Jack Johnson vs John Ruiz

[DrDuke]

12 rounds, prime vs prime.

The Galveston Giant was often winning because of his size and inside hustling abilities, but he wouldn't have the size advantage against the ultimate hugging machine of the HW history, John Ruiz.

Just to note, Johnson was 6′ 0½″ and his weight was changing from 190 to 225 lbs in his best fighting years, while John Ruiz was 6′ 2″ and was appearing with the weight about 225-240 lbs in his championship years.

Whom would you pick to win, how and why?

[gilgamesh]

Johnson with supreme confidence. When you watch old fights clinches, and fighting in clinches is a lot more common then than it is now. The referee would hardly even separate the fighters, he'd just let them fight out of it. Johnson would have more tricks in the clinches, and was just significantly better in every other category as well.

I think Jack would win by KO, and I think it'd be one sided.

Of course there aren't any Legends I'd pick Ruiz over anyhow. He's universally hated by most Boxing fans for being as dull as dull gets.

Maybe some other Contenders or middle of the road types he could do well against, but anybody that has a legit argument to be a Top 50 all time Heavyweight. No Ruiz ain't beating someone like that.

[DrDuke]

Of course there aren't any Legends I'd pick Ruiz over anyhow. He's universally hated by most Boxing fans for being as dull as dull gets.

And not only that. The mofo clearly was backed up by refs and judges "thankfully" to Don King.

[gilgamesh]

Of course there aren't any Legends I'd pick Ruiz over anyhow. He's universally hated by most Boxing fans for being as dull as dull gets.

And not only that. The mofo clearly was backed up by refs and judges "thankfully" to Don King.

The only real, real questionable decision I ever saw him get was against Andrew Golota. I thought Golota deserved that, but to Ruiz's credit I thought he won the last 6 rounds of that bout legitimately, but he was knocked down twice early, and I think had a point deducted as well. So he had a lot of catching up to do, and I didn't think he did it.

The only real Referee interaction I recall was when Randy Newman I think it was kicked his Trainer out of his corner. I legitimately laughed my ass off when that happened.

Same fight I think

Ruiz-Golota is the most entertaining fight he was ever in...well the most entertaining one that lasted anyway. Nothing he was involved in is more entertaining to watch than Tua vs Ruiz. I could watch that 30 times in a row over most any of his other fights.

[DrDuke]

Of course there aren't any Legends I'd pick Ruiz over anyhow. He's universally hated by most Boxing fans for being as dull as dull gets.

And not only that. The mofo clearly was backed up by refs and judges "thankfully" to Don King.

The only real, real questionable decision I ever saw him get was against Andrew Golota. I thought Golota deserved that, but to Ruiz's credit I thought he won the last 6 rounds of that bout legitimately, but he was knocked down twice early, and I think had a point deducted as well. So he had a lot of catching up to do, and I didn't think he did it.

The only real Referee interaction I recall was when Randy Newman I think it was kicked his Trainer out of his corner. I legitimately laughed my ass off when that happened.

Same fight I think

Ruiz-Golota is the most entertaining fight he was ever in...well the most entertaining one that lasted anyway. Nothing he was involved in is more entertaining to watch than Tua vs Ruiz. I could watch that 30 times in a row over most any of his other fights.

Yeah, Golota was clearly robbed there. And it was exactly that fight, where Ruiz' crazy coach was DQed.

Among the other pro-Ruiz robberies I'd name the 3rd Holyfield fight, the Rahman bout. Also, in the bout against Kirk Johnson there was a terrible pro-Ruiz refereeing. Johnson was DQed for low blows, but Ruiz was headbutting there and hugging especially excessive. Actually, I'd take the points from him for an excessive holding in all these bouts: vs Holy, vs Rahman, vs Golota, vs Johnson.

I remember anti-Ruiz judging only in the Valuev bouts, as Valuev appeared to be a new cash cow. Even Don King said something like "Germany will win", when he was asked to predict Ruiz-Valuev, if I recall it correctly.

Talking about exciting Ruiz bouts, yeah, there're not many of such. The Jones and Toney fights were the best, that went the full-distance. The Golota bout was the best full-distance bout Ruiz won (at least on the cards). And the Tua fight was the best overall indeed. I also like the Haye bout, Ruiz was whooped and sent to the retirement there.

[gilgamesh]

And not only that. The mofo clearly was backed up by refs and judges "thankfully" to Don King.

The only real, real questionable decision I ever saw him get was against Andrew Golota. I thought Golota deserved that, but to Ruiz's credit I thought he won the last 6 rounds of that bout legitimately, but he was knocked down twice early, and I think had a point deducted as well. So he had a lot of catching up to do, and I didn't think he did it.

The only real Referee interaction I recall was when Randy Newman I think it was kicked his Trainer out of his corner. I legitimately laughed my ass off when that happened.

Same fight I think

Ruiz-Golota is the most entertaining fight he was ever in...well the most entertaining one that lasted anyway. Nothing he was involved in is more entertaining to watch than Tua vs Ruiz. I could watch that 30 times in a row over most any of his other fights.

Yeah, Golota was clearly robbed there. And it was exactly that fight, where Ruiz' crazy coach was DQed.

Among the other pro-Ruiz robberies I'd name the 3rd Holyfield fight, the Rahman bout. Also, in the bout against Kirk Johnson there was a terrible pro-Ruiz refereeing. Johnson was DQed for low blows, but Ruiz was headbutting there and hugging especially excessive. Actually, I'd take the points from him for an excessive holding in all these bouts: vs Holy, vs Rahman, vs Golota, vs Johnson.

I remember anti-Ruiz judging only in the Valuev bouts, as Valuev appeared to be a new cash cow. Even Don King said something like "Germany will win", when he was asked to predict Ruiz-Valuev, if I recall it correctly.

Talking about exciting Ruiz bouts, yeah, there're not many of such. The Jones and Toney fights were the best, that went the full-distance. The Golota bout was the best full-distance bout Ruiz won (at least on the cards). And the Tua fight was the best overall indeed. I also like the Haye bout, Ruiz was whooped and sent to the retirement there.

I thought Holyfield deserved the nod in their 3rd bout, but only by 115-113 so I didn't think the draw was necessarily unfair.

I thought Rahman deserved it initially as well, but I watched it back later, and had Ruiz winning.

The Kirk Johnson fight was a f*cking mess. I do think Ruiz lost a point against Johnson if I recall, but yeah Johnson was finally DQ'd for a lot of low blows. I recall one of the headbutts coming when Ruiz was mad that he had been low blowed, and retaliated immediately right in front of the ref. That might've been when he got a point deducted against him. I don't remember real well. I haven't watched that fight since it happened, and you'd have to pay me to watch it again

I could see taking points from him for holding, it probably did happen in some fights. I personally wouldn't DQ a guy for holding though, unless he just absolutely refused to let go. Like Jesse Ferguson against Tyson for instance. Where the ref needed a goddamn crowbar to separate 'em

[DrDuke]

I could see taking points from him for holding, it probably did happen in some fights. I personally wouldn't DQ a guy for holding though, unless he just absolutely refused to let go. Like Jesse Ferguson against Tyson for instance. Where the ref needed a goddamn crowbar to separate 'em

I'd say, he should have been taken points and then DQed in a case of continuing to hold excessively.

[gilgamesh]

I could see taking points from him for holding, it probably did happen in some fights. I personally wouldn't DQ a guy for holding though, unless he just absolutely refused to let go. Like Jesse Ferguson against Tyson for instance. Where the ref needed a goddamn crowbar to separate 'em

I'd say, he should have been taken points and then DQed in a case of continuing to hold excessively.

I wouldn't DQ a guy for excessive holding personally. Unless they don't let go when you try to break 'em apart. Which I've only seen once.

It's boring. It sucks, but I wouldn't DQ anybody over it because it's just not a satisfying conclusion to a fight.

[DrDuke]

I could see taking points from him for holding, it probably did happen in some fights. I personally wouldn't DQ a guy for holding though, unless he just absolutely refused to let go. Like Jesse Ferguson against Tyson for instance. Where the ref needed a goddamn crowbar to separate 'em

I'd say, he should have been taken points and then DQed in a case of continuing to hold excessively.

I wouldn't DQ a guy for excessive holding personally. Unless they don't let go when you try to break 'em apart. Which I've only seen once.

It's boring. It sucks, but I wouldn't DQ anybody over it because it's just not a satisfying conclusion to a fight.

And watching such fights isn't just dissatisfying, but f*cking painful.

[AntonioMartin]

I like Ruiz but Jack Johnson was in another league. Johnson by late tko or wide ud.

[AntonioMartin]

[/quote]

Talking about exciting Ruiz bouts, yeah, there're not many of such. The Jones and Toney fights were the best, that went the full-distance. The Golota bout was the best full-distance bout Ruiz won (at least on the cards). And the Tua fight was the best overall indeed. I also like the Haye bout, Ruiz was whooped and sent to the retirement there.
[/quote]

I actually felt Holyfield 2 was a great fight,....but maybe I was just excited about the possibility of having the first Puerto Rican and Hispanic world Heavyweight champion crowned...

[margaret thatcher]

So much hugging in this one that they'd basically be making love, cover your eyes kids

[DrDuke]

So much hugging in this one that they'd basically be making love, cover your eyes kids