BoxRec

bwu wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 21:52 The answer to your question is no, he is not overrated.

Marciano would have done to Mercer and Tua, a fine pair of fighters, what he would’ve done to most of history’s heavyweights: Knocked them out.

All your observations are correct. But despite those limitations, his toughness, underrated athleticism and obvious courage would make him competitive in any era.

mayorcurley wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 12:02 Whaddy think? Small heavyweight, bad footwork, easy HW era?

How would he fare against guys like Ray Mercer and David Tua?

bwu wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 21:52 The answer to your question is no, he is not overrated.

Marciano would have done to Mercer and Tua, a fine pair of fighters, what he would’ve done to most of history’s heavyweights: Knocked them out.

All your observations are correct. But despite those limitations, his toughness, underrated athleticism and obvious courage would make him competitive in any era.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57

bwu wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 21:52 The answer to your question is no, he is not overrated.

Marciano would have done to Mercer and Tua, a fine pair of fighters, what he would’ve done to most of history’s heavyweights: Knocked them out.

All your observations are correct. But despite those limitations, his toughness, underrated athleticism and obvious courage would make him competitive in any era.

Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57
Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:55

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57
Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

I don't think Tua or Mercer were ever knocked down in their careers.

Onamastus wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:00

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:55

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57
Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

I don't think Tua or Mercer were ever knocked down in their careers.

They were both knocked down, but only once they were too old to be boxing. Mercer against Klitschko and Briggs, Tua against Barrett

Onamastus wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:00

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:55

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57
Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

I don't think Tua or Mercer were ever knocked down in their careers.

They were both knocked down, but only once they were too old to be boxing. Mercer against Klitschko and Briggs, Tua against Barrett

DrDuke wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:50

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57

bwu wrote: ↑26 Oct 2020, 21:52 The answer to your question is no, he is not overrated.

Marciano would have done to Mercer and Tua, a fine pair of fighters, what he would’ve done to most of history’s heavyweights: Knocked them out.

All your observations are correct. But despite those limitations, his toughness, underrated athleticism and obvious courage would make him competitive in any era.

Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

Tua was KOed in the amateurs by Felix Savon hard. Rahman also dropped him right after the final bell in their rematch.

Mercer wasn't KOed until the later stages of his career.

These two had granite chins, but weren't as freakish as McCall or Chuvalo. Clean Marciano's punch could KO both Mercer and Tua. Marciano was a very big puncher.

I'd pick Rocky to handle both Mercer and Tua.

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:13

Onamastus wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:00

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:55

I don't think Tua or Mercer were ever knocked down in their careers.

They were both knocked down, but only once they were too old to be boxing. Mercer against Klitschko and Briggs, Tua against Barrett

Mercer got kicked in the head flush against some very accomplished kickboxer. Didn't go down.

Gotta love those mixed combat contests. Like Butterbean knocking out MMA guy James Thompson.

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:13

Onamastus wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:00

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:55

I don't think Tua or Mercer were ever knocked down in their careers.

They were both knocked down, but only once they were too old to be boxing. Mercer against Klitschko and Briggs, Tua against Barrett

Mercer got kicked in the head flush against some very accomplished kickboxer. Didn't go down.

Gotta love those mixed combat contests. Like Butterbean knocking out MMA guy James Thompson.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 16:32

DrDuke wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 13:50

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 12:57

Was Tua ever even knocked down? If so it wasn't until late in his career.

Hard to imagine him being knocked out by hardly anybody honestly. Not hard at all to imagine him being bested via decision by being outworked.

Tua was KOed in the amateurs by Felix Savon hard. Rahman also dropped him right after the final bell in their rematch.

Mercer wasn't KOed until the later stages of his career.

These two had granite chins, but weren't as freakish as McCall or Chuvalo. Clean Marciano's punch could KO both Mercer and Tua. Marciano was a very big puncher.

I'd pick Rocky to handle both Mercer and Tua.

I got a chuckle at him going down in the Rahman rematch because Rahman pointed at him when he went down, but it was just a smidge too late. He would've got the decision had that happened a second earlier.

Was more of a balance thing though than him being hurt. He was aggressively on the front foot attacking, and Rahman hit him with a shot that knocked him off balance. I remember as soon as he hit the mat he stood up immediately.

I think Marciano could KO Tua, if Tua just stood there with his arms down letting him tee off on him maybe. I don't see it otherwise though.

With Mercer it's a little more likely to happen, but I wouldn't pick Marciano by KO in either case. Him winning by Decision though like I say, I can easily imagine.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 16:34

mayorcurley wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:13

Onamastus wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 14:00

They were both knocked down, but only once they were too old to be boxing. Mercer against Klitschko and Briggs, Tua against Barrett

Mercer got kicked in the head flush against some very accomplished kickboxer. Didn't go down.

Gotta love those mixed combat contests. Like Butterbean knocking out MMA guy James Thompson.

Wladimir Klitschko battered a past prime Mercer in 2002. Stopped him on his feet. It does seem like he might've dropped him somewhere in there, but it's been so long I forget.

He didn't drop him for the count though. Ref stopped it.

Mercer was a tough SOB.

Hell as far as I know wasn't Marciano knocked down more than both of them combined?

Moore dropped him, Walcott dropped him. I don't doubt he was knocked down other times, but I can't name them off the top of my head.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 16:49 Wasn't Tua dropped officially one time?

The Rahman knockdown doesn't count. It wasn't official.

DrDuke wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 16:50

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 16:49 Wasn't Tua dropped officially one time?

The Rahman knockdown doesn't count. It wasn't official.

Barrett KD is official.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 17:15 Marciano, like most fighters, is overrated by some and underrated by others. If you see him top 50 p4p all time...Over. if you see someone saying he would be a light heavy and too small for a tub of goo like areola or kownacki...Under.

Tua and Mercer I'd tab him to outpoint, but he isn't knocking those guys cold. Evander with his short, concise counter and lead hooks would floor tua.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 17:22

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 17:15 Marciano, like most fighters, is overrated by some and underrated by others. If you see him top 50 p4p all time...Over. if you see someone saying he would be a light heavy and too small for a tub of goo like areola or kownacki...Under.

Tua and Mercer I'd tab him to outpoint, but he isn't knocking those guys cold. Evander with his short, concise counter and lead hooks would floor tua.

Hell he was at least a Cruiserweight wasn't he?

Didn't he usually weigh between 180 and 190?

He likely could've made Light Heavyweight then if he'd been so inclined, but he wanted the money of fighting the bigger guys. If that's his mentality. He might still do it even in the modern era.

Expressing my outrage about the WBC's new decision, I've seen people say there's no minimal limit, so theoretically a guy could weigh 200 and fight the big boys.

And yet, I don't recall a guy ever being 149 or 150 and fighting a Middleweight.

When Roy Jones weighed 193 for Ruiz, the Cruiserweight division hadn't yet been changed to 200 pounds.

I'm getting off topic here though. Your opinion of whether or not he's over or underrated seems pretty well accurate.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 17:22

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020, 17:15 Marciano, like most fighters, is overrated by some and underrated by others. If you see him top 50 p4p all time...Over. if you see someone saying he would be a light heavy and too small for a tub of goo like areola or kownacki...Under.

Tua and Mercer I'd tab him to outpoint, but he isn't knocking those guys cold. Evander with his short, concise counter and lead hooks would floor tua.

Hell he was at least a Cruiserweight wasn't he?

Didn't he usually weigh between 180 and 190?

He likely could've made Light Heavyweight then if he'd been so inclined, but he wanted the money of fighting the bigger guys. If that's his mentality. He might still do it even in the modern era.

Expressing my outrage about the WBC's new decision, I've seen people say there's no minimal limit, so theoretically a guy could weigh 200 and fight the big boys.

And yet, I don't recall a guy ever being 149 or 150 and fighting a Middleweight.

When Roy Jones weighed 193 for Ruiz, the Cruiserweight division hadn't yet been changed to 200 pounds.

I'm getting off topic here though. Your opinion of whether or not he's over or underrated seems pretty well accurate.