

Epo isn't a steroid though is it? It increases the amount of haemaglobin carriage in the blood, which is useful for stamina, not building muscle mass.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:53

I know, just speculating what he might have been up to. I have a feeling he may have been on the roids before the ruiz fight to bulk up. But could well have been using THG or EPO all along as those have been busted recently in the same kind of timeframe Jones has lost absolutely everything.

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:54

jamesmcdonnell wrote:He's fucked. The Johnson shot didn't even look that hard, I know it was high on the head, but it looked nowhere hard enough to put him down for 5 minutes.

The Tarver one was brutal, much harder, full blooded, Jones turned into it and never saw it coming, and yet Jones made it to his feet and was ok within about 30 seconds.

Jones is completely fucked, he really needs to quit.

absolutely agree

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 10 Nov 2004, 10:58

Both boxers have given up there titles to get this fight on as well.

Which just makes the ruling bodies look even stupidier than they are.

Whoever wins will be the rightful champion in everyones eyes

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:02

topper123 wrote:Both boxers have given up there titles to get this fight on as well.

Which just makes the ruling bodies look even stupidier than they are.

Whoever wins will be the rightful champion in everyones eyes

no, they first have to fight Erdei, where Johnson has absolutely no chance and Tarver only with a monster punch like vs. RJJ.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:03

I think RJJ talent was the greatest in the modern era....

But i agree that it makes sense that he started taking "stuff" to give him the extra edge and keep him at the top longer than normal as he started moving further away from his natural weight.

(he turned pro in 1989, a long career at the top of the hardest sport)

with the Balco scandal he probably stopped taking anything and this combined with the torture of dragging his body back down to 175 left him a completed spent force...

I dont believe RJJ was taking anything is his middle, super middle days but somewhere in his lightheavy career I think he started..... this artificially prolongued his career and made the decline more rapid when he stopped.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:03

007 wrote:I know, just speculating what he might have been up to. I have a feeling he may have been on the roids before the ruiz fight to bulk up. But could well have been using THG or EPO all along as those have been busted recently in the same kind of timeframe Jones has lost absolutely everything.

I don't really see anything to suggest that Roy was on anything prior to taking on Ruiz. I was shocked by how much he had bulked up for the Ruiz fight, and I think he may well have been on something suspect for that fight to build up.

Jones looked as strong as a bull for the Ruiz fight, he looked to me like he had the power to have whacked him out of there.

The first tarver fight he looked terrible, old, drawn, his skin was a sickly grey colour, and his muscle tone was noticably poor, his muscles had been forced to burn down to provide him with energy due to starving himself, and perhaps that had a permanent effect on him.

Modern athletes take so many supplements, that it is no surprise when one of them fails a drugs test. Those tests pick up on tiny amounts of substances and there are lots of different substances which find their way into health supplements all the time.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:04

Erdei is obviously talented, but the winner of Tarver v Johnson will be recognised as the true champ of the division.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:05

knockout wrote:I think RJJ talent was the greatest in the modern era....

But i agree that it makes sense that he started taking "stuff" to give him the extra edge and keep him at the top longer than normal as he started moving further away from his natural weight.

(he turned pro in 1989, a long career at the top of the hardest sport)

with the Balco scandal he probably stopped taking anything and this combined with the torture of dragging his body back down to 175 left him a completed spent force...

I dont believe RJJ was taking anything is his middle, super middle days but somewhere in his lightheavy career I think he started..... this artificially prolongued his career and made the decline more rapid when he stopped.

Thats pretty much what I was attempting to say Matt, you put it so more eloquently than me!!

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:06

007 wrote:
knockout wrote:I think RJJ talent was the greatest in the modern era....

But i agree that it makes sense that he started taking "stuff" to give him the extra edge and keep him at the top longer than normal as he started moving further away from his natural weight.

(he turned pro in 1989, a long career at the top of the hardest sport)

with the Balco scandal he probably stopped taking anything and this combined with the torture of dragging his body back down to 175 left him a completed spent force...

I dont believe RJJ was taking anything is his middle, super middle days but somewhere in his lightheavy career I think he started..... this artificially prolongued his career and made the decline more rapid when he stopped.

Thats pretty much what I was attempting to say Matt, you put it so more eloquently than me!!

thanks, took me about 20 minutes to write it

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:07

knockout wrote:
007 wrote:
knockout wrote:I think RJJ talent was the greatest in the modern era....

But i agree that it makes sense that he started taking "stuff" to give him the extra edge and keep him at the top longer than normal as he started moving further away from his natural weight.

(he turned pro in 1989, a long career at the top of the hardest sport)

with the Balco scandal he probably stopped taking anything and this combined with the torture of dragging his body back down to 175 left him a completed spent force...

I dont believe RJJ was taking anything is his middle, super middle days but somewhere in his lightheavy career I think he started..... this artificially prolongued his career and made the decline more rapid when he stopped.

Thats pretty much what I was attempting to say Matt, you put it so more eloquently than me!!
thanks, took me about 20 minutes to write it

Thats what I need, more time on my hands!!! Do some work!!

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:08

BubiScholz wrote:
topper123 wrote:Both boxers have given up there titles to get this fight on as well.

Which just makes the ruling bodies look even stupidier than they are.

Whoever wins will be the rightful champion in everyones eyes
no, they first have to fight Erdei, where Johnson has absolutely no chance and Tarver only with a monster punch like vs. RJJ.

Erdei?? is that the hungarian guy who was extremely lucky to get the nod against Garay???

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:09

007 wrote:Erdei is obviously talented, but the winner of Tarver v Johnson will be recognised as the true champ of the division.

only because both won vs. RJJ. come on, RJJ would run ot of gas after six rounds vs. Erdei. Johnson is not the MAN in the division. he would have no chance vs. Erdei. he is as fast as Otke and a good puncher.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:11

actually i agree Erdei has the style to beat Johnson...
Tarver would beat Erdei though.

Garay is very good, but due to lack of good promoter he doesnt get any love.....

mickeybeard · Post by **mickeybeard** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:11

BubiScholz wrote:
topper123 wrote:Both boxers have given up there titles to get this fight on as well.

Which just makes the ruling bodies look even stupidier than they are.

Whoever wins will be the rightful champion in everyones eyes
no, they first have to fight Erdei, where Johnson has absolutely no chance and Tarver only with a monster punch like vs. RJJ.

Don't get carried away Bubi. I've liked what I've seen of Erdei, but Tarver/Johnson are the men who beat The Man. The winner of that fight will be The Man, and Erdei will have to come to them. Lets see if he does that, or acts like all those piss-poor British fighters you dislike so much - calling out the winner from the other side of the atlantic and plodding along with his WBO belt.

I hope not, actually, because Erdei looks a bit useful.

knockout · Post by **knockout** » 10 Nov 2004, 11:11

a teenage RJJ....